XMPP Council - 2021-10-06

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  77. Ge0rG Minor reminder that I got a conflicting appointment today.
  78. jonas’ thanks
  79. jonas’ 1) Roll Call
  80. jonas’ .
  81. Zash Here.
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  84. jonas’ do we get a dwd and or a daniel?
  85. Ge0rG I'm semi-here. Might be able to cast votes if there is not too much to discuss.
  86. daniel Hi
  87. dwd We have a dwd!
  88. jonas’ 2) Agenda Bashing
  89. jonas’ it was a late agenda again
  90. jonas’ (turns out, IKEA assembly can be very captivating)
  91. jonas’ 3) Editor's Update
  92. jonas’ - LCs started: XEP-0379, XEP-0401, XEP-0445
  93. jonas’ 4) Items for Voting
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  95. jonas’ We got a request to consider the deprecation of '411
  96. jonas’ 4a) Deprecate XEP-0411 URL: https://github.com/xsf/xeps/pull/1111
  97. jonas’ I think that sends the wrong signal
  98. jonas’ but maybe that's just my strange PoV?
  99. Zash I think that ought to be discussed on the list a bit
  100. jonas’ I think deprecation of a compat mechanism should only happen once the main thing is obsoleted.
  101. Ge0rG praises the Editor
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  104. jonas’ Zash, also valid
  105. jonas’ any other opinions on this one?
  106. Ge0rG I agree with jonas’ on that.
  107. Ge0rG Also compat mechanisms often survive very long.
  108. daniel > Bookmarks 2 defines its own conversion mechanism but the adoption of Bookmarks 2 - at the time of writing this XEP - is questionable. This hasn't really changed...
  109. jonas’ Ge0rG, well, that they *survive* for long is no reason not to deprecate them
  110. dwd I, too, agree with jonas’ - a compat mechanism isn't deprecated just because the thing it's enabling compatibility with is deprecated. It exists *because* the old bookmarks was deprecated, in a lot of ways.
  111. daniel I mean I also would like bookmarks 2 to be more of a thing. I'm not sure depreciating the conversion xep is a good way to achieve that
  112. jonas’ note that '411 converts between private XML and the single-node PEP storage, not between private XML and bookmarks 2.0
  113. jonas’ note that '411 converts between private XML and the single-node PEP storage, not between private XML and bookmarks 2.0 (a.k.a. '402)
  114. Ge0rG somebody should draw a conversion flowchart.
  115. Zash Observation: '0411 is mentioned in the compliance suite
  116. jonas’ okay, uh
  117. jonas’ with the realization that '411 is actually converting between two different formats of '48
  118. jonas’ I think that it actually makes sense to deprecate it
  119. jonas’ with just the rationale that '48 is deprecated
  120. Zash I looked at the bookmarks (2) situation a few weeks ago and uh, it _would_ be nice if something could be pushed forward there.
  121. jonas’ what point is there to have '411 when '48 is deprecated, given that '411 has no interaction with anything except '48?
  122. jonas’ '411 has absolutely nothing to do with '405 (bookmarks 2)
  123. jonas’ I am +1 on deprecation.
  124. Zash ITYM xep-0402
  125. jonas’ yes, sorry
  126. jonas’ typo
  127. dwd Hmmm. So yes, I had it in my head it converted to bookmarks2.
  128. jonas’ (although it indeed also has nothing to do with '405 ;))
  129. Ge0rG XEP-0402 has undefined status "Draft"
  130. jonas’ huh?
  131. jonas’ oh :)
  132. jonas’ there's a bug there, thanks
  133. jonas’ (rendering bug)
  134. dwd So... I'm likely to vote +1 to deprecate I think, but it would be nice to run this past the list.
  135. jonas’ anyway, does anyone else want to cast votes on the '411 deprecation now?
  136. jonas’ thanks
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  138. jonas’ okay, two voices for running it past the list
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  140. Ge0rG I'm on-list pending list discussion
  141. jonas’ let's do the list thing then
  142. jonas’ 5) Pending Votes
  143. Zash Compliance Suite votes?
  144. jonas’ There has been more late LC feedback on '459
  145. jonas’ yes, only I'm missing
  146. jonas’ I think I'd like to see that incorporated before advancement
  147. Ge0rG some of my feedback got strong counter-arguments
  148. Zash I think it's a bit weird to have all the changes go in an LC feedback updates
  149. jonas’ Zash, my point being that any future change would be gated by Council
  150. jonas’ and I don't think that's beneficial for anyone involved
  151. jonas’ do you folks thinks that advancing while there's still open discussions is good in the case of '459?
  152. Zash I'm not opposed to extending while waiting for discussions to settle down
  153. jonas’ okay, I'd be more comfortable with that
  154. Zash Altho, it's been quiet for almost a week aready
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  156. jonas’ in that case stuff should be integrated in my opinon
  157. jonas’ before we advance
  158. Ge0rG Did anybody hear from the author?
  159. jonas’ not yet
  160. jonas’ I'm gonna poke them
  161. Zash please do
  162. jonas’ let's extend the voting period by +1w on this one, and I'll poke the list and the author
  163. Zash +1
  164. jonas’ speaking on +1w
  165. Ge0rG jonas’: great!
  166. jonas’ 6) Date of Next
  167. jonas’ +1w wfm
  168. daniel +1w wfm
  169. Ge0rG +1W LGTM
  170. Zash same
  171. jonas’ dwd, still here?
  172. dwd I am.
  173. dwd And +1W WFM. :-)
  174. jonas’ excellent
  175. jonas’ 7) AOB
  176. jonas’ anyone got anything?
  177. Zash too close to dinner time to have anything
  178. jonas’ heh
  179. jonas’ understandable
  180. jonas’ 8) Ite Meeting Est
  181. jonas’ thanks everyone
  182. Zash Thanks jonas’, thanks everyone
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