Wednesday, May 22, 2013
council@muc.xmpp.org
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XMPP Council Room | http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/xsf/xmpp-council/ | Room logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/council/ | https://trello.com/b/ww7zWMlI/xmpp-council-agenda

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[14:58:37] <m&m> hola
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[15:01:49] <stpeter> la la la
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[15:03:39] <Kev> One more minute.
[15:04:04] <Kev> I'm going to quickly wash my hands, and then will be here!
[15:04:40] <Kev> Right. I'm here.
[15:04:47] <Kev> 1) Roll call.
[15:05:04] <m&m> presente
[15:05:31] <Tobias> here
[15:05:39] <ralphm> ping
[15:05:54] <Kev> I've poked MattJ.
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[15:06:28] <Kev> And he's on his way, excellent.
[15:06:41] <MattJ> and he's here
[15:06:45] <Kev> Magic.
[15:06:53] <Kev> So I think our only item for today is the one from list.
[15:07:10] <Tobias> yay
[15:07:12] <Kev> 2) Last call for Real Time Text?
[15:07:29] <Kev> The amount of AOLing on the list was a little distracting.
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[15:07:39] <Tobias> AOLing?
[15:07:49] <Kev> "Me too"
[15:07:53] <m&m> yeah
[15:07:54] <Tobias> ahh
[15:08:00] <Kev> Posts just agreeing with the person above, without adding anything to the discussion.
[15:08:00] <stpeter> m2
[15:08:23] <MattJ> Heh
[15:08:29] <Peter Waher> Hello. Present if anybody has questions
[15:08:29] <Kev> Anyway.
[15:08:30] <m&m> +1 to last call … and not simply to make the m2's stop!
[15:08:33] <MattJ> I'm +1 to LC
[15:08:33] <Kev> I'm not opposed to LCing it.
[15:08:37] <Tobias> is that somehow related to AOL corp?
[15:08:46] <Kev> Tobias: Users in the early days of AOL.
[15:08:47] <MattJ> Tobias, yes
[15:08:49] <Tobias> i'm +1 on the LC
[15:08:55] <Tobias> ahh
[15:09:13] <ralphm> +1
[15:09:18] <Kev> I think that's everyone.
[15:09:37] <Kev> I think I still owe some votes from last meeting, but are there any other voting items for this week that I've missed?
[15:10:04] <ralphm> Not opposed to the previous items.
[15:10:10] <Kev> I didn't notice any other mails fly by (although having had a week off in which I genuinely didn't open my XMPP or mail client all holiday, I might be missing one).
[15:10:28] <stpeter> Kev: good for you!
[15:10:31] <Tobias> i've just send my remaining vote to the list
[15:10:34] <Kev> It was quite remarkable :)
[15:10:37] <stpeter> heh
[15:10:44] <Kev> First time in 9 years that I've done it.
[15:10:49] <Kev> Personal and work email ignored!
[15:10:51] <Kev> Anyway.
[15:10:58] <Kev> If there's nothing else new, I think we're on to 3) Date of next.
[15:11:04] <Lance> Kev: There was http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/jidprep.html that I submitted a while ago that needs to go on the docket
[15:11:05] <Kanchil> Lance: http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/jidprep.html:
XEP-xxxx: JID Prep
[15:11:34] <m&m> re: Date of next meeting — next week works for me
[15:11:36] <Kev> Ah, thanks.
[15:11:40] <Kev> 3) JIDPrep.
[15:11:41] <ralphm> I want to, again, express my regret towards the removal of federation in Google Hangouts.
[15:11:41] <Kev> Accept?
[15:11:51] <Kev> I've, obviously, not read this as I missed the thread.
[15:11:56] <ralphm> Not objecting to JIDPrep
[15:11:58] <MattJ> Accept.
[15:12:00] <m&m> absolutely no objections from me
[15:12:21] <Tobias> +1
[15:12:39] <Kev> OK. I'll read it and not object on list.
[15:12:44] <Kev> 4) Date of next.
[15:12:56] <Peter Waher> question?
[15:13:03] <ralphm> Sure!
[15:13:10] <Kev> Peter Waher: Why is orange jam called marmalade. Also - is it AOB?
[15:13:21] <Peter Waher> :)
[15:13:28] <Peter Waher> Have you been able to discuss the HTTP over XMPP proposal?
[15:13:38] <Kev> Oh, have I missed another ProtoXEP?
[15:13:52] <m&m> it was last meeting … some votes pending
[15:14:01] <Kev> No, we did this last time.
[15:14:08] <Kev> Right, I think my vote is outstanding for that.
[15:14:11] <Tobias> yup
[15:14:31] <Kev> Taking most of the intervening time off hasn't been ideal for getting stuff done.
[15:14:45] <Kev> I'll try and send votes tonight, else tomorrow morning for last week's.
[15:14:53] <Kev> Assuming no-one's going to shoot me for doing it on the 15th day.
