Friday, October 26, 2012
summit@muc.xmpp.org
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XMPP Summit discussion

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[00:02:49] <dwd> m&m, Move your laptop about, then?
[00:03:00] <dwd> m&m, Give us the guided tour. :-)
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[00:03:35] <m&m> when you're almost done
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[00:04:45] <dwd> See? We're almost done.
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[00:13:48] <winfried> (brb)
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[00:21:58] <Lance> 6120 4.8.5: An implementation MUST NOT generate namespace prefixes for elements
qualified by the content namespace
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[00:41:21] <winfried> the hangout kicked me, think it is trying to tell me I have to go...
[00:41:31] <ralphm> GO TO SLEEP!
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[00:41:45] <winfried> why? :-)
[00:42:12] <stpeter> day one is over
[00:42:24] <winfried> yeah...
[00:42:35] <winfried> stpeter, got my direct message?
[00:42:41] <stpeter> winfried: yes!
[00:42:45] <winfried> k
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[00:43:16] <winfried> thanks for the discussions, helped quite a lot!
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[00:43:33] <stpeter> great!
[00:43:39] <stpeter> we'll get volunteers for all the tasks :)
[00:43:54] <winfried> well that helps even more!
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[00:43:56] <winfried> ;-)
[00:44:18] <winfried> I'll drop other topics in the standards/BOSH lists
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[00:44:56] <winfried> and now I will keep myself to the wise advise of ralphm ...
[00:45:04] <winfried> have a nice dinner!
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[00:48:03] <MattJ> 'night winfried!
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[16:09:42] <bear> pirate pad notes from yesterday: http://piratepad.net/05gvwTiPKT
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[16:14:48] <stpeter> we're waiting for some f2f participants to come upstairs from breakfast
[16:15:02] <Zash> And here I just had dinner ^^
[16:15:06] <stpeter> :)
[16:15:07] <stpeter> brb
[16:15:08] <Steffen Larsen> me too
[16:15:27] <stpeter> we're UTC-7 here
[16:15:35] <stpeter> brb
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[16:39:25] <m&m> could someone pretty please update the subject with the hangout URL?
[16:39:50] <Steffen Larsen> I am awake! :-)
[16:40:09] <Steffen Larsen> bear: I see you..
[16:40:32] <MattJ> .
[16:40:43] <bear> :)
[16:41:01] <stpeter> https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/53cd1a2959b01158c4d766ed26088ff9b50639d6?authuser=0&hl=en-US
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[16:42:38] <Fritzy> http://play.brokt.com/~fritzy/lander/ <----- boom!
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[16:43:52] *MattJ has set the topic to: http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Summit_12 | remote participation: https://plus.google.com/hangouts/_/53cd1a2959b01158c4d766ed26088ff9b50639d6?authuser=0&hl=en-US
[16:44:11] <MattJ> Topic updated
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[16:50:05] <Steffen Larsen> start in 15min or?
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[16:53:11] <bear> http://blogs.cisco.com/news/the-internet-of-things-infographic/
[16:53:32] <bear> http://www.internet-of-things.eu/
[16:55:30] <Zash> Neat
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[17:06:51] <Steffen Larsen> ha ha.. just remembered the blog from Thiago: http://xmppjingle.blogspot.dk/2009/07/my-fridge-xmpp-client.html
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[17:07:23] <Steffen Larsen> my fridge is XMPP ready. :-)
[17:07:35] <bear> :)
[17:07:57] <Zash> <iq to="fridge" type="get"><temperature of="milk"/></iq> :D
[17:10:26] <Steffen Larsen> :-)
[17:11:24] <Zash> A company here that moves milk and groceries apparently does real-time monitoring of the temperature in their trucks, along with info about fuel consumption and stuff.
[17:11:27] <m&m> <iq type='set' to='fridge'><pubsub xmlns='http://jabber.org/protocol/pubsub'><subscribe node='temprature/milk' jid='me@home'/></pubsub></iq>
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[17:12:00] <dwd> m&m, Already made the gag that XEP-0060 probably had a feature.
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[17:12:11] <m&m> d-:
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[17:14:05] <Steffen Larsen> remote controlling (xep-0146) could be useful as well in IOT
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[17:45:37] <Steffen Larsen> looks like its lunch break time..
