Thursday, October 25, 2012
summit@muc.xmpp.org
October
Mon Tue Wed Thu Fri Sat Sun
1 2 3 4 5 6 7
8 9 10 11 12 13 14
15 16 17
18
19 20 21
22 23
24
25
26
27
28
29
30
31
       
             
XMPP Summit discussion

[00:00:08] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[00:01:28] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[00:02:38] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[00:03:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[00:04:20] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[00:06:38] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[00:08:51] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[00:32:30] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[00:45:49] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[00:45:57] *** stpeter has left the room
[00:46:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[00:47:44] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:26:01] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:28:27] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:30:03] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:31:30] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:32:22] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:33:42] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:34:53] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:39:16] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:40:01] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:42:30] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[05:42:56] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[05:53:21] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[07:14:26] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[07:16:00] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:08:05] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[14:09:31] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:10:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[14:11:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:16:23] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[14:17:38] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:31:42] *** stpeter has joined the room
[14:37:11] *** stpeter changed the title to "http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summit_12"
[14:45:42] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[14:47:19] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:47:42] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[14:48:46] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[14:59:36] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[15:05:21] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[15:19:47] *** stpeter changed the title to "http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summit_12 | remote participation: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7a8d1536d98d4d57a9ebb42f89e771df1757d3d1?authuser=0&hl=en-US"
[15:42:23] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[15:55:54] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[16:07:53] *** stpeter shows as "dnd" and his status message is "XMPP Summit, Portland, Oregon"
[16:08:06] *** Steffen Larsen has joined the room
[16:08:06] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:08:28] <stpeter> hi Steffen
[16:08:33] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:09:01] <Steffen Larsen> hi stpeter
[16:09:07] <Steffen Larsen> is the conf. on?
[16:09:16] <stpeter> we haven't quite started yet
[16:09:27] <stpeter> waiting for people to come upstairs from breakfast
[16:09:29] *** Tobias has joined the room
[16:09:29] *** Tobias shows as "online" and his status message is "Available"
[16:09:30] <Steffen Larsen> ahh ok. shouldn't it be now or ?
[16:09:38] <stpeter> it should be now, yes
[16:09:42] <Steffen Larsen> ahh ok.. here itøs dinner time.
[16:09:48] <Steffen Larsen> it's
[16:09:55] <stpeter> ok, enjoy your dinner
[16:10:11] <Steffen Larsen> thats fine.. I'll take a quick bath and have a dinner. back in 20. is the conf. on then?
[16:10:15] <Steffen Larsen> merci
[16:10:15] <Tobias> stpeter, in retrospect i should have just used hangout on my mobile, i know its mic is working ^^
[16:10:31] <Steffen Larsen> is hangout up and running?
[16:10:37] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, yup
[16:10:57] <Tobias> see subject/topic or https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7a8d1536d98d4d57a9ebb42f89e771df1757d3d1
[16:11:24] <Steffen Larsen> yes. i just followed the link
[16:11:28] <Steffen Larsen> will join in 20 min
[16:12:33] <Tobias> when will the summit start? or when is 9:00 in local time?
[16:13:36] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:18:14] *** Ben Langfeld has joined the room
[16:18:39] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:18:49] <Ben Langfeld> We're just having some network issues here, and we're missing a couple of people, but I figure we'll get started soon.
[16:19:15] *** Lance has joined the room
[16:19:16] *** Lance shows as "online"
[16:20:27] *** stpeter has left the room
[16:20:28] *** stpeter has joined the room
[16:20:32] <Tobias> a link to the mentioned youtube broadcast, if it exist, would be nice too
[16:20:50] <Ben Langfeld> We're using google hangouts right now, I believe.
[16:21:02] <Tobias> yes
[16:21:08] *** stpeter changed the title to "http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summit_12 | remote participation: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/b84e928d04633d26f5902ffcf6a597b4ba7fd3b3?authuser=0&hl=en-US"
[16:21:19] <stpeter> new hangout, got disconnected from the old: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/b84e928d04633d26f5902ffcf6a597b4ba7fd3b3?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[16:23:20] <stpeter> changed it again: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/341b1d71f1b5294d0ef616e0dccee849aa918c1a?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[16:23:41] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:23:49] *** stpeter changed the title to "http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summit_12 | remote participation: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/341b1d71f1b5294d0ef616e0dccee849aa918c1a?authuser=0&hl=en-US"
[16:24:01] <stpeter> I could not figure out the YouTube integration
[16:24:15] <Tobias> ah..ok
[16:24:27] <Ben Langfeld> There's always ustream if all else fails
[16:25:03] *** xnyhps has joined the room
[16:26:33] <Tobias> stpeter, http://support.google.com/youtube/bin/static.py?hl=en&topic=2572818&guide=2572797&page=guide.cs you might already know that....
[16:27:08] *** bear has joined the room
[16:27:19] *** justin has joined the room
[16:27:54] *** Lance has joined the room
[16:27:54] *** Lance shows as "online"
[16:28:43] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:28:47] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:28:52] <bear> any remote folk speak up if they want me to relay questions or items
[16:29:35] *** Michael has joined the room
[16:29:36] *** Michael shows as "online" and his status message is "Abwesend"
[16:29:39] *** m&m has joined the room
[16:29:53] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:33:03] <Steffen Larsen> stpeter: ha ha.. nice summit on hangouts.. can you turn up or something? :-)
[16:33:13] <Steffen Larsen> stpeter: the volume that is
[16:33:45] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:36:08] *** Florob has joined the room
[16:38:47] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:39:04] <bear> it's the microphone on the mac - so the back-of-the-room folks may be low volume
[16:40:12] <Steffen Larsen> we have to get a real mic. :-)
[16:40:33] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:43:50] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:44:49] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:45:19] *** ralphm has joined the room
[16:46:26] *** m&m shows as "dnd" and his status message is "XMPP Summit #12"
[16:47:39] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:48:53] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:49:04] *** justin shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[16:49:13] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:49:39] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:51:21] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:51:23] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[16:51:58] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:53:07] *** Florob shows as "online"
[16:53:12] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:53:23] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:53:54] <xnyhps> Heb, joining the hangout from my phone didn't work very well
[16:53:54] <xnyhps> *Heh
[16:53:55] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[16:54:33] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:54:53] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:54:53] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[16:56:30] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[16:56:55] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:57:00] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:57:02] *** waqas has joined the room
[16:58:24] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[16:58:27] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[16:58:57] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:01:27] *** xnyhps has left the room
[17:01:54] *** xnyhps has joined the room
[17:02:06] *** justin shows as "online"
[17:03:56] <m&m> intro?