[15:15:04] <Peter Waher> thanks :)
[15:15:22] <m&m> so, I would really like to see it moved to <iq type='set'/> before publishing
[15:15:36] <Kev> So, next meeting - I /think/ I can do Wednesday, but I send tentative apologies just in case what I'm doing overruns.
[15:15:47] <m&m> otherwise, I sent comments to standards@ this morning (MDT)
[15:16:00] <m&m> Kev: noted (-:
[15:16:01] <ralphm> m&m: agreed, for methods other than GET/HEAD
[15:16:10] <stpeter> Kev: shall we keep the meeting as scheduled and move if necessary?
[15:16:21] <m&m> I can see a strong case being made to just use 'set' for all HTTP methods
[15:16:36] <Kev> I'm intending to be there, may as well leave it SBTSBC. I'll try to wrap up beforehande.
[15:16:42] <ralphm> m&m: I can't see it, yet.
[15:16:48] <m&m> simplicity, it is technically providing information for processing, etc etc
[15:16:48] <Kev> 5) AOB?
[15:16:55] <Lance> Kev yes AOB
[15:17:03] <m&m> webifying XEP-0156
[15:17:04] <Lance> What is the status for http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0297.html?
[15:17:08] <Kanchil> Lance: http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0297.html?:
XEP-0297: Stanza Forwarding
[15:17:09] <m&m> oh, that
[15:17:23] <Kev> I'm giving a talk on the XSF and the XEP process next Wed at the London realtime thing, if anyone has suggestions (I've obviously not started it yet :))
[15:17:33] <Lance> seems to have fallen through the cracks to get out of last call
[15:17:39] <m&m> yikes
[15:17:47] <Kev> Oh. I thought we'd voted that to Draft.
[15:18:05] <m&m> me to
[15:18:06] <m&m> too
[15:18:18] <Kev> But it seems we voted it to LC 28th Nov, and then didn't touch it again.
[15:18:35] <m&m> ouch
[15:18:41] <Kev> With no feedback on the list.
[15:18:54] <stpeter> hrmph
[15:18:57] <Kev> Oh.
[15:19:01] <Kev> No, there were two LCs by the look of it
[15:19:15] *Lance adds task to write feedback emails
[15:19:17] <ralphm> in any case, this doesn't show in the tally
[15:19:23] <ralphm> http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/xsf/xmpp-council/twelfth-council/
[15:19:24] <Kanchil> ralphm: http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/xsf/xmpp-council/twelfth-council/:
Twelfth Council – The XMPP Standards Foundation
[15:19:39] <Kev> So there was feeback to the first LC, but not the second.
[15:19:50] *m&m adds .todo to respond to LC
[15:19:56] <Kev> Ta.
[15:19:58] <MattJ> Good idea :)
[15:20:09] <Kev> I'll put it on the agenda next week.
[15:20:15] <ralphm> that must be the longest running LC we've had
[15:20:19] <Tobias> heh
[15:20:25] <Kev> AOAOB?
[15:20:30] <MattJ> I'd respond, but though I'm an author I'm not sure I've implemented it anywhere...
[15:20:36] <Kev> MattJ: MAM?
[15:20:41] <Lance> Kev: Updating XEP-0156 for use from browsers
[15:20:44] <MattJ> I haven't implemented MAM, Zash did
[15:20:47] <Kev> Ah.
[15:20:49] <Peter Waher> Kev: Had a small presentation about XSF for IEEE, small presentation: http://www.slideshare.net/peterwaher/xsf
[15:20:51] <Kanchil> Peter Waher: http://www.slideshare.net/peterwaher/xsf:
XSF - XMPP Standards Foundation
[15:20:59] <Kev> Peter Waher: Ta.
[15:21:11] <Kev> Lance: What's the Councilish action on that?
[15:21:19] <m&m> well, is it worth doing in the XSF?
[15:21:23] <ralphm> Kev: what's the audience for the realtime meetup?
[15:21:36] <Kev> ralphm: No idea :D
[15:22:00] <Lance> m&m has the details. mainly is it an action for the XSF to register new Web Link entries, or is that left to the IETF Working Group
[15:22:02] <ralphm> Kev: at least put some note on XSF promoting federation in there
[15:22:23] <Kev> ralphm: Oh, fun thought. Ta.
[15:22:30] <m&m> stpeter: what's required for "Expert Review" at the IETF?
[15:22:40] <stpeter> m&m: it depends on the registry
[15:22:44] *m&m really ought to learn this stuff himself
[15:22:56] <m&m> in our specific case, the .well-known registry, and possibly the link relations registry
[15:23:00] <stpeter> ah
[15:23:10] <ralphm> m&m: I'm sure someone wants to make you a chair of some WG, for experience.