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[17:50:30] <Ben Langfeld> not lunch, just a short break
[17:50:38] <Ben Langfeld> We'll be going again in 5 probably
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[17:53:00] <Steffen Larsen> ok
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[18:26:04] <Lloyd> Turns out I didn't disable muc on my xmpp server after all
[18:26:23] <bear> copy of what peter is adding to the in-room whiteboard: http://piratepad.net/05gvwTiPKT
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[18:36:16] <Simon Tennant> https://buddycloud.org/wiki/Buddycloud_HTTP_API#Content_Types <https://buddycloud.org/wiki/Buddycloud_HTTP_API>
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[18:42:00] <Simon Tennant> https://github.com/buddycloud/buddycloud-http-api
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[19:34:21] <Simon Tennant> are there any Tigase guys there today?
[19:36:08] <Lance> i dont think so
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[19:36:28] <Lance> but it has been mentioned a lot regarding how it clusters
[19:36:29] <dwd> No, none.
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[19:37:45] <Ben Langfeld> no P1 guys either
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[19:40:01] <Simon Tennant> I'm looking forward to Fosdem and meeting up on either side of the conf.
[19:40:28] <Simon Tennant> Can someone fix ipv6 connectivity on xmpp.org or give me sudo.
[19:41:20] <Tobias> Simon Tennant, you've ipv6 enabled buddycloud.com, right?
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[19:41:46] <Simon Tennant> like it's 1999.
[19:42:16] <Tobias> because since i've ipv6 enabled my server i can't join seehaus anymore
[19:42:22] <Simon Tennant> buddycloud.org
[19:42:35] <Simon Tennant> buddycloud.com is an old ejabberd instance and due for retirement
[19:43:02] <Tobias> an..ok
[19:43:07] <Tobias> *ahh
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[19:46:35] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: need some info about tigase?.. I've been doing alot on these servers. including clustering.
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[19:47:32] <Simon Tennant> Thanks Steffen - we have the buddycloud hosting platform written for Tigase already - dynamically adding domains from our control panel.
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[19:48:31] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: ok. cool. so any problems? or just curious about something? I've been doing developing on tigase as well..
[19:49:33] <Simon Tennant> Actually going back to Tobias' question… what's the ipv6 support like on Tigase?
[19:50:38] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: as I remember its enabled pr. default.
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[19:51:52] <Steffen Larsen> Soimon Tennant: looking at the issue list I can see its not fully supported yet: https://projects.tigase.org/issues/822
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[19:53:00] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: so from 5.2 version it should fully be supported. Haven't used ipv6 my self, so sorry for the lame answer.
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[19:53:30] <Simon Tennant> Steffen Larsen: thanks for the heads up.
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[19:54:24] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: no prob.
[19:56:26] <Simon Tennant> Regarding mobile: the big issue now is to not run a connection and then to wake one up with a push notification.
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[19:56:59] <Simon Tennant> always-on xmpp will not make any friends.
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[19:58:57] <Tobias> Simon Tennant, so what do you have in mind?
[19:59:24] <Tobias> i mean you could log out and just resume your old session when you wake up again (after TLS + SASL)
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[20:00:22] <Simon Tennant> I don't know - I've not looked at this for a while. But I know that any app draining a battery will kill your ratings.
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[20:02:14] <Tobias> i don't know how small packets you get with XMPP Quickstart + Session Resumtion but that'd be my way to go if you don't want a persistant connection
[20:02:53] <Steffen Larsen> Simon Tennant: remember that you can save some battery by queuing in tigase: http://www.tigase.org/content/mobile-optimizations
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[20:03:22] <Tobias> to further improve performance maybe replace TCP with something more mobile friendly...but that might not be possible in all cases
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[20:04:05] <Simon Tennant> From the it-just-effing-works school: How does Google do this with their Gtalk app (some binary protocol) or their Google Plus app (native XMPP)?
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[20:08:51] <Simon Tennant> netsplit!
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[20:09:33] <Tobias> i don't know
[20:10:30] <m&m> someone set them up the bomb
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[20:12:05] <Steffen Larsen> hey stpeter
[20:12:17] <Steffen Larsen> you are not in the hangout?
[20:12:19] <Simon Tennant> incase anyone in the room sees this - we lost the Hangout.
[20:12:23] <m&m> hey Portland, you've not hanging out!
[20:12:24] <Ben Langfeld> error 44
[20:12:26] <Ben Langfeld> obviously
[20:12:27] <bear> we are reconnecting
[20:12:36] <Steffen Larsen> …waiting… ;-)
[20:12:40] <m&m> don't worry, Simon and I are bashing you
[20:12:45] <bear> the talk is happening about adding OOB notifications
[20:13:04] <waqas> It was probably intentional, while they discussed their evil schemes
[20:13:13] <Steffen Larsen> :-)
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[20:16:30] <Steffen Larsen> it might be a CATastrophe.. ;-)
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[20:18:02] <Simon Tennant> Why are we talking about SMSs?
