Wednesday, December 14, 2011
xsf@muc.xmpp.org
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XSF Discussion | Logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/xsf/ | Agenda https://trello.com/b/Dn6IQOu0/board-meetings

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[16:05:11] <dwd> A little less than half an hour to go.
[16:07:06] <stpeter> indeed
[16:07:23] *stpeter is on a conference call so not really paying attention here at the moment
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[16:11:56] <lurker11542> stpeter tests from speeqe.com
[16:12:56] <stpeter> well, that works, but it seems that Chris can't access speeqe.com either
[16:13:01] <dwd> Right.
[16:13:14] <stpeter> text to speech? ;-)
[16:13:39] <dwd> The only thing I wondered was whether we could setup a 1-1 => MUC relay fast enough.
[16:18:00] *bear is slow this morning
[16:18:07] <bear> what do you mean by 1-1
[16:18:08] <bear> ?
[16:18:49] *stpeter tries to use the gmail web interface for muc and fails utterly
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[16:21:28] <dwd> bear, One to one chat.
[16:22:07] <bear> ah
[16:22:52] <bear> thought that was it but the => MUC part was making my post-sick brain all wonky
[16:23:11] <dwd> So, 8 minutes to go and we have 3/5 board folk and one apology.
[16:23:37] <Florian> 16:30 meeting?
[16:23:47] <dwd> Florian, Yep.
[16:25:07] <dwd> http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/Board#Proposed_Agenda
[16:25:18] <dwd> (For those wot 'ave forgot)
[16:27:07] <Florian> do we have an etherpad?
[16:27:16] <dwd> Florian, Do we want one?
[16:27:31] <Florian> it's quite nice to get the minutes ready
[16:27:41] *bear considers that to be the note takers option
[16:28:03] <dwd> Florian, You realise you're getting dangerously close to offering to do the minutes this week?
[16:28:17] *Florian shuts up
[16:28:52] <Florian> I killed our core server this morning
[16:28:57] <stpeter> http://typewith.me/xsf
[16:29:07] <stpeter> that's our permanent room
[16:29:09] <Florian> by running aptitude without realizing it was removing nearly all packages
[16:29:16] <bear> ouch
[16:29:19] *** Ashley has joined the room
[16:29:29] <dwd> Yay, it's Ashley!
[16:29:42] <dwd> So we are complete, modulo Chris's apology.
[16:29:42] <bear> I did that once with RHEL 6 - removed the core package that allows yum to update itself
[16:29:53] <Florian> heh
[16:30:10] <Ashley> yay!
[16:30:22] <stpeter> we need a muc to chat bot
[16:30:28] <stpeter> that way we could patch people in
[16:31:35] <dwd> Indeed.
[16:31:45] <dwd> So, I declare us in session.
[16:31:55] <stpeter> http://code.matthewwild.co.uk/riddim/ here I come :)
[16:32:43] <dwd> So, first item is Athena - do we have sufficient item folk to offer advice on what they'd like to do?
[16:33:18] <dwd> Kev, stpeter - I believe this is your bag. What are our options for Athena, and what needs to happen as a priority?
[16:33:43] *Florian puts Flosoft.biz hat on
[16:33:55] *dwd looks meaningfully across the office at Kev, in the hope he'll reply.
[16:33:56] <Florian> we can offer an upgrade to ds0039 (i.e. a better box)
[16:34:01] <stpeter> BTW I am manually copying text from this room over to Chris
[16:34:02] <Kev> I think the plan was to start mirroring stuff onto ds0039.
[16:34:17] <dwd> stpeter, Ah, yes. I should really have thought of that.
[16:34:18] <Kev> This was dependent upon someone working out database replication for us.
[16:34:25] <Florian> Processor Intel Bi XeonE54052x 4x 2.00 GHz
Architecture 64 bits
NIC GigaEthernet
Memory 16 GB
Disks 2x 750GB RAID Soft 0/1
VT Instructions
[16:34:38] <stpeter> for the record, ds0039 is a Flosoft machine
[16:34:49] <bear> stpeter - screen share with chris?
[16:35:03] <Florian> right. Flosoft.biz would be willing to replace that machine with the configuration mentioned above. ds0039 has no RAID.
[16:35:11] <dwd> bear, I'm sure if he could screen share he could do proper XMPP.
[16:35:17] <Kev> I quite like the idea of fixing up athena (either by replacement of disk or box).