[17:04:00] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:04:03] <m&m> I couldn't hear earlier
[17:05:05] <bear> brian beggs from EnerNOC
[17:05:26] <bear> he gave a talk at the realtime conference - it will be up on the internet in a couple of days
[17:05:33] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:05:47] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:06:14] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[17:06:46] *** dwd has joined the room
[17:06:47] *** Zash has joined the room
[17:06:48] *** Zash shows as "online"
[17:07:33] *** Florob shows as "online"
[17:09:02] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:09:05] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[17:09:32] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:09:35] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:10:37] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:11:00] <m&m> (belated) grazé
[17:11:12] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:12:05] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[17:12:13] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:12:26] *** justin shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[17:13:03] <m&m> y'all blinked! (-:
[17:13:27] *** Michal Slaski has joined the room
[17:13:27] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:13:37] <bear> the hangout keeps dropping - peter is adjusting it when we hear the "drop" tone
[17:14:05] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:15:11] *** jack has joined the room
[17:16:34] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:18:17] <bear> Justin from fanout.io
[17:18:26] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:19:07] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:19:27] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:21:36] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:24:10] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:25:06] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:25:39] *** Steffen Larsen has left the room
[17:26:38] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:26:43] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:27:18] *** Steffen Larsen has joined the room
[17:27:18] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:28:01] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[17:29:36] *** Steffen Larsen has left the room
[17:29:42] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[17:30:45] *** Steffen Larsen has joined the room
[17:30:45] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:30:54] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:31:13] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[17:31:31] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:31:40] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:32:26] *** justin shows as "xa" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[17:32:57] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:33:04] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:34:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:34:15] *** justin shows as "online"
[17:35:46] <m&m> could you tilt the screen back a little … he's headless (-:
[17:35:50] *** Michael shows as "away" and his status message is "Abwesend"
[17:36:01] <bear> how is that?
[17:36:02] <m&m> grazé!
[17:36:33] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:36:42] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:36:45] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:36:54] <bear> I couldn't get his name, but he is from Erlang Solutions
[17:37:01] <m&m> /nod
[17:37:03] *** Florob shows as "online"
[17:37:36] <jack> michal slaski
[17:37:46] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:38:31] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:38:31] <MattJ> !xep 286
[17:38:35] <bear> xep-198
[17:39:01] <bear> XEP-0238: XMPP Protocol Flows for Inter-Domain Federation
[17:39:11] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:39:11] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:39:34] <dwd> XEP-0286 is Mobile XMPP summary, basically. Power level background, and suggestions for implementations.
[17:39:57] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:40:53] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:41:35] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:41:45] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:41:59] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:42:03] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:42:03] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:42:57] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:44:46] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:45:03] <Steffen Larsen> dammit we could use a real mic for the summit.. it's really hard to hear anything remotely.. :-)
[17:45:49] <bear> we are turning the camera to make the mic better
[17:45:58] <Steffen Larsen> bear: merci!
[17:46:04] <bear> they are talking about transmit delay for bosh
[17:46:19] <dwd> We have a real Mike, if that helps.
[17:46:24] <bear> please do speak up if you want to add
[17:46:34] <bear> :)
[17:46:38] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:46:46] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:47:05] <Steffen Larsen> yeah!.. can't at the moment, screaming baby, food etc. :-)
[17:47:52] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:48:04] <bear> ahh
[17:48:39] <bear> peter is adding to the whiteboard the items that need to be brought up at the bosh session
[17:49:56] *** jack shows as "online"
[17:50:03] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[17:50:25] *** Tobias has left the room
[17:51:04] <bear> pirate pad http://piratepad.net/05gvwTiPKT
[17:51:12] <bear> i'll be adding what is on the whiteboard to it
[17:51:40] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:51:48] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[17:52:32] *** Michal Slaski shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[17:52:32] *** Michal Slaski shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[17:53:01] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[17:53:53] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[17:53:58] *** jack shows as "online"
[17:54:50] *** xnyhps has left the room
[17:55:48] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[17:56:41] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[17:56:50] *** Michal Slaski shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[17:57:10] <bear> jack is setting up the projector for a presentation
[17:58:17] *** tofu has joined the room
[17:58:17] *** tofu shows as "online"
[17:58:36] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[17:59:25] *** tofu shows as "online"
[18:00:29] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[18:00:30] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[18:00:50] *** tofu has left the room
[18:01:24] *** tofu has joined the room
[18:01:44] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:01:52] *** Michal Slaski shows as "online"
[18:03:21] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[18:03:53] <stpeter> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/341b1d71f1b5294d0ef616e0dccee849aa918c1a?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[18:03:56] *** Michal Slaski has left the room
[18:04:24] <waqas> The link is in the room subject
[18:05:41] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:06:46] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:06:48] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:08:03] <bear> Jack is starting his presentation
[18:08:42] <bear> ralph is standing in front of jack with a tablet of the google hangout - jack is being very distracted by it :)
[18:09:09] <Zash> ha
[18:11:01] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:11:49] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:12:00] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:13:00] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:13:33] <Ben Langfeld> http://www.html5gamedevelopment.org/StateofHTML5GameDevelopment
[18:14:39] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:14:57] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[18:16:18] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:16:41] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:16:51] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:17:22] *** tofu shows as "online"
[18:18:27] *** justin shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[18:18:37] *** Michael shows as "online" and his status message is "Abwesend"
[18:18:57] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[18:19:03] *** tofu shows as "online"
[18:19:33] <tofu> Ben Langfeld: I was just looking at that :)