[20:18:24] <m&m> apparently that is how the notification service works … from the server to the carrier?
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[20:18:27] <MattJ> Device-independent push notifications I think
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[20:18:40] <dwd> Because of tech like EMN, where you send an imap URI to a specific port on the phone.
[20:18:51] <Simon Tennant> I would have throught it was based on USSD messages
[20:19:29] <Simon Tennant> or even ONE socket open to Apple that keeps all packets sizes below the maximum size before a radio jumps up to the higher power state.
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[20:19:51] <bear> right - the packet size for apple push notifications is *tiny*
[20:20:17] <Simon Tennant> http://developer.apple.com/library/mac/#documentation/NetworkingInternet/Conceptual/RemoteNotificationsPG/CommunicatingWIthAPS/CommunicatingWIthAPS.html
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[20:21:01] <Simon Tennant> iPhone users are something special.
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[20:23:44] <MattJ> http://matthewwild.co.uk/uploads/xep-0313.html
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[20:25:22] <pushp> Sorry for the drive-by... W3C just published a draft for push notifications api
[20:25:22] <Lance> MattJ: and which paragraph were you having issues with?
[20:25:24] <pushp> http://www.w3.org/TR/push-api/
[20:26:11] <Ben Langfeld> pushp: That's all about SSE and the browser, right?
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[20:28:42] <pushp> It is geared towards webapps, but mobile apps on IOS/BB/Android end up using similar notifications even for non-web apps
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[20:29:00] <Ben Langfeld> Sure, while they are foreground
[20:29:27] <pushp> Foreground and background.
[20:29:37] <Ben Langfeld> How does it work in the background?
[20:30:22] <Tobias> dwd, EMN requires carrier support?
[20:30:33] <pushp> OS specific.. but in the proprietary schemes apps get call backs.
[20:30:52] <Ben Langfeld> pushp: APN, right? That's what we were talking about.
[20:31:02] <Ben Langfeld> There's issues with sharing APN keys
[20:31:10] <Ben Langfeld> In a non-app-specific way.
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[20:32:10] <pushp> Agreed on issues with sharing APN keys on a non-app specific way.
[20:32:33] <Ben Langfeld> Which is the issue we're trying to solve. I'm not sure how this Push API thing helps at all.
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[20:33:51] <pushp> ah. Sorry came in late.. will rewind the discussion.
[20:33:56] <Simon Tennant> This stuff Matt is working on is really important and super useful!
[20:34:07] <linuxwolf> Yes. Yes it is
[20:35:32] <Simon Tennant> the buddycloud webclient is using the RSM+MAM for getting posts.
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[20:56:00] <MattJ> Lance: if you didn't find it already, http://matthewwild.co.uk/uploads/xep-0313.html#query-paging
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[21:01:29] <Lance> MattJ: yeah, 59 used to just have a <reverse /> flag
[21:01:47] <Lance> which needed to included in all page requests, of course
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[21:17:05] <waqas> fwiw, I've been trying to 'diff' the old and new stringprep to get an exhaustive list of affected unicode characters in nodeprep, nameprep and resourceprep, and how they are affected
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[21:21:55] <linuxwolf> I just realized that the camera probably should have been rotated
[21:22:10] <linuxwolf> I'm familiar with the problem ...
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[21:26:14] <bear > Hey
[21:26:17] <bear > it works
[21:26:27] <bear> hey now!
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[21:27:04] <dwd> /nick bear
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[21:27:08] <dwd> Aw...
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[21:33:56] <Steffen Larsen> ok guys!. thanks for yet another great summit. hope to see you at FOSDEM in 2013! :-)
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[21:34:09] <Simon Tennant> thanks guys
[21:34:12] <Simon Tennant> see you in Brussels.
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[21:34:48] <justin> later peoples
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[21:34:52] <Steffen Larsen> yeah! XMPP and beers.. have to do some IOT, electronics and fridge with beers.. :-)
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[21:35:12] <Steffen Larsen> cheers!
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[21:42:16] <Tobias> dwd, do you have a more precise term for EMN?
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[23:03:46] <dwd> oma emn. Let me hunt a reference.
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[23:05:55] <dwd> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/2726976/how-to-receive-text-sms-to-specific-port http://www.openmobilealliance.org/technical/release_program/emn_v10.aspx
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[23:40:21] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:43:52] *** Simon Tennant shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:43:52] *** Simon Tennant shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:43:59] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:43:59] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:45:23] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:50:27] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:52:46] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:52:46] *** Simon Tennant shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:52:46] *** Simon Tennant shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[23:55:28] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:55:28] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"
[23:55:29] *** Simon Tennant shows as "online"