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sonny
hi there - what's the latest/greatest work on file sending with metadata? https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0385.html ?
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sonny
(interop is not of concern ATM)
09:35:01
jonas’
sonny, the File Metadata ProtoXEPs currently in the pipeline
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jonas’
wait until tomorrow for them to get numbers
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jonas’
(though there is a chance > 0 that one of them is vetoed)
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jonas’
see https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/file-metadata.html for a preview
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Ge0rG
damn, I need to do something about them.
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jonas’
Ge0rG, yes you do
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jonas’
please don’t let those expire, either
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Zash
A/B XEPs yeeeeeee
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jonas’
sonny, s/tomorrow/today/, we’re on tuesday alreay
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sonny
thanks - I don't understand the premise of that XEP - it removes a dependency to add a new one (and fragmention) while still relying on said removed dependency for thumbnails
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sonny
I'll go with 0385 for now and see if I can contribute my thoughts to the list
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jonas’
sonny, huh?
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jonas’
it does not depend on jingle for thumbnails
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jonas’
and '385 does more than just file sending, it also does markup
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sonny
> A thumbnail element of the file, using the <thumbnail/> element defined in File Transfer Thumbnails (XEP-0264)
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sonny
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0264.html
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jonas’
I do not see '264 depending on jingle.
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sonny
my point is that it shows that depending on an external XEP isn't an issue - so I don't understand the premise of the XEP
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jonas’
oh, it was about which specific XEPs to depend on
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sonny
if the issue is that Jingle is too big why not taking what's there and splitting
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sonny
without breaking changes / fragmentation
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jonas’
it’s not possible to do it without breaking changes as it’s in jingle’s namespace
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jonas’
the entire point is to remove it from jingle’s namespace
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jonas’
to avoid tying it in with jingfle
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sonny
ok I think the problem is that I don't understand how using a subset of the Jingle namespace may be problematic ?
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jonas’
when jingle gets updated, an entire mess starts
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jonas’
the jingle namespace changes
09:53:10
jonas’
soo ... what now? do we leave the namespace of <file/> on the old "version", creating confusion? do we bump it, rendering the element invisible to everyone and causing massive breakage? do we bump it in jingle itself, but not for the use in '385?
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sonny
splitting would prevent those issues from arising - XEPs have been split before
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jonas’
no
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jonas’
it is still in jingles namespace
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jonas’
which would then be the confusion part
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jonas’
or we move it into a different namespace -> exactly what file-metadata.html does
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flow
I am not sure how splitting would help here. the problem with the namespace would still exists. I guess the lesson here is that namespace should be minimally scoped
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jonas’
that
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sonny
file-metadata isn't a 1:1 with jingle so no
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flow
whatever "namespaces should be minimally scoped" means in practice, there is probably a to fine-grained variant too
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sonny
ok so the problem is sharing namespace between xeps?
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jonas’
sonny, that is part of the problem
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jonas’
flow, most certainly there is
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flow
otoh I we hardly blame people that the <file/> element was designed under the jingle namespace: back then, it was probably not foreseable that other means of file transport would emerge
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flow
otoh I can hardly blame people that the <file/> element was designed under the jingle namespace: back then, it was probably not foreseable that other means of file transport would emerge
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sonny
how would you send File metadata element in a chat message? using reference type=data as well?
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jonas’
sonny, https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/sfs.html
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sonny
thank you
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jonas’
with encryption: https://xmpp.org/extensions/inbox/esfs.html
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jonas’
sonny, file-metadata has been assigned XEP-0446 FYI
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