[18:19:39] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:20:18] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:21:53] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:22:38] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:23:00] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:24:01] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:24:04] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:25:05] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:25:45] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:26:45] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:26:50] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:26:55] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:27:10] *** Tobias has joined the room
[18:28:07] *** justin shows as "online"
[18:29:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:29:35] <stpeter> http://metajack.im/tmp/crowdball/client.html
[18:30:57] <jack> http://github.com/talkto/crowdball
[18:31:34] *** ralphm has left the room
[18:31:58] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:33:15] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:33:16] *** ralphm has joined the room
[18:35:11] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[18:35:28] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:35:58] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[18:36:07] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:37:00] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:39:12] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[18:39:20] <ralphm> http://display.ik.nu/xmpp
[18:40:35] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[18:40:50] *** Florob shows as "online"
[18:40:54] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:41:02] *** jack shows as "online"
[18:41:42] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:41:59] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[18:42:02] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:42:46] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:43:31] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:43:51] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[18:45:39] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:45:48] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:47:03] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:47:04] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:48:19] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:52:06] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:52:16] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:52:46] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:53:08] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[18:53:47] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:54:13] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[18:56:00] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[18:56:18] *** Michael has left the room
[18:57:01] *** Florob shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Nicht verfügbar wegen Untätigkeit seit mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[18:57:08] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[18:59:54] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[18:59:56] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:00:33] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:00:36] *** tofu has left the room
[19:00:37] *** tofu has joined the room
[19:01:24] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:02:10] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:02:37] *** winfried has joined the room
[19:03:14] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:04:19] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:04:28] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:07:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:07:12] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:08:04] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:10:28] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:12:15] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:12:16] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:12:17] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:12:36] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[19:13:33] *** m&m has left the room
[19:13:36] *** m&m has joined the room
[19:13:48] *** Lance shows as "away"
[19:13:55] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:14:57] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:15:02] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:16:14] <MattJ> ~/prosody/trunk$ wc -l plugins/mod_{message,presence}.lua
85 plugins/mod_message.lua
378 plugins/mod_presence.lua
[19:16:17] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:16:19] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:17:15] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:17:17] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:18:19] *** Lance shows as "online"
[19:18:59] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:19:17] <m&m> lunch!
[19:20:22] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:20:43] <bear> yes! lunch!
[19:20:55] <winfried> lunch? just had dinner ;-)
[19:21:17] <m&m> (-:
[19:21:22] <bear> silly EU folks
[19:22:16] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:22:18] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:22:20] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:22:48] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:23:10] <m&m> I also humbly request y'all avoid summit topics in the lunchtime conversations (-:
[19:23:12] <dwd> lunch... mmmmm....
[19:23:29] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:23:37] *** Zash shows as "away"
[19:23:47] <bear> I will try to cancel any deep conversations
[19:23:52] <dwd> m&m, we'll just talk about you.
[19:23:57] <m&m> that works
[19:24:15] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[19:24:36] <m&m> dwd: I know you're jealous of my hair and beard
[19:25:19] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:25:30] *m&m goes to make a panini
[19:25:32] <dwd> I am, it's true.
[19:25:56] *** winfried shows as "away" and his status message is "sssttt... my computer fell asleep"
[19:26:00] *** winfried shows as "online" and his status message is "Doing too much at once, so you might chat with me as well... ;-)"
[19:26:02] <Steffen Larsen> stpeter is really hungry… ha ha
[19:26:25] <Steffen Larsen> thanks bear.. didn't notice!
[19:26:51] <winfried> hi peter...
[19:26:58] <stpeter> hi!
[19:27:02] <winfried> seems to be a hickup
[19:27:07] <stpeter> I think your video/audio froze :)
[19:27:14] <winfried> just did, yes
[19:27:22] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:27:30] <stpeter> Steffen Larsen: actually I can go without lunch, but Dave Cridland was complaining :)
[19:27:39] <Steffen Larsen> stpeter: ha ha, ok
[19:27:49] <Steffen Larsen> stpeter: just look determined..
[19:28:12] *** Zash shows as "online"
[19:28:19] <Steffen Larsen> its not the skype codec..
[19:28:58] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:30:15] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:30:22] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:31:17] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:31:21] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:32:24] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:32:28] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:35:08] *** Florob shows as "online"
[19:35:19] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:36:25] *** Michael has joined the room
[19:36:26] *** Michael shows as "online" and his status message is "Abwesend"
[19:37:10] *** justin shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[19:37:26] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:37:48] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[19:37:49] *** Michael has left the room
[19:41:22] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:41:22] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:42:29] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:42:38] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[19:42:41] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[19:45:43] *** Lance shows as "away"
[19:47:14] *** winfried shows as "away" and his status message is "sssttt... my computer fell asleep"
[19:47:17] *** winfried shows as "online" and his status message is "Doing too much at once, so you might chat with me as well... ;-)"
[19:47:32] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:49:29] *** bear has left the room
[19:51:46] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[19:52:34] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:52:43] *** jack shows as "online"
[19:52:43] *** jack shows as "online"
[19:52:48] *** Lance shows as "online"
[19:52:48] *** bear has joined the room
[19:54:30] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:55:14] *** pushp has joined the room
[19:55:39] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:56:23] <pushp> Hi - joining late. Is there a video stream?
