Monday, July 29, 2013
summit@muc.xmpp.org
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XMPP Summit discussion

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[07:54:59] <Steffen Larsen> yusuke: about your dependency graph, do you have the actual data and not just the graph?
[07:55:38] <Steffen Larsen> yusuke: or maybe the script? because I also want to do some statistics, before we make the tagging, versioning etc.
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[08:11:22] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, there are ready to use python libs for that: https://gitorious.org/xmpp/xmpp/blobs/master/extensions/xepinfo.py
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[08:14:14] <Tobias> so you basically give it a path to a mercurial info and the lib will automatically fetch versions and stuff...at least that was the plan
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[09:53:34] <strohi> hello
[09:53:36] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: super! I did not know that
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[09:56:19] <strohi> Steffen Larsen, do you know where to get some nice not too expensive here?
[09:56:46] <Steffen Larsen> strohl: where and what?
[09:58:01] <strohi> interconti(berlin) not poisened stuff ;) something lunchlike
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[09:58:49] <Steffen Larsen> ha ha
[09:59:12] <Steffen Larsen> Just got back in copenhagen yesterday.. but there is a lot of beer gardens around tiergarten
[09:59:37] <Steffen Larsen> haven't eaten at the intercontinental hotel
[10:00:08] <strohi> ah ok
[10:00:40] <strohi> maybe i simply try to find a subway, near trainstation zoo should be one
[10:00:53] <Steffen Larsen> yes but also in the tiergarten are like 2-3
[10:01:34] <Steffen Larsen> next to the tiergarten trainstation is also a good one..
[10:01:53] <strohi> but thats about 1km away, too, hmm
[10:02:33] <Steffen Larsen> heh .. otherwise in the tiergarten next to the soo is a big one..
[10:02:51] <Steffen Larsen> this one: http://www.cafe-am-neuen-see.de
[10:03:00] <strohi> there we was yesterday evenign ^^
[10:03:14] <Steffen Larsen> yes!
[10:03:29] <Steffen Larsen> the food is ok.. but a bit fried
[10:03:31] <Steffen Larsen> :-)
[10:03:42] <strohi> hehe
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[10:04:11] <Steffen Larsen> well speaking of food.. I'm off to lunch
[10:04:14] <strohi> k thx
[10:04:16] <strohi> hehe
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[10:28:56] <strohi> its raining :|
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[10:52:48] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: Just a stupid quesiton.. are we not having the latest XEPs and docs in git (gittorious) and not in mercurial?
[10:53:27] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: havent touched the xmpp.org code/doc since 2009 in svn.. so please forgive me and my stupid question. :-)
[10:54:12] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, we use git as source control...however mercurial has a nicer python API, so the tools are written in python :)
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[10:54:23] <Tobias> and hg has quite good git support via hggit
[10:56:25] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: ahhh ok.
[10:56:43] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: no prob. I know both hg (mercurial) and git
[10:57:14] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: just wanted to look into tagging ,referencing and versioning in the XEPs
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[12:14:00] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, right..we could auto generate small dependency graphs per XEP and show them at the end of the XEP
[12:14:35] <Steffen Larsen> yes
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[12:15:11] <Steffen Larsen> Just looking at it now.. many have <dependencies> tag.. but not all are maintained I think
[12:18:46] <Tobias> they could be manually verified if a XEPs status moves up...i.e. experimental -> draft, draft -> final, ...
[12:19:12] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: versioning of XEP and xsd is not that easy.. the XEP contains <revision> and <version> but is it deterministic to see which one is the latest? of course for most of the time it is the first, but still..
[12:19:32] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: yes
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[12:20:19] <Tobias> XEP's have revision? you mean svn/hg/git revision?
[12:20:40] <Steffen Larsen> there is revision tag in the XEP it self
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[12:20:56] <Steffen Larsen> or is it based on SCM/git
[12:20:58] <Steffen Larsen> ?
[12:21:58] <Tobias> ahh..i see what you mean
[12:22:04] <Steffen Larsen> :-)
[12:22:21] <Tobias> i'd say version is just the textual representation of a revision
[12:22:22] <Steffen Larsen> yes. changing a comma might not change the flow or the XSD..
[12:22:26] <Tobias> looking at https://gitorious.org/xmpp/xmpp/blobs/master/extensions/xep-0045.xml
[12:22:33] <Steffen Larsen> ok.
[12:22:40] <Tobias> you mean version tag and revision tag, right?
[12:22:47] <Steffen Larsen> ye
[12:22:50] <Steffen Larsen> yes
[12:23:00] <Steffen Larsen> heh MUC.. not the lightest XEP ;-)
[12:23:55] <Tobias> right...but i thought it's old enough to cover all features
[12:24:13] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: right
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[12:25:07] <Tobias> so for getting the actual latest version of a particular revision: https://gitorious.org/xmpp/xmpp/blobs/master/extensions/xeputil.py
[12:25:14] <Steffen Larsen> I just wanted the version of a XEP.. because many XMPP servers say that they e.g. implement MUC, but in what version?.. if they implemented it way back it might not be compatible with our new version
[12:25:41] <Tobias> def contentOfRevision(self, revision) <-- will give you the latest XML that got tagged with exactly that revision
[12:26:20] <Steffen Larsen> ok
[12:29:11] <Steffen Larsen> maybe a service disc. could deliver the version as well besides namespace?.. just to be more trustworthy
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[12:30:19] <Steffen Larsen> ohh that might already be included.. hmm
[12:31:59] <Steffen Larsen> reading up on http://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0053.html .. does it means that the authors SHOULD update the namespace with a version, if flow or protocol changes?.. and is it done in real life?
[12:34:02] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: e.g. MUC ns: http://jabber.org/protocol/muc .. should that have been versioned? like http://jabber.org/protocol/muc:1 etc..
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[12:36:55] <Steffen Larsen> Sorry for spamming the summit MUC.. i'll PM tobi. :-)
[12:38:11] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, good question...i'm not that up to date with the current namespacing approach...but yeah...usually we now do foo-bla:#version
[12:39:59] <Steffen Larsen> exactly.. buy they need to be updated not only when chageing status but also during draft etc.
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[12:40:23] <Steffen Larsen> Tobias: I've added you to my Roster for further discussion. ;)
[12:41:13] <Tobias> Steffen Larsen, yeah..took some time to find it in my UI :P
[12:42:58] <Steffen Larsen> :-)
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