jdev - 2020-04-10

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  41. Guus

    jonas’ aioxmpp output now part of the Openfire Travis build: https://travis-ci.org/github/igniterealtime/Openfire/jobs/673309693

  42. Guus

    loads of output - would love to get guidance on a) how to run only integration tests, b) how to interpret output

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  74. lovetox

    so what is the suggested way of using priority right now

  75. lovetox

    Gajim allows the user to set his own priority if he wants

  76. lovetox

    per default i would use 0

  77. lovetox

    then Gajim adjusts automatically the priority according to show value

  78. lovetox

    means away = 50, dnd = 100

  79. lovetox

    does this still make sense in todays enviorment?

  80. Zash

    Carbons kinda obsoleted priority.

  81. lovetox

    yeah i thought so, but it maybe still can be useful?

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  83. lovetox

    so you would suggest always use 0, expect user for some reason override

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  86. wurstsalat

    lovetox, for optional priority there is a recommendation as well https://docs.modernxmpp.org/client/design/#deprecated-options

  87. lovetox

    yeah thanks

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  90. Holger

    lovetox, either way increasing the prio for away and dnd looks wrong way round, no?

  91. lovetox

    did not look it up in the code

  92. lovetox

    i just wanted to give an example

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  94. Holger


  95. Holger

    Anyway I would think the advantage of setting prio depending on status might be interop with old-school (non-carbons) use cases. OTOH the advantage of everyone sticking to prio=0 will usually emulate carbon behavior for incoming messages (if they're sent to the bare JID).

  96. Holger

    The advantage of producing correct English sentences exists does not.

  97. lovetox

    but is that something you would add as opt-in (shwo prio adjustments)

  98. lovetox

    or would it be the default to do tat

  99. lovetox

    or would it be the default to do that

  100. lovetox

    actually you are online with 3 resources, all have prio 0 :D

  101. Holger

    I tried to explain why I'm unsure. Not very helpful I know 🙂 In the end I'd probably stick to prio=0 by default as that's what everyone recommends for modern clients. Probably due to the "emulate carbons" idea.

  102. lovetox

    i guess i keep the feature, but default to prio 0

  103. Holger

    And for normal end-user clients I'd definitely not expose prio knobs to users, but I guess Gajim is still also a power-user client.

  104. Holger

    So yeah "keep feature but default to 0" sounds sensible to me.

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  113. jonas’

    Guus, so, the output is roughly like this: ERROR: […] followed by an (often not immediately useful) traceback, followed by a debug log which includes the verbatim bytes sent and received over the XML stream

  114. jonas’

    best to be read from bottom to top, since the top part often contains pre-test negotiation

  115. jonas’

    in the first case, aioxmpp receives <item-not-found/> in response to a disco#info query, which is at least wierd

  116. jonas’

    aioxmpp.e2etest.provision.client14.XMLStream: DEBUG: RECV b'<iq type="error" id=":rnZ16HksNXwLMrtNoyAx" from="1dphv93k5z@example.org" to="1dphv93k5z@example.org/1dphv93k5z"><query xmlns="http://jabber.org/protocol/disco#info"></query><error code="404" type="cancel"><item-not-found xmlns="urn:ietf:params:xml:ns:xmpp-stanzas"/></error></iq>'

  117. jonas’

    as to running only e2e tests … that’s a good question, I don’t think that’s supported. I’m also not sure it’s immediately useful, since the normal tests should pass too (and are orders of magnitude faster than the e2etests, so they are often neglegible in runtime). The advantage of running all tests is that if another test fails, it may be an indicator that something is broken in the environment which may cause false-positives in the e2etests

  118. jonas’

    Guus, more detailed discussion we probably better take into some 1:1 chat

  119. jonas’

    but this should already be useful; item-not-found in response to a disco#info without a node is at least weird

  120. Guus

    jonas’ sure - or in open_chat - we're currently doing more aioxmpp ci setup there.

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  190. lovetox

    https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0100.html#addressing is there something more elaborate

  191. lovetox

    this simply does not work for IRC transports

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  193. lovetox

    its very hard for a client to provide some good UI how a user can join a irc channel

  194. lovetox

    what i would want is the server returns a form with fields server and channel

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  196. Zash

    Hold on why is an Informational XEP specifying protocol?

