Wednesday, July 10, 2013
council@muc.xmpp.org
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XMPP Council Room | https://xmpp.org/about/xmpp-standards-foundation#council | Room logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/council/ | https://trello.com/b/ww7zWMlI/xmpp-council-agenda

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[12:56:08] <Kev> Ah. Probably need an agenda.
[12:57:01] <m&m> possibly
[12:57:06] <Kev> http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/message-processing-hints.html
I think I missed this last week.
[12:57:13] <Kev> Also have a new version of chat markers to look at.
[12:57:19] <m&m> oh, he did submit it?
[12:57:33] <Kev> http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/chat-markers.html
[12:57:40] <m&m> yup
[12:57:44] <Kev> Anything else?
[12:58:06] <m&m> I can't think of anything else
[12:58:39] <Kev> Excellent. Just need to poke my head in in a couple of hours, then.
[12:58:46] <Kev> If I haven't expired from heat by then.
[12:58:58] <m&m> http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0132.html
[13:00:28] <Kev> Possibly.
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[14:26:01] <Kev> I'm going to pop out to try to buy a fan, I hope to be back before the meeting.
[14:26:07] <Kev> (But you know where I am if not)
[14:26:20] <m&m> Noted…good luck!
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[14:58:08] <ralphm> hi
[14:58:13] *m&m waves
[14:58:17] <Kev> I return. Please let this help, I'm too young to melt.
[14:58:28] <ralphm> hah
[14:59:06] <ralphm> How warm is it. 25C?
[14:59:29] <Kev> It's about 25 outside, but it's about 28 in the house.
[14:59:48] <Kev> Humid and pretty much no breeze. Yuck.
[14:59:54] <m&m> ugh
[15:00:11] <ralphm> I'm just sitting outside
[15:00:23] <ralphm> nice breeze, too
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[15:05:11] <stpeter> howdy
[15:05:31] <stpeter> it sounds as if folks across the pond are experiencing a bit of hot weather, eh?
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[15:05:58] <ralphm> feels like summer. not complaining
[15:06:32] <m&m> I do lament the lack of Spring we had in Denver this year
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[15:10:24] <Tobias> stpeter, yeah...complaining about sun mid-july :P
[15:11:07] <Kev> I don't like bad weather like this, I want it to go back to being nice again.
[15:11:10] <Kev> Anyway.
[15:11:13] <Kev> 1) Roll call
[15:11:14] <Kev> I'm here!
[15:11:16] <MattJ> Present
[15:11:17] <m&m> presente
[15:11:31] <MattJ> Tobias is so slow
[15:11:44] <Tobias> here
[15:11:45] <ralphm> here
[15:11:54] <Tobias> MattJ, still not the slowest fox
[15:11:57] <MattJ> :)
[15:12:23] <Kev> 2) http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/chat-markers.html
Accept?
[15:12:32] <m&m> no objections
[15:12:45] <ralphm> !-1
[15:12:53] <MattJ> ditto
[15:13:02] <Kev> The banner is OK to keep me happy.
[15:13:34] <Kev> Tobias?
[15:13:43] <Tobias> yay for heuristics
[15:13:48] <Tobias> no objections
[15:14:11] <Kev> 3) http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/message-processing-hints.html
[15:15:01] <MattJ> No objections to accepting as experimental, but I'd like more discussion :)
[15:15:05] <m&m> it's an interesting concept
[15:15:15] <m&m> I need to read it again, but I've no objections to going experimental
[15:15:29] <Kev> I have some comments on it, but not enough to block publishing.
[15:15:40] <Tobias> no detection for support?
[15:15:49] <MattJ> No, because they're only hints
[15:15:59] <MattJ> (my current argument)
[15:16:08] <stpeter> heh
[15:16:11] <MattJ> Arguments can be made in favour of adding support detection
[15:16:13] <ralphm> !-1
[15:16:34] <MattJ> But the point is, as hints, it shouldn't be the end of the world if they aren't adhered to
[15:16:37] <ralphm> I always liked the idea behind AMP
[15:16:41] <Kev> They're hints, and they're hints to multiple parties along the way.
[15:16:46] <Tobias> MattJ, if it's only to your local server feature detection could reduce unneeded traffic...but going over s2s you'll never know if it's supported...altough the server could just strip it
[15:16:47] <MattJ> That too
[15:17:00] <m&m> AMP has some decent concepts, but it's execution is shoddy
[15:17:07] <ralphm> right
[15:17:15] <Kev> 4) Date of next.
[15:17:22] <m&m> really, it should just go away until something actually useful can be made! (-:
[15:17:35] <m&m> RE 2): still ok with next week
[15:17:38] <m&m> er … 4)
[15:17:43] <ralphm> competing specs. FTW
[15:18:02] <stpeter> the great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from...
[15:18:13] <Tobias> is 2) already done?
[15:18:19] <Tobias> i mean 3
[15:18:37] <Kev> I thought nobody objected.
[15:19:01] <ralphm> I'd like to see someone enforce royalties on that phrase. or the XKCD. tired now
[15:19:07] <MattJ> Tobias didn't comment either way
[15:19:13] <Kev> Ah.