[15:23:21] <stpeter> for well-known, see http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5785
[15:23:22] <Kanchil> stpeter: http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5785:
RFC 5785 - Defining Well-Known Uniform Resource Identifiers (URIs)
[15:23:22] <m&m> heh
[15:23:33] <stpeter> for link relations, see http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5988
[15:23:34] <Kanchil> stpeter: http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc5988:
RFC 5988 - Web Linking
[15:23:49] <stpeter> we happen to know the experts ;-)
[15:23:58] <stpeter> http://www.iana.org/assignments/well-known-uris/well-known-uris.xml and http://www.iana.org/assignments/link-relations/link-relations.xml
[15:24:42] <m&m> right … and a quick glance at RFC5785 seems to require an RFC
[15:24:56] <Kev> So, someone needs to write an RFC, and therefore it's not Councilish? :)
[15:24:58] <m&m> and the same for link relations
[15:25:01] <m&m> I think that settles it
[15:25:12] <m&m> Kev: it would appear to be the case
[15:25:51] <Kev> Excellent AOAOAOAOAOAOAOAOB?
[15:25:55] <ralphm> It is councillish because we give general guidance towards proper venues for standardisation.
[15:25:57] <stpeter> :)
[15:25:59] <ralphm> :-D
[15:26:01] <Tobias> Kev, none from me
[15:26:11] <m&m> no more from me, I don't think (-:
[15:26:15] <Kev> Excellent.
[15:26:15] <MattJ> Let's see if we can come up with OB and overrun 30 minutes to see what happens to Kev
[15:26:28] <m&m> haha
[15:26:31] <Kev> Given what I've got going on this evening, I'll unilaterally end the meeting :p
[15:26:33] <ralphm> Is RealtimeConf planned yet?
[15:26:45] <stpeter> m&m: "Specification Required" != "RFC Required"
[15:26:53] <Kev> So, I think we're done!
[15:26:56] <Kev> Thanks all.
[15:26:58] <ralphm> Kev: what!
[15:27:04] <MattJ> Thanks
[15:27:07] <ralphm> I am asking a question here
[15:27:19] <Kev> ralphm: Realtime conf discussions aren't councilish, so the discussion can happen afterwards :)
[15:27:25] <stpeter> I second the call to end the official part of the meeting
[15:27:36] <ralphm> tsk
[15:27:41] <jabberjocke> I would like to have IoT session on the realtime conf
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[15:27:47] <Kev> Excellent. Thanks all.
[15:27:49] *Kev bangs the gavel.
[15:27:54] <m&m> haha
[15:28:03] <jabberjocke> a question
[15:28:12] <stpeter> jabberjocke: sure!
[15:28:20] <jabberjocke> have you looked at the http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Tech_pages/IoT_systems
[15:28:20] <ralphm> Awesome. I just got an e-mail titled "Concealed Business Proposition"
[15:28:22] <Kanchil> jabberjocke: http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Tech_pages/IoT_systems:
Tech pages/IoT systems - XMPP Wiki
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[15:29:06] <stpeter> jabberjocke: the Realtime Conference is http://www.realtimeconf.com/ -- we will probably hold an XMPP Summit around that time
[15:29:24] <stpeter> jabberjocke: I haven't looked at those pages yet
[15:29:41] <jabberjocke> that would be good to be able to discuss our IoT things
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[15:29:53] <jabberjocke> there is now SleekXMPP implementations done
[15:30:03] <jabberjocke> and clayster is also implementing
[15:30:22] <jabberjocke> I'm in San Francisco contacting stanford berkley etc
[15:30:36] <jabberjocke> to get more feedback
[15:30:38] <ralphm> now he tells me
[15:30:44] <ralphm> I just got back from SF
[15:30:58] <jabberjocke> :(
[15:31:03] <stpeter> ralphm: I hope your trip went well!
[15:31:15] <jabberjocke> sorry to miss you
[15:31:25] <ralphm> stpeter: very well indeed
[15:31:58] <jabberjocke> I sent out on the lists, had a meeting yesterday at a grappa bar very nice :)
[15:32:07] <stpeter> Lance: I suggest we update XEP-0156 to include the .well-known stuff -- or do you think that a separate spec is needed? I'd kind of like to define all the alternative discovery mechanisms in one place
[15:32:10] <stpeter> ralphm: excellent!
[15:32:59] <Lance> stpeter: +1 on keeping it all in one document, as long as it doesn't get too big
[15:33:10] <stpeter> Lance: I don't think it will
[15:33:30] <Lance> ok, then I'll add upating 156 to my list
[15:33:31] <m&m> stpeter: I doubt it
[15:33:49] <m&m> er… s/stepeter://
[15:33:57] <m&m> I doubt it'll get too big
[15:34:43] <m&m> just need some examples
[15:34:50] <jabberjocke> when will a summit be decided?
[15:35:14] <m&m> and the definitions for new host-meta link relations
[15:37:48] <stpeter> jabberjocke: probably when the Realtime Conf is decided -- but we know the people who run that ;-)
[15:37:51] <stpeter> bbiaf
[15:38:59] <jabberjocke> keep me posted would like to open up a IoT track
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[22:45:20] *** MattJ shows as "away"
[22:47:31] *** Tobias shows as "away" and his status message is "Available"
[22:50:53] *** Tobias shows as "online" and his status message is "Available"
[23:01:15] *** Tobias shows as "away" and his status message is "Available"