XMPP Council - 2013-11-27

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  21. fippo

    are there diffs for the 0124 and 0206 changes?

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  23. fippo

    the template needs an update to use &LEGALNOTICE;

  24. Kev

    fippo: http://xmpp.org/extensions/diff/

  25. fippo

    thanks kev

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  30. Kev

    So Event Logging's off the agenda, if it's not been updated, presumably.

  31. Tobias is just working through last meetings agenda :)

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  33. Tobias

    regarding rayo-fax, isn't sending and receiving facsimile via bare HTTP kind of insecure? how can you be sure you've got the right document?

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  35. Tobias

    are the changes to XEP-0206 really just the remove of references to RFC 3920?

  36. Lance

    Tobias: yeah, all of the substantive fixes are in 124

  37. Tobias


  38. Kev

    Is it only me who thinks dynamic-forms is a little like 301 for 004?

  39. Lance

    heh, that's a pretty good comparison

  40. Kev

    The note beneath example 3 is a bit wonky, it seems to be mandating the tab order in the UI.

  41. Lance

    i like the idea of dynamic forms, but i think the xml bits as defined are too messy

  42. Kev

    Do we habitually only show payloads without the wrapping stanzas anywhere else?

  43. Lance

    yes, we do that sometimes

  44. Lance

    the PEP ones in particular

  45. Lance

    but that's in an explicit data format section

  46. fippo

    kev: 0167 does that as well

  47. fippo

    in an "application format" section

  48. Kev

    OK, ta.

  49. Kev

    Hmm, errors with type='result' is a bit odd.

  50. Kev

    I was hoping to get everything reviewed in 2 hours. It's nearly been one, and I'm still on dynamic forms.

  51. fippo

    ah... i'll have to vote on-list then :-/

  52. fippo

    at least for that item

  53. Kev

    I'm not convinced about some bits of this, not enough to block Experimental, I think, but I think it'd need rework before Draft.

  54. Lance

    what would block experimental, in general?

  55. Kev

    I'd generally block Experimental if something was clearly broken, or conflicted with existing specs.

  56. Kev

    I really want some chocolate before Council. Who wants to provide some? :)

  57. Lance

    yay, winfried reviewed the bosh updates

  58. Tobias

    the wizard stuff reminds me of the horror of adjusting to QWizards strange innards :)

  59. fippo

    "Patches to XEP-0206 only delete refs, without replacing them" sounds like he used the diff tool

  60. Tobias

    fippo, yeah...it seems to have problems with out cites

  61. Tobias

    Kev, how does it mandate tab ordering?

  62. Tobias

    you mean "should wait for the response before deciding which control is the next control to go to."?

  63. Kev


  64. Tobias

    it'd be doable...but what if the user just clicks on a another field...but yeah...it's not such nice of an experience

  65. Kev

    But why should it be doing this?

  66. Tobias

    probably preventing navigation to a field that a server-pushed update is removing

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  70. fippo

    we start in 19 minutes, right?

  71. Tobias


  72. fippo drives home. will be back in time

  73. Lance

    For reference, here's the patch for 124 I missed when collecting them all: http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2013-February/027118.html

  74. Kev

    Does that mean we're not advancing 124 today?

  75. Lance

    I think so

  76. Lance


  77. Lance

    But keep it on the agenda to bring up any issues that have been found so far

  78. Kev

    And I'm finished reviewing stuff with 8 minutes to spare. Go me.

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  80. Kev

    And it's timee

  81. Kev

    1) Roll call

  82. Lance


  83. Kev

    (I've poked Matt)

  84. fippo


  85. Tobias


  86. Tobias

    Kev, both?

  87. Kev


  88. Tobias


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  90. Kev

    2) http://xmpp.org/extensions/tmp/xep-0124-1.11.html

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  92. Tobias

    mattm isn't on the council anymore :)

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  94. Kev

    Lance still has pending changes before publishing 1.11, but are there any objections to what's there so far?

  95. MattJ

    I'm going to vote on BOSH on-list, I likely have quite a bit of feedback (I already pointed out one issue with the new doc)

  96. Tobias

    http://xmpp.org/extensions/diff/api/xep/0124/diff/1.10/vs/1.11rc1#added-diff-15 <--space separated -> comma-separated is it just fixing the documentation or is it implemented in both ways out there?

  97. MattJ

    But I may not object if the remainder isn't serious

  98. MattJ

    But stpeter said he would put up a new version

  99. MattJ


  100. Kev


  101. fippo

    looked good to me so far

  102. Lance

    Tobias: the text used to say space, but the example used commas

  103. Kev

    3) http://xmpp.org/extensions/tmp/xep-0206-1.4.html

  104. Tobias

    Lance, ahh..okay..and out there it's implemented with commas

  105. Tobias

    i'm +1 on 206

  106. fippo

    i'm +1 too

  107. Kev

    I'm +1

  108. Lance

    +1 for 206

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  110. Kev


  111. MattJ

    One sec, checking my notes

  112. Kev

    Oh, right, on list for this too, I guess.

