Monday, March 03, 2014
xsf@muc.xmpp.org
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XSF Discussion | Logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/xsf/ | Agenda https://trello.com/b/Dn6IQOu0/board-meetings

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ربـك خلـقنا آسيـاد نأمـر وننهـي.."

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[14:08:51] <Kev> What are people's plans for the meeting tomorrow?
[14:09:01] <Kev> I assume they mostly involve precis as well.
[14:09:38] <Kev> Which I thought was in the same room, but seems not to be.
[14:09:47] <Lloyd> Got an announcement regarding transport to the evening meetup going out by email today.
[14:10:29] <Kev> I mean the WG.
[14:10:31] <Kev> Although cool :)
[14:10:43] <Lloyd> (yeah just thought I'd update that bit too)
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[16:42:46] <dwd> Lloyd, You seem to have mis-spelt "Ubber".
[16:43:55] *dwd is virtually sitting in sipcore.
[16:44:21] <fippo> ugh
[16:44:25] <dwd> I have a horrible feeling our meetings sound this dull to an outsider.
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[16:45:12] <fippo> oh, go to AVTCORE or AVTEXT (-:
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[16:48:13] <Lloyd> dwd: As they were providing transport I felt it wouldn't be fair. Florian is coming though so we can refer to it as 'ubber' all we want :)
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[17:37:53] <fippo> "which lends itself to interoperability and federation thinking . things that are a bit less important these days" -- intraoperability is so much more cool, eh dwd? (guess where that is from)
[17:38:36] <dwd> Intra-operability is like masturbation for networked systems.
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[17:42:02] <Kev> No-one has any plans for meeting prior to precis, then?
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[18:21:04] <ralphm> fippo: link?
[18:21:29] <dwd> ralphm, That's from Tsahi's blog.
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[18:52:39] <ralphm> oh man, does that ever stop?
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[18:58:15] <SM> Did people give up on the federation angle?
[18:58:38] <Tobias> depends who you mean with people? :)
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[19:00:28] <SM> Well, I do not even see StPeter here. So it would be the rest:)
[19:00:51] <Tobias> right..since he's a machine who's 24/7 online
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[19:02:43] <ralphm> SM: wait what?
[19:03:38] <SM> Ralph, I wondered whetehr people (undefined) were still pushing for federation
[19:03:56] <fippo> ralphm: when tsahi says "federation" he talks about things like "sip federation" and rcs-e and joyn
[19:04:23] <fippo> which is a frequent misunderstand because we use federation for "run your own server and be part of the network. minimum requirements"
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[19:13:32] <ralphm> SM: within the XSF? Mostly everybody.
[19:14:19] <SM> Ralph, the door is still open for doing some PR. It won't last for long
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[19:19:11] <ralphm> SM: it's not like we can just pull open a can of PR people.
[19:19:34] <SM> I understand. Just mentioning it.
[19:20:24] <ralphm> SM: it's mostly stating the obvious, no offense. I wish I could find the time to write more, but I have been trying to keep up with Tweets mentioning XMPP and occasionally responding to falsehoods.
[19:20:34] <ralphm> Good writeups would be great.
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[20:21:17] <Ge0rG> are there XMPP-based services that generate large numbers of outgoing messages?
[20:22:18] <ralphm> superfeedr?
[20:24:20] <ralphm> Ge0rG: I can hook you up with julian if you want
[20:25:07] <Ge0rG> ralphm: I'm still pondering about xmpp spam prevention using proof-of-work
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[20:42:04] <fippo> https://www.imperialviolet.org/2014/03/03/triplehandshake.html <-- ugh, this seems like it might affect xmpp, in particular s2s?
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[20:43:58] <Tobias> " and protocols that depend on channel binding"
[20:45:14] <fippo> oh wait, we only use channel binding with scram plus and that is typically not used with client certs?
[20:45:50] <Ge0rG> I still wait for people to realize that client cert handshake is leaking big data
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[20:51:01] <fippo> hah. xmpp beats email again ( @ security mailing list)
[20:52:02] <Tobias> what security ml?
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[21:00:35] <fippo> security@xmpp.org
[21:02:01] <Tobias> got into spam :(
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[21:05:33] <Ge0rG> there is a security@ ml? wow!
[21:06:25] <Tobias> yeah...low traffic...because XMPP is soooo secure ^^
[21:12:59] <fippo> "[discuss-webrtc] How Do I know If Someon is Online To Take A WebRTC Call?" -- i am tempted to reply "use presence, it's the new dialtone"
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[22:04:01] <ralphm> I hope intosi is reading that list, as he's been looking into dkim issues
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[22:05:39] <ralphm> in general, though, gmail and others services don't really like independent mail servers sending out, you know, mai; to them
[22:05:46] <ralphm> mail even
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[22:28:38] <xnyhps> fippo: I think TLS resumptions is a requirement for that attack, and (I'd love to be corrected about this) I don't think anyone in the XMPP world uses that.
[22:28:43] <xnyhps> Because of StartTLS etc.
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[22:36:47] <dwd> xnyhps, Actually, it's better than that. You need clients that don't validate certificates and just rely on channel binding.
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[22:39:56] <dwd> xnyhps, BTW, if you've got a minute at some point, it'd be great to hear how STRINT went. But not now, because I'm old and need my sleep. :-)
[22:40:43] <fippo> dwd: I heard that strint was rather boring (-:
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[22:51:53] <xnyhps> dwd: Ah, I missed that when I read it.
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[22:55:57] <ralphm> dwd, xnyhps: I think it would be pretty useful to blog this on xmpp.org
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[23:00:57] <xnyhps> I happen to have a series of blog posts about HTTPS attacks and how they translate to XMPP. (Where the "series" is right now at 1 item)
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[23:04:43] <ralphm> heh
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[23:18:38] <ralphm> \-
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