jdev - 2020-06-29

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  59. jonas’ lovetox, I don’t see any issue here, so unlikely: https://github.com/horazont/muchopper/issues
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  82. Жокир Do any popular servers actually implement XEP-0368? If yes, could anyone give point to any such servers?
  83. jonas’ Жокир, https://compliance.conversations.im/ any suggested as "compliant" servers should do, at least for c2s
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  86. jonas’ I don’t know of any s2s implementation except maybe https://github.com/surevine/Metre , which isn’t quite a server.
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  91. Guus Looking at my server log, I'm noticing that I'm getting a lot of connection timeouts on s2s in bursts - presumably x minutes after a user that caused the federation to be set up sent its last presence update.
  92. Guus I wonder if it'd be good to introduce a small factor of randomness to the timeout interval, to avoid staggered behavior.
  93. flow Guus, maybe controversal counter-question: that does sounds like an timeout enforced on the application layer. if so, then why would you have an application layer timeout for s2s connections and not simply let the tcp connection timeout
  94. jonas’ flow, save resources.
  95. jonas’ the tcp connection will also not time out ever
  96. flow is it worth it?
  97. jonas’ because both peers can see each other (in this scenario)
  98. jonas’ file descriptors are limited and when you notice you’re running out of them, it’s too late
  99. jonas’ being a bit proactive about preserving them is generally a good idea
  100. flow ok so kill idle connections based on the amount of available file descriptions, but not based on time
  101. jonas’ you don’t know the amount of available file descriptors
  102. flow (or, to be precise, only as second criteria based on time)
  103. jonas’ you know the limit, but you don’t know how many are open in your process
  104. jonas’ you can estimate, but you can be wrong in the bad direction.
  105. jonas’ (or in both directions, depending on how you estimate)
  106. flow ls /proc/$pid/fd/ | wc -l
  107. flow ?
  108. jonas’ that’s at least a rather expensive way to do it
  109. jonas’ but true, that works, on systems where procfs has that feature
  110. flow why is it expensive?
  111. Guus flow I don't mind much either way - I'm just noticing that I get a lot of disconnects. I'm thinking Prosody does this? Openfire probably does so as well, though.
  112. jonas’ flow, that’s many syscalls
  113. Guus (at the very least, it's configurable)
  114. jonas’ I can’t see immediately in man 5 procfs whether /proc/$pid/fd is a linux or a posix thing
  115. flow jonas’, I wouldn't be surpised if there is a more efficient way to get that number
  116. jonas’ I would
  117. Guus I don't mind much closing idle connections (although it does feel like premature optimization a bit.)
  118. flow especially on linux
  119. jonas’ I think I looked into that already and found that it’s not possible
  120. jonas’ there’s surely a reason why sudo does a for i in 0..MAXFD do close($i); done
  121. Guus as Openfire is a multi-platform solution, depending on any platform specific thingy is going to be a pain.
  122. Guus unless Java exposes things, which I doubt.
  123. flow Guus, UnixOperationSystemMXBean.getOpenFileDescriptorCount()
  124. flow not sure if something like that also exist for other OS'es
  125. Guus *Unix*OperationSystemMXBean is likely going to fail on Windows? 🙂
  126. Guus but also: not worth the complexity, maybe?
  127. flow so you may have to implement a fallback strategy for sure (like disconnection based on a timeout)
  128. jonas’ I don’t see any problem with a timeout here, to be honest
  129. flow Guus, potentially, depends on your goals I'd say
  130. jonas’ everything else seems slightly overengineered
  131. jonas’ file descriptors may also just be one reason why you want to keep the number of open connections low
  132. jonas’ other reasons may include running behind a stateful firewall and wanting to conserve resources there
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  135. Guus I was just suggesting to add a small random factor in the timeout delay, nothing more 😉
  136. flow Guus, which is always a good idea
  137. Guus also, given how I see batches of s2s tear down only to be brought up again, I'm suspecting that the default timeout of (Prosody?) might be on the low end.
  138. jonas’ prosody doesn’t have a default timeout
  139. Guus oh, that's interesting
  140. Guus note that I didn't actually check what server software is used on those. I just assumed.
  141. Guus having had a closer look: might be ejabberd 🙂
  142. jonas’ https://sotecware.net/files/noindex/connections.png
  143. jonas’ :-)
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  146. flow looks like a 30 minute timeout
  147. flow combined with an hourly cron job maybe?
  148. jonas’ I think there are two timeouts, one ~15min (the linear curve down) and one ~30min (which also looks randomized, because of the slight exp-y behaviour at the end)
  149. jonas’ and yes, this is the connection stats of search.jabber.network, and the spikes you see is the hourly scan :)
  150. Guus (maybe randomize your scan!)
  151. flow now we only need to identify the implementations with the 15m and 30m (randomized) timeout
  152. jonas’ Guus, it’s already shuffled :)
  153. flow and what is keeping the baseline of 1.5k connections
  154. Guus moar shuffling!
  155. jonas’ flow, compare the ratios with https://search.jabber.network/stats#software :)
  156. jonas’ assuming that many "unknowns" are in fact prosody MUCs, because prosody doesn’t report version on MUC by default IIRC
  157. flow ahh, so it is probably prosody which keeps the connections
  158. jonas’ flow, very likely
  159. flow but the amount of 15m and 30m timeout connections appears to be nearly equal
  160. jonas’ I experimented with loading mod_s2s_idle_timeout or whatsitcalled on s.j.n, but then I disabled it to reduce the codebase to the minimum for some unrelated testing
  161. jonas’ flow, I’ll have to dig deeper into it, it’s also possible that the different behaviours there are an artifact of how the scanner works
  162. jonas’ flow, I’ll have to dig deeper into it, it’s also possible that the two different falloff behaviours there are an artifact of how the scanner works
  163. flow i see
  164. jonas’ since there are two scanning components, and one finishes much quicker than the other; it’s possible that the quicker one is causing the additional tip of the initial spike, while the slower one is what causes the slow fall off at the end
  165. jonas’ since the quicker one also tends to touch more domains
  166. jonas’ oh yeah, that’s very plausible
  167. jonas’ that may also explain the exp falloff due to shuffling
  168. jonas’ if there’s really just a 15m or something timeout involved
  169. flow jonas’, are you aware that 'German' appears twice in the room languages table?
  170. jonas’ yes
  171. jonas’ de-de vs. de
  172. jonas’ I need to normalize that
  173. jonas’ https://sotecware.net/files/noindex/connections-1h.png
  174. jonas’ https://sotecware.net/files/noindex/ingestion-1h.png
  175. jonas’ that seems to fit very well
  176. jonas’ (the "filled" part in the second graph is the fast component, the "line" part in the second graph is the slow component)
  177. jonas’ the fast component ends at 07:24, which is exactly when the initial spike drops in the first graph
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