[16:35:17] *Florian puts his board hat on again
[16:35:38] <stpeter> bear: this will work for now -- I think I'll do some riddim bot hacking over the holidays
[16:35:41] <Kev> I'm not entirely sure I can come up with a convincing reason not to migrate athena over to the offered Flosoft machine, off the top of my head.
[16:35:52] *bear was just offering
[16:36:10] <stpeter> Kev: I don't see a good reason
[16:36:14] <Florian> the problem I see with ds0039, it has no RAID
[16:36:19] <bear> +1 to migrate to flosoft: it gives us a recent hardware base and RAID
[16:36:34] <dwd> Kev, What's your unconvincing reasons?
[16:36:52] <Florian> so I would say ds0039 is bad, but Flosoft.biz can replace ds0039 with the dual CPU box above, which does have software RAID
[16:36:52] <stpeter> we've had all the machines in Iowa so that they're all in one place, Jer could check out the hardware if needed, etc.
[16:37:01] <Kev> dwd: I quite like having stuff all in Iowa.
[16:37:10] *** MiGri shows as "online" and his status message is "This conversation may be monitored for quality assurance or security purposes. ;)"
[16:37:12] <dwd> "stuff" == our data?
[16:37:17] <Kev> No, the servers.
[16:37:36] <stpeter> Kev: yeah, but that means we need to maintain machines -- isn't that kind of old-fashioned these days?
[16:37:57] <dwd> Well, having your eggs all in one basket does make them more convenient to carry.
[16:38:13] <Kev> stpeter: Some of us are old fashioned. Not all of us are trendy Lua coders like you.
[16:38:14] <stpeter> and it also means that we have problems if there are connectivity issues
[16:38:18] <Florian> right
[16:38:31] <Kev> But the original suggestion was that we had the main box in the bunker, and then mirrored that over to ds0039.
[16:38:32] <Ashley> is there any reason to consider EC2 or others of that ilk?
[16:38:33] <stpeter> Kev: I'm talking about changing my website back to server-side includes :P
[16:38:43] <Kev> Which seem like a pretty sensible solution to the network failure issue.
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[16:39:01] <Kev> Ashley: None that I can think of.
[16:39:08] <dwd> Does that need MySQL expertise to figure out how to keep them in sync properly?
[16:39:24] <Florian> the question is: Do we really need to be syncing stuff?
[16:39:25] <Kev> dwd: Either that, or we set up a cunning reverse proxy thing.
[16:39:47] <Florian> i.e. is there a point in putting in that much effort for a single site?
[16:39:49] <dwd> Do we have, or can we arrange, MySQL expertise?
[16:39:58] <bear> syncing and all that seems overkill for such a basic setup that xsf has
[16:40:05] <Florian> Master-Master replication with MySQL is annoying
[16:40:06] <dwd> Florian, I think it looks really bad when our site is down.
[16:40:11] <Kev> Florian: I don't know. It's jolly inconvenient when the site is down.
[16:40:11] <Florian> bear: I agree
[16:40:16] <stpeter> dwd: agreed, for sure
[16:40:28] <bear> if the urge to keep servers with physical access is that great then iowa is the only option as anything else incurs fully managed server costs
[16:40:36] <Kev> bear: Well, yes, but a previous Board decided we wanted a database driven site and not the nice plain-text one we had before.
[16:40:58] <Florian> dwd / Kev: definitely. But I'm sure the site will be quite reliable on a single server
[16:41:14] <Florian> as the hardware / network is covered by the SLA
[16:41:15] <dwd> Florian, So question - I'm happy to assume that flosoft's bandwidth is perfect; what happens if ds0039++ drops?
[16:41:35] <Florian> if it drops, someone in the DC will take a look at it and bring it back up
[16:42:07] <bear> to answer the original mysql question - a once an hour master/slave setup is very simple to configure (especially if the mirror is readonly)
[16:42:07] <stpeter> I'd be fine with that
[16:42:25] <stpeter> that = website(s?) at Flosoft
[16:42:25] <Florian> I don't think it's worth spending a lot of time on a HA setup for an edge case (the website isn't mission critical)
[16:42:30] <stpeter> Florian: +`1
[16:42:47] <dwd> Florian, What does Flosoft.biz want in compensation? (ie, money, sponsorship, etc)?
[16:42:48] <Kev> Florian: Actually, I'd argue the website is the only mission critical thing!
