jdev - 2020-03-08

  1. Жокир has left
  2. Жокир has joined
  3. moparisthebest The only thing that annoys me is when a client could connect but gives up early, imho there is never a reason to do so
  4. moparisthebest Name the user that would choose not to connect if connection is possible?
  5. Jeybe has joined
  6. Martin has left
  7. Martin has joined
  8. Jeybe has left
  9. sonny has left
  10. sonny has joined
  11. Жокир has left
  12. Жокир has joined
  13. debacle has left
  14. Жокир has left
  15. Жокир has joined
  16. paul has left
  17. Жокир has left
  18. Жокир has joined
  19. Жокир has left
  20. Жокир has joined
  21. moparisthebest has left
  22. moparisthebest has joined
  23. Жокир has left
  24. Жокир has joined
  25. Жокир has left
  26. Жокир has joined
  27. rahul18@jwchat.org has joined
  28. rahul18@jwchat.org has left
  29. Жокир has left
  30. Жокир has joined
  31. Жокир has left
  32. Жокир has joined
  33. paul has joined
  34. paul has left
  35. paul has joined
  36. rion has left
  37. rion has joined
  38. Sam Whited has left
  39. Sam Whited has joined
  40. lovetox has joined
  41. lovetox has left
  42. Marc has joined
  43. lovetox has joined
  44. Жокир has left
  45. Жокир has joined
  46. Жокир has left
  47. Жокир has joined
  48. lovetox https://404.city/ looks pretty great
  49. asterix has joined
  50. flow defanor, how could following "happy eyeballs" lead to scenarios where a connection is possible by a client failing to connect?
  51. Martin > https://404.city/ looks pretty great But he could use some spell checking.
  52. lovetox has left
  53. asterix has left
  54. asterix has joined
  55. Жокир has left
  56. Жокир has joined
  57. defanor flow: with "connect" being a shortcut for "open a usable stream" (as was discussed above), the potential issue mentioned above applies: a client only ends up with a single address/connection to proceed with, while a connection to another address could have been more useful (e.g., TLS failing on one, but not on another). It's not specific to "happy eyeballs" though, I just recalled thinking that if one was to attempt all the available
  58. defanor addresses until one works for getting to resource binding, it would be particularly awkward to implement with those.
  59. Жокир has left
  60. Жокир has joined
  61. asterix has left
  62. asterix has joined
  63. asterix has left
  64. asterix has joined
  65. lovetox has joined
  66. debacle has joined
  67. Жокир has left
  68. Жокир has joined
  69. Жокир has left
  70. Kev has left
  71. Жокир has joined
  72. Жокир has left
  73. Жокир has joined
  74. Жокир has left
  75. Жокир has joined
  76. sonny has left
  77. sonny has joined
  78. Жокир has left
  79. Жокир has joined
  80. asterix has left
  81. asterix has joined
  82. asterix has left
  83. asterix has joined
  84. Жокир has left
  85. Жокир has joined
  86. Жокир has left
  87. Жокир has joined
  88. pulkomandy has left
  89. asterix has left
  90. asterix has joined
  91. asterix has left
  92. asterix has joined
  93. pulkomandy has joined
  94. Жокир has left
  95. Жокир has joined
  96. Жокир has left
  97. Жокир has joined
  98. paul has left
  99. klaus has joined
  100. Жокир has left
  101. Жокир has joined
  102. paul has joined
  103. klaus Hi everyone. Can someone create a wiki account for me on wiki.xmpp.org? I'm currently at the the Düsseldorf sprint and it would be helpful if I could edit our sprint page. Hope this is the right place to ask. My mail is klaus@jsxc.org and my preferred nick is sualko. Thanks a lot.
  104. Жокир has left
  105. Жокир has joined
  106. pep. Ge0rG, Guus ^ ?
  107. pep. There was also another request a few days ago? but apparently they're gone
  108. pep. "raucao> hi. i'd like to get an account on the wiki. is this the right place?"
  109. Жокир has left
  110. Жокир has joined
  111. Jeybe has joined
  112. lovetox what do you think about a 5 seconds TCP timeout when connecting to a server
  113. lovetox or is this to low for slow connections?
  114. Zash too low for Link Mauve
  115. jonas’ pretty sure that’s too low
  116. lovetox ok so 10 seems good?
  117. jonas’ try 60
  118. lovetox Oo
  119. Zash I've got a 20 second connection timeout and it seems fine most of the time
  120. jonas’ what are you gonna do when the timeout trips anyways?
  121. lovetox what for? you think a user waits 60 seconds for gajim to connect?