[19:56:30] <Ben Langfeld> check the topic
[19:56:33] <Ben Langfeld> google hangout
[19:56:35] <Steffen Larsen> there is a hangout
[19:56:38] <Steffen Larsen> topic
[19:56:50] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[19:57:10] *** justin shows as "xa" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[19:57:37] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[19:57:48] *** stpeter shows as "xa" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[19:57:54] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[19:59:07] <ralphm> Florian linked me to this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MyguMuZnHoc at 00:12
[20:01:46] <winfried> I try to rejoin the hangout, but I get the message that the hangout is over...
[20:02:39] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:02:54] <Steffen Larsen> winfried: you have to click "yes" that you are still there in the hangout.
[20:03:12] <Steffen Larsen> irritating.. but..
[20:04:41] <winfried> don't see the option at my google+ app for android... :-(
[20:05:12] *** bear has left the room
[20:06:48] *** Florob shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Nicht verfügbar wegen Untätigkeit seit mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[20:07:41] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:07:59] <Steffen Larsen> ohh prob. a small bug. ;-)
[20:08:09] <Steffen Larsen> its there on a normal browser
[20:08:22] <winfried> I am back, but audio only
[20:08:36] *** bear has joined the room
[20:09:04] <winfried> I have to apologize Stefan Strigler: I just got word he can't make it today
[20:09:41] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[20:11:28] <winfried> can somebody mirror the topic list?
[20:11:31] <bear> http://piratepad.net/05gvwTiPKT
[20:11:44] <bear> I am mirroring the pad peter is writing on
[20:12:14] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[20:12:28] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[20:12:34] <Steffen Larsen> bear: cool
[20:12:44] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:12:50] <dwd> That URI asks me if I want to create the pad. :-/
[20:13:00] <dwd> I guess it won't work on Android's Chrome or something.
[20:13:01] <bear> hmm
[20:13:11] <m&m> bear: double-you eff em
[20:13:33] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[20:13:36] <bear> ???
[20:13:46] <m&m> works for me (wfm)
[20:13:49] <dwd> Huh. Nor on the (old) Android Browser. Ah, well.
[20:13:51] <bear> ahh
[20:13:52] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[20:14:18] <bear> list as it stands:
[20:14:19] <bear> 1. BOSH vs WebSocket
2. XMPP over WebSocket
3. batch / buffer size
4. General BOSH cleanup
5. Session attachment
6. Shared BOSH / WebSocket

[20:14:24] *** Florob shows as "online"
[20:15:14] *** Zash has joined the room
[20:15:15] *** Zash shows as "online"
[20:15:16] <dwd> bear, It's OK, I can just read the flipchart from here, I just wanted to help type.
[20:15:40] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[20:15:56] <bear> I keep forgetting some are in the room - brain is having trouble linking nicks here with real-life folk
[20:16:12] <pushp> Is this still the hangout URL? https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/7a8d1536d98d4d57a9ebb42f89e771df1757d3d1 ? Says event ended.
[20:16:39] <waqas> pushp: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/341b1d71f1b5294d0ef616e0dccee849aa918c1a?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[20:16:39] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[20:16:52] <stpeter> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/341b1d71f1b5294d0ef616e0dccee849aa918c1a?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[20:17:28] <pushp> Thanks waqas, stpeter
[20:17:43] <m&m> I missed about 45 seconds of that conversation
[20:17:46] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:18:16] <bear> they are talking about the edge case that involves bosh receiving two requests with the same RID
[20:18:29] <bear> and trying to find out what current implementations are doing to handle it
[20:21:44] *** Ben Langfeld has left the room
[20:21:47] <winfried> and we have come to a conclusion?
[20:21:57] *** Ben Langfeld has joined the room
[20:21:58] <m&m> OpenFire must die?
[20:22:06] <Zash> Yes!
[20:22:09] <winfried> ....no comment
[20:22:48] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:25:06] <Zash> Did you manage to get the feed onto something that doesn't require a google account to see?
[20:27:14] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[20:27:25] <winfried> getting very choppy sound
[20:27:51] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:28:25] <winfried> lost it here...
[20:28:33] *** jack has left the room
[20:31:06] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[20:31:13] *** tofu has left the room
[20:31:18] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[20:32:03] *** jack has joined the room
[20:32:15] *** Florob shows as "online"
[20:32:54] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:33:30] <jack> The solution we discussed for dupe RID was to return <body/> for the original request, discard data for the incoming duplicate request, and begin holding it.
[20:33:54] <winfried> thanks jack
[20:34:19] <jack> (sorry for delay. had wifi problems for a bit)
[20:34:32] <waqas> One solution we discussed before was: auth with SASL, using the session cookie/token as password.
[20:35:21] <waqas> The web application becomes the SASL service which the XMPP server talks with, and the client need not go through the web app
[20:36:11] *** tofu has joined the room
[20:37:22] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[20:37:36] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[20:37:56] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:38:41] *** bear has left the room
[20:40:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[20:40:24] *** jack has left the room
[20:40:52] *** jack has joined the room
[20:41:12] *** ralphm has left the room
[20:41:31] *** bear has joined the room
[20:41:35] <m&m> choppy
[20:41:58] <winfried> beyond choppy.. disconnected
[20:42:25] <bear> yea, the wifi is getting busy here
[20:42:27] *** justin shows as "online"
[20:42:59] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:43:17] <m&m> lost audio
[20:43:40] <bear> MattJ bamf'd to a foreword seat
[20:43:50] <dwd> We have got two cameras going, could explain it - is anyone using Ralph's roving Nexus 7 cam?