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  114. Kev

    Or not :)

  115. MattJ

    +1 on this

  116. Kev

    4) http://xmpp.org/extensions/tmp/xep-0156-1.1.html

  117. Kev

    Anyone? I'm +1

  118. Tobias


  119. Lance


  120. MattJ


  121. fippo

    yeah... i had a nit but poked lance

  122. fippo

    which resolved it so +1

  123. Kev


  124. Kev

    5) http://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/dynamic-forms.html

  125. Lance

    i have reservations with how this one is defined

  126. fippo

    i'll vote on list, no time to review it yet

  127. Lance

    not enough to block experimental, but it would need significant reworking

  128. ralphm

    Lance: agreed

  129. Kev

    I'm not blocking Experimental, although I think it needs work.

  130. Tobias

    i like the general idea and what possibilites it enables, although we don't want to enforce to much constraints on the UI

  131. MattJ

    I'm +1 for experimental

  132. Kev

    Tobias: What's that in terms of block or not?

  133. Tobias

    i'm okay with accepting it as experimental...but before it goes to draft this should be taken care of, at least discussed in the XEP

  134. Kev


  135. Kev

    The new eventlogging was on the agenda, but that's not been published yet so it'll have to wait.

  136. Kev

    6) Date of next.

  137. Kev

    I'm not able to make next week, so up to everyone else if you meet without me.

  138. MattJ

    I'm ok for next week

  139. Lance checks calendar

  140. Lance

    oh, i won't be able to make next week either

  141. Dave Cridland stripes calendar

  142. Kev

    Meetings usually get a little eratic around Christmas.

  143. Kev


  144. fippo

    next week works for me, the week after that likely doesn't

  145. Kev


  146. MattJ

    I can make both weeks

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  148. Tobias

    both works

  149. Dave Cridland


  150. Kev

    Ok, so Tobias, Matt, Fippo want to meet just the three of you?

  151. Kev

    Just +1/-1 for the sake of ease, please.

  152. Tobias

    i broke key input on mac by enabling assistive technologies

  153. MattJ

    -1, I don't see an urgency

  154. fippo

    -1, if something comes up we can still coordinate quick enough

  155. Kev

    (This is taking longer than any of the real items!)

  156. ralphm

    Just schedule all weeks. If no quorum, defer.

  157. MattJ

    It's a complex issue

  158. Kev

    OK, good enough. Shall we meet the following week, then?

  159. MattJ


  160. Lance


  161. Dave Cridland

    ralphm, Ha! Back in our day [etc]

  162. Tobias


  163. Kev

    ralphm: Planning to not have quorum seems ill-advisable.

  164. Kev

    7) AOB?

  165. MattJ

    ralphm, Dave Cridland: Don't you have a video call to attend to? ;)

  166. fippo

    ben langfield updated the nits in the rayo-cpa and -fax btw

  167. MattJ

    Kev, none here

  168. winfried

    Can I drop in a bit?

  169. Tobias

    none XSF related from me

  170. Kev

    winfried: Sure.

  171. ralphm

    Kev: Good, I'm not advising you plan to not have quorum.

  172. winfried

    I checked the XEP-0124 and XEP-0206 changes against te lists we made at FOSDEM

  173. winfried

    there are still some patches misssing and some (minor) issues with the patches

  174. winfried

    (sorry for doing this so late)

  175. MattJ

    winfried, can you post to the list?

  176. ralphm

    winfried: you should post that to the list

  177. MattJ

    Since I'm to do the same anyway

  178. Dave Cridland

    He has.

  179. fippo

    he did.

  180. Kev

    winfried already has :)

  181. MattJ

    Oh :P

  182. ralphm


  183. MattJ

    Well I'll take a look then, must have missed it

  184. Kev

    Only just before Council.

  185. Lance

    that's why I asked for 124 to be postponed for me to correct those

  186. winfried


  187. Kev

    winfried: Anything to discuss here? We delayed 124 anyway.

  188. MattJ

    Got it

  189. Dave Cridland

    winfried, Is there any sense if putting through this update and then adding the open issues later?

  190. Dave Cridland

    winfried, Perfect being the enemy of good, and all that.

  191. winfried

    the missing patch of M&M better should be incorporated

  192. winfried

    other updates can be done later

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  194. winfried

    (maybe better even)

  195. Kev

    This can all happen on list, yes? There's no Council actions here.

  196. winfried


  197. Kev


  198. Kev

    Thanks all.

  199. Kev bangs the gavel

  200. MattJ

    Thanks Kev

  201. winfried


  202. Tobias

    thanks kev

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  206. MattJ

    Simon, nothing to see here, just discussing BO*H

  207. winfried


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