[15:19:24] <Kev> I mis-read 'no detection' as 'no objection'. Which is impressive.
[15:19:28] <Kev> Tobias: Do you object?
[15:19:33] <Tobias> nope
[15:19:41] <Kev> Excellent.
[15:19:43] <MattJ> Good ;)
[15:19:43] <stpeter> :)
[15:19:45] <Kev> Everyone OK with next week?
[15:19:51] <ralphm> yeah
[15:19:57] <Tobias> whatever floats your boat
[15:19:59] <m&m> yes
[15:20:10] <MattJ> wfm
[15:20:26] <Kev> 5) AOB?
[15:20:30] <Peter Waher> HTTP over XMPP?
[15:20:42] <Kev> Peter Waher: We did that last week didn't we?
[15:20:55] <ralphm> what do you guys think of http over xmpp uris?
[15:20:58] <Peter Waher> But it was never approved as Experimental and given a number
[15:20:59] <Kev> No-one has objected.
[15:21:13] <stpeter> I haven't caught up on much email this morning, so I haven't read Peter Waher's messages yet
[15:21:19] <Kev> Tobias only didn't object two hours ago :)
[15:21:27] <Peter Waher> Nobody has objected to the actual protocol-part
[15:21:35] <Peter Waher> only the URI-part, which I responded to this morning
[15:22:05] <Kev> ralphm: I think that I'm not yet convinced that httpx is needed, but I could still be talked around.
[15:22:06] <ralphm> Peter Waher, in general that's not what we object to for accepting as XEP
[15:22:49] <Peter Waher> it would be great if it could be made Experimental and given a number
[15:23:02] <ralphm> Peter Waher: patience
[15:23:18] <m&m> just having a number doesn't mean you're done
[15:23:18] <Peter Waher> I'm happy to continue discussion about URI-registration until you're convinced
[15:23:30] <ralphm> we're a fast movin SDO
[15:23:40] <stpeter> heh
[15:23:43] <Peter Waher> :)
[15:24:12] <Peter Waher> Basically I need a number, so I can refer to it in a paper using it...
[15:24:18] <ralphm> the discussion the URIs is orthogonal to the acceptance for publication
[15:24:22] <Peter Waher> That's why I'm nagging
[15:24:43] <Tobias> Peter Waher, can't you refer to HTTP URLs? :)
[15:24:50] <Kev> It'll be 332 won't it? :)
[15:24:54] <ralphm> Peter Waher: bad planning, man :-P
[15:25:02] <stpeter> I will commit to reviewing this spec in detail next week, but until next Monday evening I'll be busy updating Internet-Drafts -- I have way too many to clear out of my queue http://www.arkko.com/tools/allstats/petersaint-andre.html
[15:25:09] <Peter Waher> no, since it uses both http and httpx
[15:25:23] <Kev> Anyway, I think we've moved away from Councilish things here.
[15:25:26] <ralphm> stpeter: take your time
[15:25:28] <Kev> AOAOB?
[15:25:40] <Tobias> none from my side
[15:25:45] <ralphm> nay
[15:25:50] <m&m> I got a verbal notice from the AD sponsoring the XMPP WG
[15:25:57] <ralphm> woot
[15:26:03] <m&m> it looks like he's good with us having the hackfest
[15:26:12] <Tobias> who's the AD?
[15:26:17] <m&m> Richard Barnes
[15:26:21] <Tobias> ahh
[15:26:23] <Tobias> nice
[15:26:27] <m&m> and I think he'll even show up to the hackfest (-:
[15:26:54] <ralphm> heh
[15:26:58] <stpeter> so in any case it sounds as if we can publish the http-over-xmpp proposal (no objections from Council members), correct? but yes we do need to also figure out the URI issue
[15:27:00] <MattJ> The hackfest is separate from IETF, right?
[15:27:07] <Tobias> MattJ, right
[15:27:14] <m&m> it is, but at the same location
[15:27:14] <Kev> stpeter: Correct.
[15:27:22] <stpeter> all righty
[15:27:32] <Kev> Then I think we're done. Thanks all.
[15:27:35] <Tobias> are we done? g2g to another meeting
[15:27:36] *Kev bangs the gavel.
[15:27:38] <Tobias> yay
[15:27:39] <Peter Waher> thanks :)
[15:27:40] <ralphm> stpeter: yeah. I welcome list feedback on that
[15:27:46] *stpeter likes it how Swift pops up toast when your nick is mentioned in a chatroom
[15:27:57] <ralphm> thanks!
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[19:09:50] <stpeter> I'll wait for the minutes to be issued before publishing any new XEPs, methinks
[19:09:55] <stpeter> I'm less likely to make mistakes that way :-)
[19:12:40] <ralphm> heh
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[20:24:40] <ralphm> stpeter: I think you scared him
[20:24:52] <stpeter> perhaps :-)
[20:25:14] <m&m> I understand that fear can be healthy (-:
[20:30:24] <ralphm> as in: good for you health? Definitely. That's why it was invented. To then run.
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