[20:43:56] <bear> reconnect - the audio is working to others
[20:45:02] <m&m> dropping and rejoining
[20:45:13] <bear> everything dropped - reconnecting
[20:45:22] *** jack has left the room
[20:45:31] *** jack has joined the room
[20:46:12] <Steffen Larsen> wtf happened… well back again
[20:46:15] *** ralphm has joined the room
[20:46:20] <winfried> now I am all alone in the hangout...
[20:46:26] <Steffen Larsen> ha ha
[20:46:27] <bear> our side dropped - we had to reconnect
[20:46:32] <m&m> I rejoined
[20:46:35] <Steffen Larsen> I can see the others
[20:46:45] <winfried> maybe I am dropped again...
[20:46:51] <winfried> *sigh*
[20:46:57] <m&m> ouch
[20:47:20] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[20:47:21] <waqas> We have some implementations of that by the way. I can't recall, but it was probably Prosody's mod_auth_phpbb3, mod_auth_wordpress, etc.
[20:47:57] *** jack shows as "online"
[20:48:01] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:48:05] <winfried> of 'that' is: SASL external with the session id of the webapplication?
[20:48:23] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[20:48:44] <m&m> ask ralph to try landscape … it might provide a less squeezed view
[20:49:23] <waqas> We just used SASL PLAIN, with password=wordpress-auth-token. mod_auth_wordpress+Wordpress was an external SASL handler. No modification to the XMPP server or BOSH component.
[20:50:02] <m&m> better
[20:50:24] <m&m> ¡gracias Ralph!
[20:51:15] <waqas> What Matthew Wild suggested also works across browsers (user has app open in multiple browsers/devices)
[20:52:37] *** Florob shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Nicht verfügbar wegen Untätigkeit seit mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[20:52:43] *** jack shows as "online"
[20:53:03] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:53:03] <m&m> audio is super faint
[20:53:24] <m&m> and some extra feedback
[20:54:26] <m&m> I can't hear y'all
[20:54:41] <m&m> yikes
[20:54:55] <Steffen Larsen> WTF
[20:55:00] <m&m> STAHP
[20:55:00] <Steffen Larsen> auuuch
[20:55:05] <Steffen Larsen> sound is f****
[20:58:07] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[20:59:08] *** tofu shows as "online"
[20:59:18] *** Lance shows as "away"
[21:01:28] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:01:33] <MattJ> waqas: iirc you were originally on the shared-BOSH side :)
[21:01:38] <winfried> I missed the start of this discussion, was there discussed what would be the best level to solve this
[21:01:50] <winfried> ?
[21:01:54] *** tofu shows as "online"
[21:02:14] *** Lance shows as "online"
[21:02:42] <waqas> MattJ: I was. I was also on the session-unbind support side.
[21:02:44] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:02:53] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:03:09] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[21:03:22] <tofu> unbind?
[21:04:15] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:05:03] <waqas> tofu: Multiple sessions on the same (BOSH) stream. You can ignore that :)
[21:05:48] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[21:08:11] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[21:08:54] *** bear has left the room
[21:09:28] *** pushp shows as "away" and his status message is "Away as a result of idle."
[21:09:39] *** pushp shows as "online"
[21:10:31] <m&m> ralphm: don't quit your dayjob to be a camera operator (-:
[21:10:49] <m&m> I'm a little dizzy now (-:
[21:11:40] *** Florob shows as "online"
[21:13:14] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[21:13:25] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[21:13:29] <dwd> m&m, Ralph says his arm got tired.
[21:14:16] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:16:50] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:17:02] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:18:17] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[21:19:07] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:19:40] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:19:58] *** bear has joined the room
[21:21:26] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:21:50] <Steffen Larsen> can't manage any more guys.. I'm off to bed. See you guys tomorrow!
[21:21:56] <dwd> nn
[21:21:59] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:22:07] <Steffen Larsen> nighty nighty! :-)
[21:22:07] <MattJ> 'night
[21:22:09] <winfried> nn
[21:23:20] *** Steffen Larsen shows as "online"
[21:23:27] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[21:23:31] *** Lance shows as "away"
[21:24:28] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:25:11] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:25:36] *** Lance shows as "online"
[21:26:12] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:26:14] *** Steffen Larsen has left the room
[21:26:22] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[21:27:50] *** pushp has left the room
[21:27:55] *** pushp has joined the room
[21:29:24] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:30:06] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:30:44] *** jack shows as "online"
[21:30:51] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:30:54] *** tofu has left the room
[21:30:55] *** tofu has joined the room
[21:31:00] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:31:47] <bear> http://caniuse.com/sharedworkers
[21:32:11] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[21:32:12] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[21:33:10] *** Dave has joined the room
[21:33:16] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:33:37] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:34:02] *** Florob shows as "away" and his status message is " (Abwesend wegen Untätigkeit für mehr als 15 Minuten)"
[21:34:12] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[21:34:15] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[21:34:19] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[21:34:29] <waqas> Shared streaming documents. Client logs in, indicates what categories of documents it's interested in (MUC rooms, etc), servers sends all current state, and streams updates. :)
[21:35:10] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[21:35:13] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:35:38] <waqas> This is exactly what the roster protocol does
[21:35:50] *** Dave shows as "online"
[21:36:13] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:36:24] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[21:37:05] <winfried> so... the idea is now a 'session proxy'...?
