XMPP Council - 2019-11-27


  1. jonas’ .
  2. Ge0rG ..
  3. Dave Cridland ...
  4. Zash Soon
  5. Ge0rG Too soon?
  6. Ge0rG maybe even Noonien Soong?
  7. Ge0rG It's time!
  8. daniel Hi
  9. Dave Cridland OK!
  10. Dave Cridland 1) Roll Call
  11. jonas’ is here
  12. Dave Cridland Do we have everyone?
  13. Zash here
  14. Ge0rG .
  15. Dave Cridland of course
  16. daniel and me
  17. Dave Cridland Right, that's everyone.
  18. Dave Cridland Kept counting and missing someone because jonas’ responded so quick. :-)
  19. Dave Cridland 2) Agenda Bashing
  20. jonas’ haha
  21. Dave Cridland The only thing I'd like to do is vote in a new Chair.
  22. Dave Cridland So:
  23. Dave Cridland 3) Nominations for XMPP Council Chair
  24. jonas’ I nominate myself
  25. Dave Cridland Anyone else?
  26. Dave Cridland OK.
  27. Dave Cridland Well, this should make the voting simple.
  28. Ge0rG I've been thinking a while about volunteering for that, but honestly, I just don't have the time.
  29. Dave Cridland 4) Voting:
  30. Dave Cridland We don't have anyone else nominated, so this seems a bit pointless, but I think we technically vote, so:
  31. Dave Cridland I vote for jonas’ :-)
  32. daniel +1
  33. Ge0rG +1 for jonas’
  34. jonas’ I abstain ;)
  35. Zash +1
  36. Ge0rG that makes it a +4/1/-0
  37. Dave Cridland jonas’, You realise your abstention means the vote isn't unanimous by some measurements?
  38. jonas’ Dave Cridland, I am fine with that, unless we need an unanimous vote to proceed
  39. Dave Cridland Nope.
  40. Dave Cridland jonas’, Your meeting, then. Thanks for volunteering!
  41. jonas’ Thanks for your trust. I shall use it wisely.
  42. jonas’ 5) Date of next
  43. jonas’ (and regular meeting time rhythm)
  44. jonas’ This timeslot works well for me for various reasons and I’d like to keep it, if nobody has objections.
  45. Ge0rG Generally this timeslot works for me as well, but I'll be on the road next week
  46. daniel yes the timeslot is fine
  47. Zash Should work for me too
  48. Dave Cridland This timeslot works for me. Presumably if we find it becomes tricky in practise we can review it.
  49. jonas’ sure
  50. jonas’ 6) AOB
  51. jonas’ I have one, but I’d like to let others go first
  52. Dave Cridland waits for Ge0rG.
  53. Dave Cridland I have nothing.
  54. Ge0rG I wanted to mention https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/issues/653 as kind-of-needs-Council
  55. Ge0rG And right now, I don't have anything
  56. Ge0rG All my usual AOBs, while still not clarified, can wait
  57. jonas’ Ge0rG, good point
  58. jonas’ (I should try to make poezio show chat states in a non-obstrusive way for this room.)
  59. jonas’ assuming noone else:
  60. jonas’ quick summary of how I intend to do this: My goal would be to send the agenda by tuesdays, 20:00Z, since I can dedicate much of the time frame from 19:00Z to 20:00Z to this generally
  61. jonas’ so it’s not the 24h-in-advance agenda which would be ideal, but this allows me to dedicate time to collecting everything properly, which is hopefully worth something
  62. jonas’ (at the same time, I hope to use the remainder of that time slot for editor duties, but that’s slightly off-topic)
  63. jonas’ if you have any agenda items which are not in xsf/xeps tagged as Needs Council, send them directly to me (mailto:jonas@zombofant.net or xmpp same address)
  64. jonas’ if you send them to standards@, please CC my mail address explicitly so that I get a copy in a separate inbox
  65. daniel sounds good. thank you jonas’
  66. jonas’ I think that’s it from me
  67. jonas’ if you’ve got any suggestions on how we should run this, I’m of course open for that
  68. Ge0rG jonas’: sounds great (except that this is not the same xmpp address as in your Council application)
  69. Dave Cridland Recreating the Spreadsheet of Doom might be useful.
  70. jonas’ Ge0rG, the other one works too, of course
  71. jonas’ Dave Cridland, good point
  72. pep. We might want to write this down somewhere?
  73. Dave Cridland I'll see if I can find a copy of the last one and hand it over to jonas’ if there's interest?
  74. pep. Wiki might be a good start
  75. pep. "Council process for 2019/2020 term" or sth
  76. jonas’ Dave Cridland, can’t harm
  77. Ge0rG I must say, I didn't miss the Spreadsheet of Doom as much after Tedd started sending those weekly vote summaries. Huge thanks to Tedd BTW
  78. pep. read "process" with lots of quotes
  79. jonas’ pep., someone certainly could. I see you volunteered?