  122. lovetox he kills the application 5 times in that time
  123. jonas’ only if it blocks
  124. jonas’ (which it most certainly should not)
  125. lovetox has nothing to do with blocking
  126. jonas’ it has
  127. lovetox no its about the time a user waits
  128. flow i'd say it's about the UX
  129. jonas’ we seem to come back to this. giving feedback about a long running operation is better than incentivising the user to throw away progress early
  130. lovetox yeah its UX
  131. pulkomandy has left
  132. lovetox there is no feedback jonas
  133. flow maybe if it clearly make it visible that there is a 20s timeout going on
  134. jonas’ lovetox, yeah, that’s the problem then.
  135. lovetox there is no progress for a tcp connection
  136. jonas’ add feedback.
  137. flow like a circle that fills up
  138. jonas’ "This seems to take longer than expected. We’re still trying, check your connection in the meantime"
  139. jonas’ after N (which should be much smaller than timeout) seconds you show "This seems to take longer than expected. We’re still trying, check your connection in the meantime"
  140. pulkomandy has joined
  141. paul has left
  142. paul has joined
  143. pulkomandy has left
  144. pulkomandy has joined
  145. asterix has left
  146. asterix has joined
  147. Жокир has left
  148. Жокир has joined
  149. goffi has joined
  150. Жокир has left
  151. Жокир has joined
  152. asterix has left
  153. asterix has joined
  154. zuk has joined
  155. Жокир has left
  156. Жокир has joined
  157. pulkomandy has left
  158. pulkomandy has joined
  159. Жокир has left
  160. Жокир has joined
  161. Жокир has left
  162. Жокир has joined
  163. asterix has left
  164. kikuchiyo has joined
  165. pulkomandy has left
  166. pulkomandy has joined
  167. zuk has left
  168. zuk has joined
  169. lovetox has left
  170. Жокир has left
  171. Жокир has joined
  172. paul has left
  173. pulkomandy has left
  174. paul has joined
  175. pulkomandy has joined
  176. Жокир has left
  177. Guus > Hi everyone. Can someone create a wiki account for me on wiki.xmpp.org? I'm currently at the the Düsseldorf sprint and it would be helpful if I could edit our sprint page. Hope this is the right place to ask. My mail is klaus@jsxc.org and my preferred nick is sualko. Thanks a lot. I just created an account for you. You should have an activation email.
  178. klaus Thanks a lot
  179. zuk has left
  180. Jeybe has left
  181. Jeybe has joined
  182. pulkomandy has left
  183. pulkomandy has joined
  184. kikuchiyo has left
  185. kikuchiyo has joined
  186. pulkomandy has left
  187. pulkomandy has joined
  188. Guus np
  189. kikuchiyo has left
  190. kikuchiyo has joined
  191. pulkomandy has left
  192. pulkomandy has joined
  193. lovetox has joined
  194. pulkomandy has left
  195. pulkomandy has joined
  196. pulkomandy has left
  197. pulkomandy has joined
  198. paul has left
  199. lovetox has left
  200. debacle has left
  201. paul has joined
  202. kikuchiyo has left
  203. kikuchiyo has joined
  204. pulkomandy has left
  205. pulkomandy has joined
  206. pulkomandy has left
  207. pulkomandy has joined
  208. Marc has left
  209. Marc has joined
  210. Jeybe has left
  211. Jeybe has joined
  212. Jeybe has left
  213. Jeybe has joined
  214. kikuchiyo has left
  215. kikuchiyo has joined
  216. asterix has joined
  217. pulkomandy has left
  218. pulkomandy has joined
  219. kikuchiyo has left
  220. pulkomandy has left
  221. pulkomandy has joined
  222. aj has joined
  223. aj has left
  224. pulkomandy has left
  225. pulkomandy has joined
  226. flow Sam Whited, why do you consider switching from 2-clause bsd to apache license?
  227. pep. patents?
  228. Sam Whited flow: Apache has an explicit patent grant which makes corporate lawyer types happy and it has a provision for a notice file which makes me happy. I will miss how short the bsd style one is, but as far as I can tell (not being a lawyer) Apache is just the best written license out there.