[21:37:14] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:37:30] <waqas> One of the ideas
[21:38:52] *** Dave shows as "online"
[21:39:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:40:12] <winfried> brb
[21:40:18] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[21:41:06] <tofu> ralphm: https://www.erlang-solutions.com/products/mongooseim-massively-scalable-ejabberd-platform
[21:43:02] <m&m> brb - bb
[21:43:25] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[21:45:13] *** winfried shows as "away" and his status message is "sssttt... my computer fell asleep"
[21:45:48] *** winfried shows as "online" and his status message is "Doing too much at once, so you might chat with me as well... ;-)"
[21:54:00] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[21:54:03] *** Lance shows as "away"
[21:54:29] *** Lance shows as "online"
[21:55:19] *** Zash has left the room
[21:56:45] *** Dave shows as "online"
[21:57:44] <bear> Michal Slaski from Erlang Solutions
[21:58:25] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[21:58:57] <tofu> https://github.com/esl/ejabberd
[21:59:44] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:00:15] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:00:45] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:00:57] <tofu> jack: ^
[22:01:21] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:02:28] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:03:34] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:03:52] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:05:05] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:05:40] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:06:48] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:08:14] *** winfried shows as "away" and his status message is "sssttt... my computer fell asleep"
[22:08:18] *** winfried shows as "online" and his status message is "Doing too much at once, so you might chat with me as well... ;-)"
[22:08:41] <m&m> are there slides?
[22:08:44] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:08:59] <m&m> (-:
[22:09:07] <bear> :)
[22:09:55] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:12:56] *** pushp has left the room
[22:13:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:14:00] *** stpeter shows as "xa" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[22:14:11] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:14:17] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:14:17] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:14:59] *** pushp has joined the room
[22:15:22] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:15:46] *** Tobias has left the room
[22:15:57] *** Tobias has joined the room
[22:16:22] *** Tobias has left the room
[22:17:08] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:18:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:18:43] *** Tobias has joined the room
[22:18:44] *** Tobias shows as "online" and his status message is "Available"
[22:18:57] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:19:22] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:19:58] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:20:10] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:21:10] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:22:51] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:23:42] *** jack shows as "online"
[22:24:35] *** tofu shows as "online"
[22:25:00] *** jack shows as "online"
[22:26:34] *** tofu shows as "online"
[22:26:45] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:28:58] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:29:39] *waqas notes that ejabberd's BOSH doesn't support HTTP Connection:Keep-Alive
[22:30:10] <Tobias> of course not
[22:30:32] <tofu> why would you want that? ;)
[22:30:35] <waqas> Which badly hurts BOSH performance
[22:30:49] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:30:49] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:31:05] <Tobias> if you want long connections, why don't you use normal TCP? :P
[22:31:54] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:32:42] <MattJ> Tobias: Because the W3C+IETF wouldn't let us
[22:33:17] <Tobias> yeah...that bad IETF :) aron didn't bash about w3c a bit....didn't they have their fingers in oauth too?
[22:33:40] <waqas> You can't blame them. Raw TCP isn't WebScale.
[22:33:41] <MattJ> He said most stuff went wrong under the IETF
[22:33:55] <Tobias> waqas, only node is webscale
[22:34:42] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:34:47] <Tobias> doesn't w3c have even more coporate participation than ietf?
[22:35:54] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:37:28] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:37:28] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:39:25] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:42:45] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:43:10] *** jack shows as "online"
[22:43:25] *** Dave shows as "online"
[22:44:35] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:48:10] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[22:48:31] <waqas> There's Tigase, with their pseudo-XML parser :)
[22:50:32] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:51:54] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:52:17] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:53:40] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:55:25] <winfried> ;-)
[22:55:37] <winfried> btw sorry for forgetting to mute myself after relogging in
[22:55:38] <m&m> I need to drop out … could you post the followup discussions on the list before you all adjourn?
[22:55:47] <bear> sure can
[22:55:52] <winfried> great!
[22:56:25] *** m&m has left the room
[22:56:48] *** m&m has joined the room
[22:57:06] *** m&m shows as "online"
[22:57:08] *** m&m has left the room
[22:57:52] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[22:58:56] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[22:59:31] *** jack shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[22:59:34] *** jack shows as "online"
[23:00:21] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:00:21] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:01:49] *** Lance shows as "away"
[23:01:57] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:03:43] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:04:07] <winfried> I remember a blog by Jack on translating it...
[23:05:28] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:05:32] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:05:32] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:05:33] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:05:35] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[23:05:36] *** Ben Langfeld shows as "online"
[23:05:36] *** justin shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[23:05:57] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:06:06] <jack> http://metajack.im/2010/02/01/json-versus-xml-not-as-simple-as-you-think/
[23:06:23] <jack> JSON-LD supposedly solves the namespacing issue
[23:06:32] <jack> but the array vs. non-array thing is not as easy
[23:06:37] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:06:40] <winfried> yep
[23:07:11] <jack> or perhaps i don't know enough about json-ld
[23:07:29] <jack> i should probably write a version 2 of that blog comparing it against json-ld
[23:08:26] <jack> http://json-ld.org/spec/latest/
[23:10:01] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:10:01] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:10:04] <winfried> client side serializing/deserializing? makes me shiver...
[23:10:10] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:10:10] <MattJ> +1
[23:10:28] <MattJ> Every problem can be solved with another layer of indirection
[23:11:04] <winfried> but what is the problem? webdevelopers not able to use a api?
[23:11:11] <MattJ> Apparently
[23:12:12] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:12:30] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:13:21] *** pushp shows as "away" and his status message is "Away as a result of idle."
[23:13:52] *** Lance shows as "online"
[23:14:02] <Ben Langfeld> web developers are like school children and XML is like cooties
[23:14:11] <bear> hahaha
[23:14:15] <Ben Langfeld> Does this surprise anyone?