[16:42:55] <stpeter> Kev: heh
[16:43:01] <dwd> Kev, I'd agree.
[16:43:09] <Kev> The XSF's mission being to shove out these standards things.
[16:43:14] <Florian> dwd: Sponsorship
[16:43:24] <dwd> Florian, In any particular form?
[16:43:42] <Florian> well, what's the level for ± 1200€
[16:43:44] <bear> 200pt sponsor text on each page?
[16:43:48] <stpeter> Kev: you have a point
[16:44:08] <dwd> stpeter, Well, he's certainly sharp.
[16:44:10] *bear waves the "joke" flag in case it wasn't obvious
[16:44:16] <stpeter> I'll note that the XSF does have money in the bank and could afford to purchase a new machine to replace athena
[16:44:57] <bear> if flosoft is offering a server in exchange for sponsorship status - I like that idea so the cash can go towards other items
[16:44:59] <dwd> Florian, Actually, i don't know what levels there are, really.
[16:45:10] <Florian> http://xmpp.org/sponsor/sponsor-the-xsf/
[16:45:20] <Florian> Silver or Gold
[16:45:39] *** MiGri shows as "away" and his status message is "I'm not at the computer but I'll read the messages as soon as I'll be back."
[16:46:31] <stpeter> naturally, another approach (I hate to say this) is to go back to a static website so that it's easier to replicate across servers
[16:47:21] <dwd> Florian, OK. Do you reckon some kind of HA could be sorted for a Gold sponsorship?
[16:47:52] <bear> to make sure I have this clear in my head... the option would be to have primary on flosoft with iowa server being the backup/utility server?
[16:48:10] <Florian> we could set up replication to Iowa
[16:48:10] <dwd> bear, Well, the Board is not going to make technical decisions.
[16:48:14] <Florian> but not a second server
[16:48:37] <Florian> i.e. Flosoft.biz would be happy to help setting up failover mechanisms to external hardware
[16:48:41] <bear> not even thinking on *how* - just asking what the roles would be
[16:48:42] *** MiGri shows as "online" and his status message is "This conversation may be monitored for quality assurance or security purposes. ;)"
[16:49:00] <dwd> bear, The Board can, however, give the item authorization to go various routes.
[16:49:07] <dwd> "iteam".
[16:49:38] <Florian> so technically I'm thinking something like MySQL replication + webserver on another machine in Iowa
[16:49:58] <dwd> So, I think we have those options now - so can we make a decision on whether we could in principle accept Flosoft's offer? (Should the item want it)
[16:50:09] <dwd> I'm +1 on this, incidentally.
[16:50:27] <Florian> I'd like to abstain from this vote as I'm biased.
[16:50:34] <bear> seeing the pushback on not talking specifics, then we can only vote on putting the choice to the iteam and getting their feedback
[16:50:53] <Kev> I think we should have at least Jonathan's input before deciding.
[16:50:53] *bear is +1 to this
[16:51:05] <dwd> bear, If the item want to go the Flosoft route, I don't see a need for them to come back to us.
[16:51:07] <Kev> Given that he's largely responsible for 'machine' admin.
[16:51:29] <stpeter> Kev: +1 to getting Jonathan's input
[16:51:35] <dwd> Kev, Right. But that's fine. The iteam can decide to use whatever options we're authorizing here.
[16:52:41] <dwd> Ashley, You happy in principle with Flosoft getting sponsorship in exchange for webserver?
[16:52:49] <Ashley> +1
[16:52:54] <stpeter> BTW, the other major infrastructure that the XSF runs is atlas = all the mailing lists (and we also use athena for running the muc.xmpp.org chatrooms)
[16:53:16] <stpeter> Chris says: " if it's flobiz's offer we are voting on, I think I am fine with this"
[16:53:41] <dwd> OK.
[16:54:23] <dwd> So the other option is to buy a new machine - that is, a replacement Athena.
[16:54:25] <stpeter> BTW, I receive offers of help on occasion from random ISPs and hosting providers and such -- I should keep better track of those
[16:54:29] <stpeter> dwd: right
[16:54:39] <stpeter> dwd: and atlas won't last forever, either
[16:55:03] <stpeter> would we be comfortable hosting both email and web and muc.xmpp.org on the same machine?
[16:55:10] <Kev> I was pondering that.