  197. lovetox

    user puts it in, and server returns a JID that i can join or add to the roster

  198. Zash

    lovetox, isn't that https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0100.html#addressing-iqgateway ?

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  201. Zash

    Oh, only one field?

  202. lovetox

    yes exactly

  203. lovetox

    very extendable !!

  204. Zash

    Should at least be fine in single-server-mode, but then you probably don't need more than standard MUC UI

  205. jonas’

    lovetox, tbh, for jabbercat I simply intended to implement the biboumi syntax.

  206. jonas’

    there is no other IRC gateway anyways nowadays

  207. jonas’


  208. Zash

    maybe you and the biboumi folks could conspire to write a XEP?

  209. jonas’

    that’d be good

  210. jonas’

    advertise single vs. multi-server mode, specify the addressing format

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  212. lovetox

    i think irc could be really nice integrated into a client

  213. jonas’


  214. jonas’

    only with a good gateway though

  215. jonas’

    (hence, basing on biboumi)

  216. lovetox

    the only thing thats a bit clunky now is joining a channel

  217. lovetox

    normal user has no way of discoverying the syntax, i could of course hardcode it

  218. lovetox

    but meh

  219. Zash

    I guess the Matrix bridge has the same problem

  220. lovetox

    i just wanted to write that

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  222. lovetox

    and basically every federated protocol that has groupchat caps

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  227. pep.

    lovetox, there are more clunky things than just joining a channel tbh

  228. Zash

    From something like `<feature var="urn:xmpp:gateways:muc-like-using-percent-to-separate-hostname-from-channel"/>` to some dataform-in-disco to something like that XEP-0100 protocol but better.

  229. pep.

    NickServ for one..

  230. pep.

    I wouldn't want to impose that on a user who isn't experienced with IRC

  231. Zash

    How's that managed by biboumi? (So long since I set it up I've forgotten)

  232. pep.

    And then maybe it's a biboumi thing, the persistency stuff. it's nice but it's also confusing. Users leaving channels and not getting why they're still getting messages from the IRC server

  233. Zash


  234. pep.

    "but I'm not joined on any channels on this server anymore!" ("yes.. you are..")

  235. pulkomandy

    ircv3.net standardises sasl to identify with an irc network. But maybe not for creating an account

  236. Zash

    Or you mean some bug where biboumi gets out of sync with your resources?

  237. pep.

    Zash, no yeah notices

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  239. pep.

    Or reconnections, I think that also generates noise. While it's good to know, that will confuse people

  240. pep.

    pulkomandy, yeah biboumi is missing sasl support. But not every IRC server supports that either tbh..

  241. pep.

    And I don't know about account creation indeed

  242. pep.

    Also ghosting etc.

  243. pep.

    You can't really escape the NickServ!!

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  246. Zash

    Is "NickServ" standardized or discoverable?

  247. Zash

    Could you map it to ad-hoc or something?

  248. pep.

    Implementation detail?

  249. pep.

    I think it's just the most common nick out there? Unsure

  250. pulkomandy

    There has to be an irc server somewhere that goes otherwise, probably...

  251. lovetox

    of course for a full integrated bridge there would be more to do

  252. pep.

    sasl seems to be the way(tm), all implementation "just" need support

  253. Zash

    this is the way

  254. pep.

    Was QuakeNet also using NickServ? I seem to remember something different

  255. pep.

    Or maybe it was just the Ops bots?

  256. pep.

    channel bots etc.

  257. jonas’


  258. pep.

    Which were named Q, L

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  260. pep.


  261. pulkomandy

    But if it was me working on this I'd go with ircv3 specs as the things I expect from servers. For other servers maybe have a degraded/failsafe mode?

  262. pep.

    Well here you go

  263. pep.

    pulkomandy, is there a discovery mechanism to know if the sasl you're attempting will work?

  264. pep.

    I guess you negociate sasl anyway

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  266. pulkomandy

    They have a "capability negociation" thing in the ircv3 spec. But I didn't read it

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  268. pulkomandy

    sasl seems to be listed there

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  594. ali

    pulkomandy, > (١٠.٠٤.٢٠٢٠ ١٧:١٤:٤٥) pulkomandy: But if it was me working on this I'd go with ircv3 specs as the things I expect from servers. For other servers maybe have a degraded/failsafe mode?

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