[23:14:35] <bear> i'l avoid saying things about php and javascript-in-browser...
[23:14:58] <winfried> bear: tempting wasn't it
[23:15:07] <bear> *very*
[23:15:12] *** waqas has left the room
[23:15:48] <ralphm> {
"iq": {
"-type": "set",
"-from": "hamlet@denmark.lit/blogbot",
"-to": "pubsub.shakespeare.lit",
"-id": "pub1",
"pubsub": {
"-xmlns": "http://jabber.org/protocol/pubsub",
"publish": {
"-node": "princely_musings",
"item": {
"entry": {
"-xmlns": "http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom",
"title": "Soliloquy",
"summary": "
To be, or not to be: that is the question:
Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to suffer
The slings and arrows of outrageous fortune,
Or to take arms against a sea of troubles,
And by opposing end them?
",
"link": {
"-rel": "alternate",
"-type": "text/html",
"-href": "http://denmark.lit/2003/12/13/atom03"
},
"id": "tag:denmark.lit,2003:entry-32397",
"published": "2003-12-13T18:30:02Z",
"updated": "2003-12-13T18:30:02Z"
}
}
}
}
}
}
[23:15:54] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[23:16:29] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:16:32] <ralphm> (http://jsontoxml.utilities-online.info/)
[23:16:36] <Lance> that's suprisingly straightforward
[23:17:18] <jack> why do some start with -?
[23:17:26] <Lance> attributes
[23:17:29] <winfried> (brb)
[23:17:32] <bear> attributes to the element
[23:18:02] <Lance> ralphm: now do one using xml:lang
[23:19:19] <winfried> (ba)
[23:19:42] <ralphm> of course there are some issues. Some elements *may* actually be specified more than once at a particular level. E.g. in this example, there might be multiple "link" entries, and that translator the wraps those in a list: link: [{"-rel":....},{"-rel":....}]
[23:20:04] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:20:04] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:20:13] <ralphm> Lance: I assume it will just do '-xml:lang'
[23:20:56] <Lance> ralphm I was thinking of the matter that you can have multiple of the same item as long as the lang is different
[23:21:02] <jack> one issue is that youcan't do link.append("foo") because it may be a list or it may be a single element
[23:21:10] <jack> so they all have to be lists right?
[23:21:41] <ralphm> jack: in that case it does become ugly
[23:22:00] <ralphm> jack: and that's when bear's suggestion becomes more attractive to me
[23:22:21] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:22:26] <jack> what was bear's suggestion?
[23:22:28] <Lance> fixed model, loses extensibility
[23:22:43] <Lance> in the general sense
[23:22:57] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:23:03] <jack> seems like a nonstarter though. won't you devolve into IRC like stuff where people text encode the customizations inside the "standard" elements provided?
[23:23:09] <Lance> {http://jabber.org/protocol/disco#info}query -> "disco_info"
[23:23:17] <Ben Langfeld> Or a fixed model which decorates an XML model, gaining both benefits
[23:23:17] <Lance> a mapping like that
[23:23:28] <dwd> Fixed model for known items, stock tools for JSON-a-like payloads, and we didn't discuss extensions to the fixed models.
[23:23:30] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:23:53] <Ben Langfeld> I take an XML node and I decorate it with a dev-friendly model.
[23:24:18] <Ben Langfeld> I can still do all of the generic XML operations I enjoy, and everyone whose use-cases fit the decorator can just use that.
[23:24:22] *** waqas has joined the room
[23:25:00] <ralphm> Ben Langfeld: can you paste a small example?
[23:25:37] *** justin shows as "xa" and his status message is "Auto Status (idle)"
[23:25:40] <dwd> roster.add("Dave Cridland", "dwd@dave.cridland.net").x("group").t("Fools")
[23:25:43] <dwd> Presumably.
[23:25:56] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[23:26:18] <Ben Langfeld> presence = Blather::Stanza::Presence.new
presence.status = :dnd
presence.add_child 'foo'

# => <presence><show>dnd</show><foo/></presence>
[23:26:33] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:26:39] <Ben Langfeld> Dave's example is also the same idea
[23:26:42] <Lance> Ben Langfeld: +1 that's what sleek does, especially since it followed blather's model
[23:26:56] <bear> dave's example would fit the nodeJS folks to a T
[23:26:57] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:27:10] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[23:27:13] <Ben Langfeld> <off-topic>Blather does this badly right now but I will fix it</off-topic>
[23:27:43] <Lance> bear: almost, they'd want: roster.add({name: 'Dave Cridland', jid: 'dwd@dave.cridland.net', groups: ['Fools']})
[23:27:54] *** pushp shows as "online"
[23:28:07] <ralphm> roster is a bad example, as we don't do extensions there
[23:28:08] <bear> lance: wouldn't the .().().() pattern fit better?
[23:28:30] <Lance> nope, you put all the optional args in a dict. that's the established pattern
[23:28:34] <Ben Langfeld> Yep
[23:28:43] <Ben Langfeld> Blather and Sleek do this
[23:28:46] <dwd> ralpm, Yeah - when didwe decide not to do extensions there?
[23:29:08] <dwd> My example was adding the group element manually, of course.
[23:29:14] <ralphm> dwd: not sure, but not regretting it :-)
[23:29:21] <dwd> Or pretending to - I don't think it could work like that.
[23:29:40] <bear> lance: oh, that didn't look like what substack was showing - guess I still don't get NodeJS
[23:29:53] <dwd> ralphm, Oh, I quite liked the idea. I implemented it before finding I couldn't find the spec for it anywhere for the commit log.