  80. pep. did I?
  81. jonas’ (the submission suggestions I’ll put below each agenda mail just like dave did, because that’s a good thing IMO)
  82. pep. That'd be great if council could handle that themselves tbh
  83. jonas’ pep., I agree.
  84. pep. They know better
  85. jonas’ +should
  86. Dave Cridland pep., Seems more of a Board thing. :-P
  87. pep. Dave Cridland, to choose meeting dates and internal council processes? :)
  88. Dave Cridland pep., To put things in Wiki pages. :-)
  89. pep. board can appoint people to do that for sure :-°
  90. Dave Cridland Well played.
  91. Ge0rG Can board appoint somebody to make our wiki mobile-friendly?
  92. jonas’ I think this is getting off-topic.
  93. pep. Sorry
  94. jonas’ Thanks for your additional input and trust again :)
  95. jonas’ 7) Ite, Meeting Est.
  96. Zash Woop
  97. Dave Cridland Thanks, jonas’!
  98. jonas’ one way to deal with the spreadsheet-of-doom thing would be to re-vive Secretary
  99. jonas’ also, if I read this correctly, Ge0rG has superpowers in this room. I’d like to have it so that I can see real JIDs here for a quick identity check, too.
  100. Ge0rG jonas’: I'm sorry, my powers are not super enough to do that.
  101. jonas’ fascinating, then the sorting in poezio is misleading
  102. pep. indeed
  103. jonas’ re-routing my request to ralphm or Kev: I’d like to have it so that I can see real JIDs here for a quick identity check, too.
  104. Zash Ge0rG: I looked at the wiki btw. Unfortunately it's yet another herd of hairy yaks.
  105. Ge0rG Zash: that's sad to hear.
  106. Ge0rG Zash: you could start with your bio for the Council page, though ;)
  107. jonas’ If only we had working Reactions.
  108. jonas’ then Secretary could use those to acknowledge understanding of messages instead of a full message, reducing the cognitive load
  109. Dave Cridland I did https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/656 BTW, so I'd hold off on the bios until that's merged.
  110. Zash Any suggestions?
  111. jonas’ Zash, something prosody? I don’t know what and if your dayjob has anything to do with XMPP.
  112. Zash Prosody and Prosody accessiores.
  113. jonas’ Dave Cridland, merged
  114. pep. jonas’, maybe get Tedd onboard with secretary? I think that would be a great addition to council's panel (a bit of automation) if people have some time to invest
  115. jonas’ pep., problem is that secretary wasn’t well received due to the level of noise it produced
  116. jonas’ I’m not sure how to reduce the level of noise though
  117. jonas’ writing the software itself isn’t an issue
  118. pep. Design issues that can probably be worked out
  119. jonas’ pep., then suggestions are stronly welcome
  120. pep. Also people need to learn how to work with tools if it can alleviate some work from other volunteers :)
  121. pep. (and tools can be changed)
  122. jonas’ pep., yes please make suggestions how to change the tools
  123. jonas’ we don’t have a way to send messages which are shown in a more "bland" way by default, so the choices seem to be "not confirm actions explicitly" (which can be dangerous since votes are involved) or "clutter the backlog", both of which are quite meh
  124. jonas’ pep., https://logs.xmpp.org/council/2019-01-23#2019-01-23-c7e1846fae720801 here’s the last meeting with secretary where it became quite apparent
  125. Ge0rG Isn't a tool a tool because they *can't* be changed? :P
  126. jonas’ Looking at the backlog, things might be slightly improved if the power to manage polls is at the chair only
  127. jonas’ (manage = create, delete, rename)
  128. jonas’ anyways, gotta take care of some soup
  129. pep. jonas’, I think most of the confusion was that people didn't know how to talk to the bot? Or get their vote counted?
  130. pep. Also votes were created during the meeting and not beforehand?
  131. jonas’ the former: maybe
  132. jonas’ the latter: yes, which is also a good-ish thing because Secretary will announce additional metadata on the just-created poll and it marks it as "active", i.e. vote commadns without context will be attached to that poll
  133. jonas’ this could probably be improved by adding an "agenda" layer
  134. jonas’ maybe I should go in that direction an play with that a little
  135. Zash The more that has been prepared beforehand, the better
  136. pep. I'm happy to betatest in some channel of your choice later on :)
  137. jonas’ pep., you can bookmark botkindergarten@conference.zombofant.net
  138. pep. done
  139. jonas’ there’s a Secretary there right now, but it’s broken for a reason I don’t know
  140. Ge0rG 0410?