jdev - 2020-07-13

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  19. User1773717 moparisthebest: I asked there about xmpp over websockets yesterday and got no response, do you have more info on that?
  20. moparisthebest doesn't support that right now, I suspect you'll be hard pressed to find a non-web client that does, may I ask why you want that?
  21. Link Mauve Gajim does though.
  22. User1773717 > doesn't support that right now, I suspect you'll be hard pressed to find a non-web client that does, may I ask why you want that? I am confused, what do you exactly refer to with "why you want that?"?
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  61. adrien User1773717: well, if the client can already easily establish a standard TLS connection above a TCP socket, there's no intetest to use websockets for me. Indeed with websockets, you can't manage stream data, you can only work by full message chunk.
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  109. Link Mauve adrien, how is it an issue for XMPP?
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  112. adrien There's no big problem I think, but it means you can't take advantage of buffering XMPP stream to an SAX xml parser directly. So, if you are able to manage the DNS, TLS and TCP stuff, I see no interest to propose to use WebSocket too.
  113. jonas’ adrien, fwiw, you can also use SAX with WebSocket framing; just means you need to reset the parser state for each message to some extent.
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  115. adrien Indeed, but if the message data is heavy, you can't buffer it to the parser, you have to store it entierly in some place.
  116. jonas’ I suppose that depends on the websocket implementation
  117. adrien Nope, the XEP is clear about that: only full XMPP message must be sent
  118. jonas’ soo?
  119. jonas’ whether a websocket implementation allows you to stream the data into a streaming SAX parser is a websocket implementaiton detail, isn’t it?
  120. adrien Mmhh, I thought the Websocket `on_message` interface wasn't made to do streaming due to it's name.
  121. jonas’ possibly
  122. jonas’ also note that XMPP only guarantees stanza sizes up to 10 kB anyways; anything beyond that is implementation defined.
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  125. adrien Nice, I didn't know about that limit. Now, I'm wondering how pubsub manage bigger data ☺
  126. adrien I have a lot to learn about xmpp :-)
  127. Kev XMPP says that a server's maximum stanza size must not be less than 10K.
  128. Kev You can phrase that as 'only guarantees stanza sizes up to 10K', but I think the give subtly different impressions.
  129. jonas’ true
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  132. flow adrien, I am not sure if xmpp impls ever should directly feed their network input to the parser
  133. jonas’ flow, what’s the alternative?
  134. flow at least not without having some kind of stanza size enforcement in between
  135. jonas’ I tend to disagree
  136. flow jonas’, maybe I did not a good job explaining what I mean. but if you just wrap the parser around the byte source, then you have no control over the stanza size and it often makes it harder to recover from an error
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  138. flow here: byte source == the tcp socket
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  140. jonas’ with a SAX parser limits are pretty irrelevant, unless you store things somewhere. so you can simply "count" the size as you go while parsing, and when the data exceeds, you either kill the stream or forward (discarding data) until the end of the stanza
  141. jonas’ (though the latter is very interesting with stream management)
  142. adrien Well, that's the SAX parser which should leverage error if it has consumed too many bytes.
  143. adrien jonas’: exactly :-)
  144. jonas’ however, if you try to guess the stanza size before parsing with a proper XML parser, you end up re-doing much of the XML parsing.
  145. jonas’ which sounds painful
  146. flow jonas’, I do mostly stax (pull) parsing, not sax (push) parsing, and there, counting the offset in the currently parsed stanza is some effort. is it easier with a typical sax API?
  147. Kev Even with pull it's relatively straightforward to say "There's been too much data read since the last stanza event" isn't it?
  148. jonas’ I don’t care about bytes in the end
  149. Kev Which isn't the same as a cut-off at a precise point, but does the job.
  150. jonas’ yeah, nodes is more interesting, though counting character data is also relevant
  151. jonas’ but both is not much of a big deal
  152. flow Kev, sure you can always manually "count" the input. I ideally you want to able to tell the parser to set a mark and then be able to query the current offset from that mark
  153. flow Kev, sure you can always manually "count" the input. But I think ideally you want to able to tell the parser to set a mark and then be able to query the current offset from that mark
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  158. flow adrien, re how pubsub manages bigger data: pick at least one of: (1) not (2) don't care or (3) split into smaller (4KiB) chunks
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  180. moparisthebest jonas’, sed to C translator written in sed : https://github.com/lhoursquentin/sed-bin
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