[23:30:26] <Lance> bear: what he did was for stuff that actually needed to pipeline. you don't need to pipeline to create a roster item
[23:30:34] <Ben Langfeld> If anyone likes Objective-* examples: https://github.com/ArchipelProject/StropheCappuccino/blob/master/TNStropheRoster.j
[23:30:35] <dwd> ralphm, In fact, M-Link tags autogroups (shared groups) using extension elements inside roster items, actually. Works fine.
[23:31:19] <ralphm> dwd: oh, ok
[23:31:49] <ralphm> I would say that the big majority of XEPs actually have pretty fixed schemas that don't allow any extensibiity
[23:31:59] <Ben Langfeld> Seconded
[23:32:03] <dwd> ralphm, But I *thought* we had arbitrary elements (and a requirement to persist) in RFC 6120 somewhere. It's nowhere there now, so I guess we removed it entirely at some point.
[23:32:07] <ralphm> exceptions are message stanzas and pubsub payloads
[23:32:34] <ralphm> and error conditions
[23:32:38] <Lance> occasionally we add new xeps that retro-extennd xeps. like rsm, shim, etc
[23:32:57] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:33:02] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:33:13] <dwd> ralphm, Sure, but this turns out to be really quite useful. I suppose it needs a disco feature and things. Maybe I should write a XEP.
[23:33:14] *** tofu has left the room
[23:33:14] *** tofu has joined the room
[23:33:19] <Lance> the main thing is that we do namespace versioning, but that's not too hard to deal with
[23:33:26] <ralphm> Lance: agreed, but you could possibly wrap those and it is usually orthogonal
[23:34:09] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:34:11] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:36:29] <Ben Langfeld> To the general point, I don't see that the wire format is the problem so much as libraries being too general and assuming that end-users will read XEPs and construct stanzas manually.
[23:36:40] <Ben Langfeld> Which…they won't
[23:36:42] <Ben Langfeld> ever
[23:36:59] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:37:00] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:37:09] <Ben Langfeld> socket.io and the like are successful because the API is like 1 method
[23:37:13] <Lance> +1 Ben Langfeld
[23:37:24] <winfried> +1
[23:37:34] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:38:00] <waqas> I've seen people complain about libraries not implementing usertune, so yes :)
[23:38:19] <Ben Langfeld> indeed
[23:39:45] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:40:06] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:40:41] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:40:53] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[23:41:15] *** m&m has joined the room
[23:41:30] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:41:48] <ralphm> Ben Langfeld: agreed. I just wanted to put it out there. If you don't need generic mapping and/or stanza construction, then you basically need to define a model that maps the existing xml serialization, whether or not you define an actual json serialization.
[23:41:52] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:42:42] <waqas> Why is no one mentioning AMQP, which is the industry standard with multiple implementations, as opposed to 0mq which is basic? :)
[23:42:51] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:42:58] <Lance> we have
[23:43:04] <waqas> I missed that
[23:43:05] <ralphm> AMQP has been mentioned a couple of times
[23:43:52] *** stpeter shows as "online"
[23:45:12] <bear> the folks who wrote 0mq were around when amqp was written
[23:46:21] <waqas> The one thing amqp has going for it is reliability guarantees as part of the protocol. I don't think any competing protocols have that.
[23:47:07] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:47:25] <winfried> before everybody runs of to the dinner... maybe good to wrap a few things up on BOSH
[23:47:32] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:48:08] <winfried> open ends from todays discussion (imho);
[23:48:24] <winfried> RIDs: who writes the patch?
[23:48:34] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:48:56] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:49:18] <winfried> HTTP/XMPP authentication: is there enough consensus to write a protocol/extention for it?
[23:49:43] <dwd> winfried, Yeah, I think there was enough consensus to work on that.
[23:49:57] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:50:05] <winfried> then of course the next question: who will pick it up? :-D
[23:50:41] <dwd> Yeah, not sure we have an actual volunteer for that. And Lance is back, so we can't volunteer him again. :-)
[23:50:47] <Lance> wait
[23:50:48] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:50:52] <Lance> again?
[23:52:34] <winfried> then on websockets: is there any need for work on the proposal or are there extra things to standardize, or does the draft from Jack and Eric Cestari work for now?
[23:53:04] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:53:13] <winfried> (I think it does work right now, but better check it)
[23:53:18] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:53:53] *** stpeter shows as "away" and his status message is "wandered off..."
[23:53:54] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:54:22] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:54:35] <dwd> BTW, the brownies and cookies are nice.
[23:54:50] <Ben Langfeld> <3 cookies
[23:54:57] <winfried> plz safe some of them for me ;-)
[23:54:58] <Ben Langfeld> >> cookie monster
[23:55:06] <jack> waqas: zeromq is misnamed. it has no relation to amqp except hte people behind it and the "queue" in th ename
[23:55:16] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:55:19] <jack> it violates the liskov substitution principle in both directions :)
[23:55:19] <Lance> while considering bosh & websockets, should we do a binding for server sent events? sse feed + post endpoint for sending sounds like it should work rather simply.
[23:55:45] <waqas> jack: I know. I initially missed references to amqp and thought only 0mq was being discussed.
[23:55:46] *** justin shows as "online"
[23:55:57] <jack> we were mixing it all together :)
[23:55:59] <jack> still are :)
[23:56:20] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:57:29] *** Dave shows as "online"
[23:58:34] *** MattJ shows as "online"
[23:58:44] <ralphm> m&m: is that still stpeter's office?
[23:58:55] *** tofu shows as "online"
[23:58:55] *** tofu shows as "online"
[23:59:00] <winfried> redecorated
[23:59:22] <dwd> m&m, Move everything around on the shelves.
[23:59:26] <m&m> nope
[23:59:40] *** MattJ shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[23:59:44] <m&m> that's my home … you're seeing a small subset of my LEGO Star Wars collection