jdev - 2020-04-13

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  314. lovetox so for domainnames normally i use stringprepare
  315. lovetox nameprep
  316. lovetox but in python there is module available that does the idna2008 standard
  317. jonas’ I don’t like where this is going
  318. lovetox can i just switch to that, or is this going to be problematic?
  319. Zash Me neither
  320. jonas’ no, those are different things
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  322. lovetox really?
  323. jonas’ you need to do nameprep first, then you can IDNA-encode the name before handing it to the DNS server
  324. jonas’ IDNA is an encoding (unicode -> DNS-compatible ascii bytes)
  325. jonas’ like UTF-8 is an encoding
  326. jonas’ problem is: there are two incompatible versions of idna, and nobody knows which one to use
  327. lovetox im talking about validating domainnames
  328. jonas’ nameprep
  329. lovetox in python there is a idna standard module
  330. jonas’ that’s all validation you need
  331. lovetox it offers a method thats called nameprep
  332. jonas’ there is no idna module in the python standard library
  333. jonas’ according to https://docs.python.org/3/library/
  334. lovetox its a submodule of stringprepare
  335. jonas’ there is no stringprepare module either
  336. lovetox or stringprep dont know
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  338. jonas’ stringprep doesn’t have submodules AFAIK. most certainly not an `idna` submodule
  339. Zash It hasn't been long enough since some user put http://example.com:5280/ as their XMPP server name and everything was fine with that.
  340. jonas’ I’m wondering what you’re talikng about. LTIC python only supported IDNA2003
  341. lovetox ok https://github.com/python/cpython/blob/e42b705188271da108de42b55d9344642170aa2b/Lib/encodings/idna.py
  342. lovetox its a encoding
  343. jonas’ as I said, yes
  344. jonas’ and it’s IDNA2003
  345. jonas’ not 2008
  346. jonas’ again, IDNA* are encodings like UTF-8 are encodings. has nothing to do with validation or normalisation like nameprep does
  347. lovetox yes and it has a method call nameprep
  348. jonas’ neat
  349. jonas’ but it’s not public API
  350. jonas’ seems as if nameprep is a precondition for IDNA2003 and they’re doing that for you
  351. lovetox oh ok so thats what confused me
  352. jonas’ you can do a call to codecs.encode(some_domain, "idna") and if it doesn’t raise UnicodeEncodeError, then you know that it passes nameprep
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  354. lovetox soo can is witch to nameprep -> IDNA2008
  355. lovetox ?
  356. jonas’ no
  357. jonas’ it’s idna2003
  358. jonas’ not idna2008
  359. jonas’ also note that nameprep has been deprecated in XMPP
  360. lovetox you just said nameprep has nothing to do with idna, its just a precondition
  361. lovetox so what is it now
  362. jonas’ TIL that nameprep is a precondition to IDNA2003.
  363. jonas’ it doesn’t matter tho
  364. jonas’ IDNA2003 does more than just nameprep
  365. jonas’ if you want nameprep, you should do nameprep and not IDNA2003
  366. Zash You actually want IDNA too, nameprep isn't enough to validate an XMPP hostname.
  367. Zash domain. hostpart. thing.
  368. jonas’ Zash, IDNA doesn’t buy you much though: >>> codecs.encode("http://foo:5082", "idna") b'http://foo:5082'
  369. Zash See previously mentioned incident with someone having a HTTP URL in their config
  370. Zash wut
  371. jonas’ yeah.
  372. jonas’ it’s just nameprep plus some mapping of characters
  373. jonas’ plus length restrictions
  374. Zash > print(util.encodings.idna.to_ascii("http://foo:123/")) nil
  375. jonas’ is that IDNA2003 or IDNA2008?
  376. Zash Probably 2008
  377. jonas’ might be the difference
  378. jonas’ python3 only has 2003
  379. Zash haha
  380. jonas’ yeah
  381. Zash but don't python also have ... whatsitcalled, precis?
  382. jonas’ the issue is just open for seven years now: https://bugs.python.org/issue17305
  383. jonas’ Zash, not built-in
  384. jonas’ there’s a third party module
  385. Zash better than nothing
  386. jonas’ true
  387. jonas’ there also seems a third-party IDNA module which does things
  388. jonas’ and then again: I’m not sure XMPP software should make assumptions about what DNS allows.
  389. lovetox : is not allowed in IDNA2008
  390. jonas’ let DNS deal with the weird things we put in the domainpart.
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  392. jonas’ it’ll tell us to f* off. encoding (too many) assumptions about how DNS works and what it allows seems like it can only lead to a world of pain
  393. jonas’ normalisation makes sense for comparision and stuff, but beyond that…
  394. Zash `idn -a <<< "http://foo.bar:123/"` spits out its input
  395. Zash and that would be idna2003
  396. lovetox so i still dont see no problem to run a host through idna 2008?
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  398. jonas’ probably ok
  399. jonas’ not sure what that gains you tho
  400. lovetox and if it returns an exception, tell the user its not a valid domain name
  401. jonas’ I hate that type of stuff
  402. amnesia has left
  403. jonas’ that’s the type of stuff which breaks new things
  404. jonas’ you’ll notice that it’s not a valid domain name when you ask the DNS about the name
  405. jonas’ (though, you need to do IDNA2008 or IDNA2003 before you ask the DNS)
  406. jonas’ (but you can’t know which one is right \o/)
  407. Zash The least painful answer for us: IDNA2008 in IDNA2003 compat mode
  408. Zash IDNA2003 library support status: deprecated.
  409. lovetox so what does the xmpp standard say about domainpart
  410. Zash libidn v1 deprecated libin2 dosen't do nameprep & co, can't manage xmpp parts
  411. lovetox no validation at all?
  412. lovetox it does for node and resource part have precis modules
  413. Zash lovetox: "the", there are like 3 of them
  414. Zash 3 versions
  415. lovetox the lastest
  416. Zash idna2003, idna2008, precis
  417. lovetox so wtf it definitly says a domainpart has to conform to idna2008
  418. lovetox so i certainly run it through idna2008 and be finished with it
  419. Zash Latest is https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc7622
  420. lovetox yes thats what iam refering to
  421. jonas’ I love how we still haven’t figured out how to do unicode release interop
  422. Zash This be the IDNA2008 + PRECIS thing righht?
  423. lovetox yes
  424. lovetox and idna2008 has no nameprep as precondition
  425. jonas’ I dropped that in #debian-til and someone got nerdsniped by that and dug out that the unicode releases also don’t really have guidelines on compatibility
  426. lovetox so actually i can throw out all nameprep stuff
  427. Zash jonas’: No way we're doing that while in the middle of a pandemic, can't afford to waste painkillers and anti-fever meds on this horror
  428. jonas’ :D
  429. jonas’ luckily, the next unicode release will be postponed due to the pandemic, too
  430. Zash Praise Glob
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  442. flow lovetox> so i certainly run it through idna2008 and be finished with it then you potentially disallow ipv4/ipv6 addresses in the domainpart, which are allowed
  443. lovetox after i check if its an ip :D
  444. flow lovetox, bonus points for allowing ipv6 scope IDs
  445. lovetox i do
  446. flow then here are your bonus points
  447. lovetox but only if you include it within []
  448. flow hands lovetox 13.37 bonus points
  449. flow lovetox, whatever the IP-literal rule of RFC 6874 allows
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