jdev - 2020-05-27

jonas’, extend away should actualy be called busy

then it would make more sense

meaning im in a call or a meeting, im at my pc but im busy

still receiving notifications and message and may answer if someone writes me

compared to dnd, where im maybe holding a presentation, will not get notifications and will definitly not answer

and away is just away from the pc, and the reason should be mentions in the status message

actually thats what skype does, maybe im biased because i have to use it at work, but these states always made sense for me

compared to extended away, what does that even mean, im a little more away from my pc then with only away

what’s the difference between busy and dnd?

from RFC 6121; 4.7.2.1 Show Element: away -- The entity or resource is temporarily away. chat -- The entity or resource is actively interested in chatting. dnd -- The entity or resource is busy (dnd = "Do Not Disturb"). xa -- The entity or resource is away for an extended period (xa = "eXtended Away").

busy = dnd

idle = away

'really away' = xa

theTedd, that was in reply to lovetox’: > 18:39:58 lovetox> meaning im in a call or a meeting, im at my pc but im busy > […] > 18:40:38 lovetox> compared to dnd, where im maybe holding a presentation, will not get notifications and will definitly not answer ✏

also, theTedd, thanks.

i thought i made the difference clear

from around the 2000s, msn/live messenger had several extra 'away' states, which we could have argued fit into 'extended away' as lovetox suggests it, but the rfc says otherwise

DND means, i will not get notified if you send me something, i will no know that you send me something, and i will not answer

I’m not sure when I’d use "busy" instead of "dnd"

if I’m too busy to react, I don’t want notifications either. maybe that’s just me?

if you are in a meeting but not presenting you use busy

"I'm busy, but please distract me"

that means if someone writes you he cannot expect that you write back, but he has a chance

while with DND he has no chance

you will not even see his messges

no, I’m either offline (if I don’t want to be distracted), dnd (if I have to have controlled read access) or online (if I’m ok with replying) ✏

you cant be offline

lovetox, tell that to networkmanager

if you are disconnected you cant have a call ✏

aha

riiight

as i said above, think about skype

now that makes a bit more sense now, I didn’t consider the chat being the thing where I’m busy in

you are in a group call, for eample

I never really used skype

aynways, gotta run now

theTedd, i dont see the difference between idle and extended away

idle means my computer is idle for a prolonged time

means im not at the computer

so away from the computer

extended away is a matter of interpretation

yes, it's "auto-away" probably temporary

for some people 20 minutes not on your job computer, is really long

for me 5 hours is really short

extended away is either intentional "not here!" or auto away after a long period

yeah ok, but state is something you want to tell to others, and if someone esle sees you are beeing "extended away"

this means essentially nothing

they don't, they only see 'away'

becuase it could mean you come back in the next minute

or in the next hour

or in the next week

you have the option to tell when you'll be back, otherwise there's no way to know anyway

are you saying other clients should not show the a difference between xa and away?

but thats what i mean, for other people xa or away makes no difference

you are not here

and they cannot know for how long, except you tell them

away should be for a short time only - it should become xa after a (configurable) reasonable time

ha you say that, and Gajim has exactly that code

but im questioning if this is still useful

because we have idle time

people know how long im away

they dont need the state for that

if you enable that

of course, if not i wouldnt also enable xa after x minutes, because that would also reveal info

you can enable xa after n minutes without indicating n

either way, i cant really change the meaning of extended away can i?

it really says "away"

it's in the the rfc, so you'll struggle

i cant make it to "here but busy"

all clients will interpret it wrong

damn

busy is usually assumed "I may not see your message, even though I am here (doing something)"

so if you think about a client that can make phone calls

would you switch to DND once the call starts?

Are you saying that "here but busy" is not dnd?

its probably a bit too much

show=dnd, status="in a call"

Zash, lovetox would like two 'busy' states: busy but distractable, and very busy

from the client side that's easy, but it wouldn't indicate to a sender whether you will be notified (but you're busy either way)

Hmmm

User Activity? Other PEP thing?