  229. Sam Whited Still haven't decided though.
  230. flow Sam Whited, thanks for letting me know :)
  231. Sam Whited If anyone has expertise in this area, I'd love to hear other opinions.
  232. moparisthebest AGPL or bust :)
  233. pep. "best license" is quite subjective, but I know we disagree on this :)
  234. moparisthebest Honestly though all this "X or lawyers/businesses/etc won't like it" is crap, there are huge examples to prove every one wrong
  235. moparisthebest Essentially every business uses GPL Linux and modified-BSD curl for instance
  236. Sam Whited I'm not looking to change the type of license.
  237. sonny has left
  238. sonny has joined
  239. Sam Whited And every business doesn't work on Linux.
  240. klaus has left
  241. moparisthebest I'd suspect that's not true
  242. moparisthebest The thought of anyone going "hmm I can't use this thing because of BSD but if it was Apache I could" seems unbelievable
  243. moparisthebest I think Microsoft's biggest money maker today is Linux, via azure
  244. pulkomandy But Linux is essentially "GPL but we promise to not enforce it"
  245. moparisthebest I'm pretty sure it's been enforced
  246. Sam Whited Almost all businesses operate this way. Just because one or two exceptions exist where they don't mind contributing back doesn't mean most of them don't
  247. moparisthebest Operate what way?
  248. Sam Whited Don't want to use GPL on core business components, or have to potentially spend time responding to requests for source
  249. Sam Whited Anyways, opinions about BSD v Apache would be welcome if anyone wants to email me. I'm not engaging when every damn time I mention a license decision GPL zealots have to pivot to their preferred license.Please stop fmdoing that.
  250. moparisthebest I explicitly responded directly about Apache vs BSD, you're welcome :)
  251. pulkomandy has left
  252. pulkomandy has joined
  253. Guus Sam Whited: try reaching out to Matt Tucker. Back in the day, he moved Openfire et. al. to Apache. I'm not sure if BSD was considered, but if he did, he might have some insights that are valuable to you.
  254. Sam Whited Guus: thanks, will do. moparisthebest: sorry for snapping, I've been getting a lot of “why won't you GPL?” lately so I've been a bit angry about it.
  255. moparisthebest No problem, it's my default generally but depends on a lot of things, no surprise I like LGPL for libraries often too
  256. kikuchiyo has joined
  257. pulkomandy has left
  258. pulkomandy has joined
  259. asterix has left
  260. asterix has joined
  261. kikuchiyo has left
  262. asterix has left
  263. asterix has joined
  264. pulkomandy has left
  265. pulkomandy has joined
  266. pulkomandy has left
  267. pulkomandy has joined
  268. asterix has left
  269. asterix has joined
  270. kikuchiyo has joined
  271. pulkomandy has left
  272. pulkomandy has joined
  273. kikuchiyo has left
  274. asterix has left
  275. asterix has joined
  276. debacle has joined
  277. kikuchiyo has joined
  278. kikuchiyo has left
  279. debacle has left
  280. debacle has joined
  281. asterix has left
  282. asterix has joined
  283. asterix has left
  284. asterix has joined
  285. kikuchiyo has joined
  286. pulkomandy has left
  287. pulkomandy has joined
  288. kikuchiyo has left
  289. pulkomandy has left
  290. pulkomandy has joined
  291. kikuchiyo has joined
  292. asterix has left
  293. asterix has joined
  294. asterix has left
  295. asterix has joined
  296. allie has left
  297. pulkomandy has left
  298. pulkomandy has joined
  299. kikuchiyo has left
  300. allie has joined
  301. mathieui has left
  302. mathieui has joined
  303. kikuchiyo has joined
  304. kikuchiyo has left
  305. pulkomandy has left
  306. pulkomandy has joined
  307. asterix has left
  308. asterix has joined
  309. pulkomandy has left
  310. Marc has left
  311. Marc has joined
  312. pulkomandy has joined
  313. jeybe has joined
  314. Marc has left
  315. Marc has joined
  316. kikuchiyo has joined
  317. pulkomandy has left
  318. pulkomandy has joined
  319. kikuchiyo has left
  320. asterix has left
  321. jeybe has left
  322. asterix has joined
  323. Жокир has joined
  324. Жокир has left
  325. Жокир has joined
  326. asterix has left
  327. asterix has joined
  328. Жокир has left
  329. Жокир has joined
  330. Жокир has left
  331. Жокир has joined
  332. Жокир has left
  333. Жокир has joined
  334. mathieui has left
  335. mathieui has joined
  336. Jeybe has left
  337. Jeybe has joined
  338. Жокир has left
  339. Жокир has joined
  340. asterix has left
  341. asterix has joined
  342. Жокир has left
  343. Marc has left
  344. pulkomandy has left
  345. pulkomandy has joined
  346. kikuchiyo has joined
  347. kikuchiyo has left
  348. kikuchiyo has joined
  349. asterix has left
  350. kikuchiyo has left
  351. gav has joined
  352. kikuchiyo has joined
  353. goffi has left
  354. Jeybe has left
  355. Jeybe has joined
  356. Jeybe has left
  357. kikuchiyo has left
  358. paul has left
  359. kikuchiyo has joined