pep.jc: at CCC, the "assembly" was used to designate the tables and chairs where we were seated. We organized a meetup separately, (they call that self-organized sessions), which is what I talk about in my email
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Ge0rGjc: you MUST mention that it's the 20 years of Jabber anniversary edition
pep.True
Ge0rGI wonder if jc will come back and see the backlog
debacleHappy Birthday, XMPP! 20th Anniversary of 1st Jabber Server https://fr.movim.eu/?blog/debacle%40movim.eu/happy-birthday-xmpp-20th-anniversary-of-1st-jabber-server-IBmtu8
Ge0rGdebacle: your post is also something for HN frontpage ;)
debaclefortunately, it's edhelas server, not mine!
Ge0rGhe-he-he!
Ge0rGdebacle: can you add the original link?
debacleI did now, Ge0rG (thanks for the link, and thanks to myself, that I used Movim for the post, not Diaspora - the latter does not support corrections)
pep.(and it's not XMPP either, is it.)
Ge0rGdebacle: do you have a HN account you want to get karma on?
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pep.You're also certainly going to see lots of naysayers
Ge0rGpep.: I don't mind
Ge0rGbad publicity is good publicity
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debaclewaiting for the "official XMPP obituary" from Signal, Matrix, etc. As Mark Twain said: "The rumours of my death have been greatly exaggerated"
jcHey, I'll update the newsletter but at least one person should proofread please
debaclemy English is too German for this task
jcOh, I guess pep. did already...
jcpep. fixed thanks
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pep.I tried yes, with the disclaimer that I'm no native speaker :-°
Ge0rGjc: I'd suggest to merge the three Logitech paragraphs into one
jonas’looking at it
Ge0rGjc: and https://www.linuxjournal.com/content/lessons-vendor-lock-messaging should be moved into a prominent position in the context of the 20th birthday
Ge0rGBecause it's essentially what I would have written for the birthday blog if I had the time
jcProofreading is not only to fix English spelling and grammatical mistakes, but to find broken links or places where I wrote something wrong or stupid
jcGe0rG: ack
jcHaha... from the Slashdot comments: "You can do the exact same thing with IRC. Just get on an IRC server and don't join any channels"
jonas’jc, lgtm, am I stupid or didn’t you get around to add the anniversary yet?
oliyeah, but without a push server it won't work on iOS
Link Mauveoli, I’m pretty sure iOS support wasn’t a thing back in 1999. :p
jcThe joke of the Slashdot comment is is that no-one's using XMPP...
oliLink Mauve: but there were PDAs
olithey had no imagination
Link Mauveoli, PDAs didn’t actively prevent TCP connections from working, nor had a vendor priviledged TCP connection.
Ge0rGwrote a PDA IRC client back in 2001.
Link MauveiOS issues have been created by Apple, for Apple.
Ge0rGLink Mauve: back in that time, there were no malicious app providers who would mine cryptocoins on your phone.
olii know i know, but wasn't it obvious that this has ti be the direction we were heading
Ge0rGLink Mauve: sadly, Apple had good reasons to make those limitations
olii wonder if there are some posts for the 10th anniversary worth mentionning?
Ge0rGjc: the links all look fine to me. Might add this to clients:
- Monal releases [3.3 on iOS and 2.3 on macOS](https://monal.im/blog/ios-release-and-mac-mute/)
jcjonas’: I've pushed an update to the newsletter mentioning the anniversary if you're interested in checking
Ge0rGjc: s/20th anniversary of the first Jabber server release./20th anniversary of Jabber./ please. I think it's more weightily and more approriate
jcGe0rG: I wrote it a bit different from that...
jcNot sure if it's too short or dry now
Ge0rGjc: it's perfect. I'm trying to think of a good bridge to the Linux Journal article
jonas’"... fitting the spirit of the anniversary season, the linux journal has a reminder on why vendor lock-in in instant-messaging is a bad thing" ?
jcTo be completely honest, I wasn't that impressed with the Linux Journal article
jcI think I could write something better
jonas’I haven’t read it
jcbut don't have the time anymore
Ge0rG> Linux Journal has published an article [Lessons in Vendor Lock-in: Messaging], reflecting over the last 20 years of instant messaging and lamenting the fact that open and standardized messaging hasn't taken off as expected.
Ge0rGjc: you could, I could. But we didn't. That article is good enough and we are EBUSY
jcGe0rG: reflecting "on", not over
Ge0rG👍
olithere is a linux mag interview with jeremie from 2001.
jcoli: Link?
Ge0rGhttp://www.linux-mag.com/id/902/
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olihttp://www.linux-mag.com/id/902/
jonas’I find "lament" a bit whiney, but this might be my non-native tongue speaking
jcThe article is whiny
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jcThe German translations sound a bit worse to me TBH
jcThan how I read "lament"... but we can change it
Ge0rGI don't like the word "lament" either, but lack a proper alternative
jonas’omit the entire half-sentence?
jcWe can just remove the word...
Ge0rG> We can just remove the word...