[16:55:10] <stpeter> that's probably an iteam discussion item
[16:55:17] <dwd> stpeter, Right, that's one for iteam.
[16:55:23] <Kev> We've traditionally limited access to the mail machine much more than to the others.
[16:55:24] <bear> the server that flosoft is offering can handle all of that
[16:55:29] <stpeter> Kev: right
[16:55:38] <Florian> right
[16:56:42] <stpeter> ok my other conference call is finished so I have more cycles
[16:56:52] <Florian> 16GB of RAM and 2x 4 Core CPUs
[16:56:55] <dwd> My gut feeling is that machines which handle mail and XMPP should probably stay in Iowa.
[16:57:19] <dwd> I'm not sure I can construct and argument as to why.
[16:57:24] <stpeter> heh
[16:57:28] <Florian> heh
[16:57:33] <bear> status quo is hard to shift
[16:57:45] <Florian> I'd say that is something for Iteam to discuss anyways
[16:57:46] <stpeter> I think I'd be comfortable with putting mail and xmpp (which is limited) on the same machine
[16:57:50] <stpeter> Florian: agreed
[16:58:02] <stpeter> or we can discuss on the members@ list
[16:58:06] <Florian> so we're authorizing:
- A Flosoft.biz sponsored machine
- Buying a new machine
[16:58:16] <dwd> So if we're to buy a new machine for Athena, and possible Atlas as well, what costs are we looking at, and is this within the scope of the XSF's current cash reserves?
[16:58:16] <stpeter> which might attract more people to help with infrastructure issues
[16:58:39] <dwd> stpeter, The final decision remains with the iteam, though, I feel.
[16:58:49] <Kev> Atlas is, as far as I'm aware, very low requirement.
[16:59:00] <stpeter> dwd: that leads into your next agenda item :)
[16:59:10] <Kev> In fact, given the age of the various boxes, all the requirements are fairly low.
[16:59:11] <stpeter> dwd: "Teams, SIGs, and other constructs "
[16:59:16] <stpeter> KEv: yes
[16:59:16] <dwd> It does. We're also running wildly over. :-)
[16:59:21] <stpeter> dwd: indeed
[16:59:57] <dwd> OK. So I think we ask the iteam to scope out hardware costs and come back to us, OK?
[17:00:15] <stpeter> I think so, yes
[17:00:16] <bear> +1
[17:00:28] <dwd> OK, so next item...
[17:00:29] <Kev> Board Chair to chase iteam, then.
[17:00:37] <Florian> sure
[17:00:47] <dwd> Kev, Well, walk firmly after them anyway.
[17:01:09] <dwd> "Teams, SIGs and other constructs".
[17:01:23] <dwd> So a team is defined as beign XSF members only.
[17:01:37] <dwd> Whereas a SIG is open to all-comers.
[17:01:50] <bear> IMO, the only team we need like that is iTeam
[17:01:52] <stpeter> per they Bylaws, yes
[17:02:07] <stpeter> http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/xsf/xsf-bylaws/
[17:02:10] <dwd> We've got both a communications team and a tech-review team, and the iteam.
[17:02:15] *stpeter should add a table of contents to that page
[17:02:24] <dwd> Are there any others?
[17:02:27] <stpeter> no
[17:02:29] <Kev> I'm not convinced that we have a communications team or a tech review team in anything other than name.
[17:02:34] <stpeter> Kev: correct
[17:02:36] <dwd> Well, nor me.
[17:02:42] <stpeter> Kev: and I am not convinced that we need them
[17:02:50] *bear agrees
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[17:03:06] <Florian> +1
[17:03:39] <stpeter> I think that everyone can (and many should) be helping with technical reviews, but that's what the standards@xmpp.org list is for
[17:03:52] <bear> the only structure I could see to SIGs is a tech council or board member being on "hook" for any SIGs
[17:04:10] *** MiGri shows as "online" and his status message is "This conversation may be monitored for quality assurance or security purposes. ;)"
[17:04:23] <dwd> OK. So do we need to try and motivate people to do a "communications SIG", so we can push news and exciting stuff from any sources?
[17:04:37] <stpeter> and communications can happen easily because many people have access to the website to make changes (although few do) -- however, there's more to communication than the website, I suppose, with all the social networking stuff we could do
[17:05:01] <stpeter> BTW Chris has another meeting to go to
[17:05:12] <bear> I would love to create a little dashboard to allow for pushing to the various social streams
[17:05:13] <dwd> OK, that's fine. We're overrunning, anyway.
