Saturday, November 28, 2015
xsf@muc.xmpp.org
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XSF Discussion | Logs: http://logs.xmpp.org/xsf/ | Agenda https://trello.com/b/Dn6IQOu0/board-meetings

[00:00:01] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "online"
[00:00:01] *** dwd shows as "online"
[00:01:33] *** Jef shows as "online"
[00:03:34] *** xnyhps shows as "online"
[00:04:25] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[00:26:37] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "online"
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[00:37:21] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[00:41:23] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "online"
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[00:43:44] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[00:44:11] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "online"
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[00:44:58] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[00:46:12] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[00:53:18] *** m&m has joined the room
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[00:58:45] *** Jef shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[01:02:35] *** tim@boese-ban.de shows as "online"
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[01:31:01] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[01:31:22] *** bjc shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
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[01:40:47] *** Tobias shows as "online"
[01:40:51] *** Jef shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[01:47:18] *** google-is-lord has left the room
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[08:19:00] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[08:42:45] *** sezuan shows as "online" and his status message is "Urlaub in den Misanthropen."
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[09:03:50] *** dwd shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[09:07:03] *** Flow shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[09:07:05] *** Flow shows as "online"
[09:09:33] *** Lance has joined the room
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[09:18:39] *** Flow shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
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[09:54:04] *** daurnimator shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[09:58:15] *** Flow shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[09:58:27] *** dwd has left the room
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[10:04:04] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[10:04:05] *** Tobias shows as "away"
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[10:08:15] *** Flow shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[10:18:20] *** dwd shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[10:18:21] *** dwd has left the room
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[10:23:22] *** daurnimator shows as "online"
[10:28:20] *** dwd shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[10:28:52] *** daurnimator shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
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[10:48:22] *** daurnimator shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[10:48:24] *** dwd has left the room
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[10:57:48] *** sezuan shows as "online" and his status message is "Urlaub in den Misanthropen."
[10:58:22] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[11:02:21] *** dwd has left the room
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[11:09:58] *** Kevish has left the room
[11:10:06] *** McKael shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
[11:10:51] *** intosi has joined the room
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[11:11:25] *** McKael shows as "online"
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[11:15:00] *** dwd shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[11:24:15] *** Lance shows as "away"
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[11:26:27] *** McKael shows as "away" and his status message is "Auto-away (idle)"
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[12:06:34] *** Tobias shows as "online"
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[12:16:43] *** Tobias shows as "away"
[12:18:09] *** Neustradamus shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[12:18:09] *** Neustradamus shows as "away" and his status message is "Away"
[12:18:40] *** dwd shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[12:19:55] *** daurnimator shows as "away" and his status message is " (Away as a result of being idle more than 5 min)"
[12:20:28] *** daniel has joined the room
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[12:28:40] *** dwd shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[12:29:55] *** daurnimator shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
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[12:57:35] *** Flow shows as "xa" and his status message is " (Not available as a result of being idle more than 15 min)"
[12:58:08] *** dwd shows as "online"
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[14:58:08] <Link Mauve> Sigh… https://github.com/candy-chat/candy/issues/445
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[15:00:23] <SamWhited> This is why XHTML-IM needs to be replaced. I know technically it's secure, but it's too easy for people to screw it up.
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[15:02:37] <Link Mauve> Web people manage to screw up without its help, you know.
[15:03:00] <SamWhited> Exactly, the situation is bad enough as is without us encouraging it :)
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[15:03:47] <Link Mauve> I think on the contrary, specifying a whitelist helps people get things right.
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[15:04:42] *** arty shows as "away" and his status message is "I'm not here right now"
[15:04:59] <SamWhited> Oh yah, the xep does it right, but no one actually reads standards.
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[15:06:55] <Link Mauve> Meh, Candy’s latest version seems actually pretty buggy.
[15:07:05] <SamWhited> (I'm only sort of being facetious now...)
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[15:09:35] <daniel> but hey html in text message is a really good idea
[15:10:27] <Zash> So are you submitting a patch? ;)
[15:11:45] <Kevish> I'm not convinced that removing xhtml-im would improve anything.
[15:12:26] <Kevish> People who just want pretty text and don't care about how they do it are no better off without a spec telling them they're being silly, certainly, and for people who want pretty text and do care, it's helpful to give a 'right way' to do it.
[15:12:56] <Link Mauve> I fully agree with that.
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[15:31:06] <SamWhited> Nah, if we gave them basic-formatting-language-im I don't think they'd add script tags too it or inject out straight into the dom.
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[15:32:10] <Link Mauve> You seem to be overestimating them.
[15:32:11] <Zash> That's exactly what would happen
[15:32:39] <Link Mauve> innerHTML is easy to use, and there is nothing that could harm the user in this new language right!
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[15:49:59] <SamWhited> Fair enough :(
[15:51:43] <SamWhited> Yah, it's true; no idea where that burst of optimism came from, but you're right of course.
[15:54:17] <Kevish> Nor me, but it's obviously not healthy :)
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[17:22:22] <Link Mauve> edhelas just reminded me that his client used to pass the body itself to the DOM. :p
[17:22:27] <Link Mauve> Without implementing XHTML-IM.
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[17:33:51] <SamWhited> Theoretically the body is escaped though, so as long as you're not unescaping it you should be good (though it never hurts to double check).
[17:34:33] <SamWhited> I'm sure your could find a way to exploit it if you're sticking anything straight into the DOM
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[17:37:53] <Link Mauve> No, there is no escaping in the strings you get from your XMPP library.
[17:38:11] <Link Mauve> It’s always the application role to escape things as they see fit.
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[17:39:28] <Kevish> Right. The body's escaped on the wire, but what you get out of your XMPP lib isn't going to be.
[17:40:34] <Zash> unless it's a really bad lib made of regexes
[17:40:39] <Link Mauve> :D
[17:41:11] <Zash> Also depends on how you put stuff into the DOM
[17:41:24] <Link Mauve> innerHTML ALL the things. o/
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[23:32:57] *** daurnimator has joined the room
[23:32:58] *** dwd has left the room
[23:34:00] *** dwd shows as "online"
[23:42:19] *** dwd has left the room
[23:42:20] *** dwd has left the room
[23:42:50] *** dwd shows as "online"
[23:43:05] *** dwd shows as "online"
[23:45:28] *** bear shows as "away"
[23:46:17] *** google-is-lord has left the room
[23:48:38] *** foss81405971 has joined the room
[23:48:54] *** google-is-lord shows as "online"
[23:50:05] *** dwd has left the room
[23:50:47] *** dwd shows as "online"
[23:51:09] *** bingooo has joined the room
[23:55:13] *** dwd has left the room
[23:56:02] *** dwd shows as "online"