👍
jcI think it's much better now, pls have a look
jcI also link to the Linux Mag article and /. announcement
Ge0rGSo if we all meet here at 16:00 UTC to submit and upvote, we can make front-page
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jcGe0rG: OK
Ge0rG(that's massive over engineering to get the attention of some valley bros)
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pep.Indeed
pep.Things you have to do today to get some attention..
olido i need a user account?
pep.And they will certainly be the firsts to whine about it, "isn't XMPP dead already?"
pep."What you don't use Slack?"
jcoli: if you want to be able to comment and vote, yes
jcpep.: The main arguments usually are
1. XML, yuck!
2. Clients all suck and look old
olipep., fun part: jeremie worked on telehash and community support is on slack
pep.jc, yeah I know these arguments
olimy main "argument" would be: matrix is the new jabber
pep.You mean matrix is redoing jabber? :)
Ge0rGthere is no link to the newsletter at https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/News_and_Articles_for_the_next_XMPP_Newsletter
Ge0rGfixed.
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pep.That Linux Journal article uses "Jabber" and "XMPP" weirdly. I know it's never really clear, but I don't think "XMPP plugins" are a thing at all (nor is a "Jabber plugin", or maybe it was at the time?)
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olibtw, is the jabber server software from 1999 still available? was it ever released as open source?
Ge0rGoli: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jabberd14
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oliI don't find any jabber server in 1999
olifrom 1999
oliIn the jabberd14 repository the first commit was in June 2000.
https://github.com/mawis/jabberd/tree/jer/jabberd14/jabberd
NeustradamusThere is a jabberd2 too if you want
Ge0rGoli: that looks like an import from whatever (svn) into git, without keeping the history
Ge0rGcan somebody parse out of https://web.archive.org/web/20060615062408/http://svn.jabberd.org:80/
oliI'm asking, because that code is also part of the jabber history. Some guy ported KDE 1 and KDE 2 to compile on recent Linux.
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Ge0rGhttps://web.archive.org/web/*/http://svn.jabberd.org:80/tags/pre-1_1_3/jabberd14/ is empty :(
jcHey folks, ready for submission?
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Ge0rG.o/
jcWho's going to submit what? debacle, do you want to submit your blog post?
Ge0rGI can submit anything/everything
jcIMO it would be better if each article is submitted by someone else
jcWould look a bit less like spamming
Ge0rGright
jcGe0rG: you could submit the Slashdot article, and I'll submit the newsletter (or vice versa)
jcAnd debacle the blog post
jcor someone else
Ge0rGthe Slashdot article has a sub-optimal title for HN, but we can try
jcYou can choose your own title though
Ge0rGjc: but it's frowned upon
jchttps://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18824911
Ge0rGjc: you submit the newsletter and I can do either debacle's post or the Slashdot
pep.jc, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65dYsNJ3548 a scene from the anime with subtitles :p
jc....aaaaaand it's gone
pep.noooo
pep.陰謀だ!!
jcwell... looks like the newsletter one was shadowbanned...
jcit's nowhere to be found
Ge0rGjc: at least you are not shadowbanned.
jcI wouldn't know, would I? I guess I"m not since you see my comments
Ge0rGjc: exactly. Also you can open a private tab and point it to HN
Ge0rGjc: want to make another approach?
oliyou can try on facebook 💩
jcI'll pass
jcGe0rG: what do you have in mind?
jcI'm ok with calling it a day and moving on, but someone else can still submit debacle's article
Ge0rGjc: submit debacle's post
jcThere is also still reddit and other places
Ge0rGjc: so either you submit it now, or I submit it and you upvote and then you can call it a day :D
jcGe0rG: what's funny is that I see my karma only going up by 2, but the newsletter post had 9 points, so that sounds almost like 7 points aren't counted (like you suggested)
jcGe0rG go for it
Ge0rGjc: "Happy Birthday, XMPP 20th Anniversary of Jabber" on https://news.ycombinator.com/newest
pep.The slshdot article is back as #30 !!
pep.And the happy birthday thing is #6
pep.wth
pep.#3!
pep.jc, smart comment
jcBack from the dead
pep.#2!
jcGe0rG: good of you to suggest we try one more time. 3rd time lucky
Ge0rGdown to #6 now
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pep.yeah and it's not going up
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jcI'm debugging something, so might leave/join the room constantly, please bear with me
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pep.Ge0rG, you're stilling all debacle's karma :P
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jcYou snooze you lose
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Link Mauvearnaudj, do you plan on translating this month’s newsletter? If not soon, I’ll start something.
erkanfilesI could help translating to german... Link Mauve
Link MauveThat’d be very welcome!
erkanfiles> That’d be very welcome!
How to, where to and till when?
Link Mauveerkanfiles, hmm, the easiest way is to copy the English version into an Etherpad if you are working on it with other people (even if just for proof-reading), and then start translating. :)
Link MauveIt can be quite frustrating if this is your first time, don’t hesitate to ask us for explanations for what something means.
Link MauveThere is no deadline, you can do it pretty much whenever you want.
erkanfilesWhere may I find the current version? Are there existing etherpads or shall I create one?
erkanfiles> It can be quite frustrating if this is your first time, don’t hesitate to ask us for explanations for what something means.
Thx, Ge0rG helped me out with the minutes from dec 20th, there were some points I didnt get ;-)
Link Mauvehttps://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/blob/master/content/posts/newsletter/2019-01-04.md would be the current version.
Link MauveMost likely the final one.
jcI think we should update the xmpp.org website to host the translations
jcThen translators can simply work there and there's one standardized way of doing things
jcCan Pelican handle i18n?
jcWould actually be good to have FR and DE (and ES etc.) versions of the site
Ge0rGerkanfiles: sorry, I didn't manage to forward the minutes yet. 😥
pep.Link Mauve, if you have that etherpad up I can help