[17:05:41] <dwd> I'm assuming everyone is happy keeping the iteam as a formal team (assuming it is one).
[17:05:42] <Florian> why not just have an open mailinglist
[17:05:50] <Florian> where people can post ready articles to?
[17:05:56] <dwd> Florian, Yeah, that is, in effect, a SIG.
[17:06:17] <stpeter> Florian: I just shut down the news@jabber.org list :)
[17:06:31] <Florian> that existed?
[17:06:33] <stpeter> yes
[17:06:38] <stpeter> from 1999 on
[17:06:38] <Florian> well, something like: submit@xmpp.org
[17:06:39] <bear> people can post to members list with subject line marker [news] or something
[17:06:44] <stpeter> but we haven't used it in ages
[17:06:44] <Florian> or that
[17:06:48] <stpeter> bear: yeah
[17:06:57] <dwd> bear, That restricts it to only members, though.
[17:07:10] <bear> for xsf comm output - I don't mind it being members only
[17:07:22] <bear> it's communication *from* xsf
[17:07:26] <bear> not about
[17:07:46] <stpeter> right
[17:07:46] <dwd> bear, Is it? The comm team used to produce newsletters about XMPP.
[17:07:54] <stpeter> dwd: really?
[17:08:03] <dwd> stpeter, Did it not?
[17:08:05] <stpeter> we did have the "Jabber Journal" back in the old days
[17:08:12] <Kev> Nyco used to do roundups, yes.
[17:08:21] <bear> their was a blog posting that used to be done regularly - the roundups
[17:08:29] <stpeter> ah true
[17:08:37] <stpeter> I never saw those as "newsletters" :)
[17:08:40] <stpeter> thus the disconnect
[17:09:11] <dwd> Right, sorry, I forgot the name.
[17:09:16] <bear> I'm feeling that if we get pushback from the community that it's hard to post notices about xmpp from non-members we can adjust
[17:09:39] <dwd> I don't think we'd get that pushback. We're not getting anything much at the moment, after all.
[17:09:56] <bear> I just get all squeamish about the xsf blog being available for anyone to push text to
[17:09:57] <Ashley> would something like having a reddit clone for ppl to post news articles be interesting?
[17:10:16] <Kev> Ashley: I don't understand the concept.
[17:10:17] <stpeter> let's go with bear's suggestion as a start -- in any case, it can't hurt AFAICS
[17:10:41] <dwd> But in any case, we're reasonably sure that the communications team and the tech-review team can be formally disbanded?
[17:10:43] <bear> sounds like something the "social media" SIG can handle and make recommendations :)
[17:10:46] <Ashley> i'm assuming we're talking about articles that might exist somewhere on a public URL
[17:11:05] *bear invites Ashley to help form the SocialSIG with him
[17:11:06] <Kev> Ashley: Ah, I think we generally push 'unique' content.
[17:11:16] <Ashley> sure, that'd be fun bear!
[17:11:21] <Kev> Finding other stuff people have written sounds interesting.
[17:11:26] <bear> +1 to disbanding the formal comm and tech teams
[17:11:29] <stpeter> (just to back up, it appears we have agreement that the Technical Review Team was a nice idea but hasn't panned out -- shall we propose on the members@ list to disband that one?)
[17:11:35] <stpeter> heh
[17:11:45] <stpeter> bear: I think that's reasonable
[17:12:00] <dwd> Florian, ?
[17:12:01] <Ashley> reddit is a digg clone
[17:12:03] <stpeter> we can always start them again if needed / desired, but I don't see a need for them
[17:12:05] <Florian> yes
[17:12:07] <dwd> Ashley, ?
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[17:12:16] <Florian> +1
[17:12:22] <Ashley> sorry, backing up and reading :)
[17:12:26] <Florian> no more formal teams
[17:12:35] <Ashley> ah +1
[17:12:45] <dwd> OK.
[17:12:47] <bear> (well, iteam still remains as formal)?
[17:12:50] <Kev> Florian: I don't think the vote was for *all* teams?
[17:12:58] <Florian> not all, no :)
[17:13:08] <Florian> the tech and comm team
[17:13:12] <dwd> So, we'll scuttle to the next item...
[17:13:19] <Ashley> for example, here's ycombinators implementation of reddit: http://news.ycombinator.com/
[17:13:30] <dwd> Do we want either an Interop SIG or a FOSDEM Team?
[17:13:42] <stpeter> interesting
[17:13:53] <Florian> do we need one?
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[17:14:02] <Florian> I would say, let's allow teams if there are people for it
[17:14:04] <stpeter> FOSDEM just happens, doesn't it?
[17:14:41] <stpeter> Interop is a possibility, but we might want to just work on some code there first and we do have the interop@ email list
[17:15:27] <Florian> +1
[17:15:42] <dwd> stpeter, I think an "Interop SIG" is identical to the interop mailing list, except that it gets some XSF authority.
[17:15:51] <stpeter> dwd: FWIW yes
[17:16:17] <dwd> stpeter, And as for FOSDEM, we're trying to do quite a lot this year, and I think putting together a formal, if short-lived, team might help get some focus on that.
[17:16:19] <bear> +1 to Interop SIG and FOSDEM SIG - the latter happens organically it seems even if we don't "bless" it
[17:16:38] <Florian> +1
[17:16:43] <dwd> bear, Note I proposed a FOSDEM *team* - as in, members only.
[17:17:00] <bear> sorry - got carried away with the urge to type SIG
[17:17:15] <dwd> bear, Rather than allowing an open free-for-all, basically.
[17:17:17] *bear amends +1 to be for suggested breakdown
[17:17:34] <stpeter> dwd: it could be a standing team that gets active once a year -- we might want to have a separate OSCON team if we think that's important
[17:18:05] <bear> Events Team
[17:18:08] <Florian> let's start with a FOSDEM Team
[17:18:12] <Florian> and see how it goes :)
[17:18:17] <dwd> stpeter, I think a team that's dormant for 10 months of the year is the moral equivalent of a short-lived team, but yes, we can deal with that as we reach it.
[17:18:55] *stpeter is unconvinced that we need an events team since we can just coordinate on the members@ list
[17:19:18] <dwd> stpeter, It's useful having people to explicitly kick.
[17:19:58] <stpeter> perchance
[17:20:33] <bear> I need to run to a different meeting
[17:20:35] <dwd> Ashley, Any opinion? If not, we can take this one to the list.
[17:21:00] <Ashley> i don't feel particularly strongly either way. i do however agree with dwd's point
[17:21:27] <Ashley> i think need some sort of official POC or two for the events
[17:21:35] <dwd> OK, let's leave this to another time, then, if bear's going. We're still quorate for now, we'll discuss on the list.
[17:21:47] <dwd> Sorry. Unclear.
[17:22:00] <dwd> We're still quorate for now, however, we'll discuss on the list.
[17:22:04] <bear> :)
[17:22:07] <Florian> :)
[17:22:59] <dwd> OK, so I shall propose a motion to adjourn.
[17:23:16] <Ashley> +1
[17:23:20] <Florian> +1
[17:23:20] *bear seconds
[17:23:32] <bear> next meeting?
[17:23:41] <dwd> Same bat-time, same bat-channel.
[17:23:45] <bear> sweet
[17:23:55] <stpeter> does that mean next Wednesday?
[17:24:00] <dwd> It does.
[17:24:03] <Florian> +1
[17:24:05] *bear flees for much more boring but facetime required meeting
[17:24:09] <dwd> Except we have to call it Bat-Wednesday.
[17:24:14] <stpeter> ok, I will add it to the calendar
[17:24:26] <dwd> Ta.
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[17:24:44] <dwd> Florian, You writing up the minutes, then?
[17:25:16] <stpeter> I did some editing at http://typewith.me/xsf but was doing too many things at once :(
[17:25:42] <Florian> I can, I've got some notes on typewith.me
[17:25:55] <Florian> but I need to run out for a dinner
[17:26:00] <Florian> will send later tonight if that's ok
[17:26:35] <stpeter> sure
[17:26:40] <stpeter> I'll do some editing there as well
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[17:28:42] <stpeter> brb
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[17:35:12] <stpeter> calendar updated
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[17:52:09] <stpeter> http://typewith.me/xsf updated
[17:52:14] <stpeter> I need to run an errand, bbiab
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[17:56:37] <dwd> I can do them tomorrow, actually, I was only winding Florian up. :-)
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[17:57:05] <stpeter> heh
[17:57:08] <stpeter> anyway, bbiab
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