jdev - 2021-07-22

  1. edhelas

    one small question, is BuddyCloud still alive ?

  2. flow

    pretty sure not

  3. flow

    edhelas ↑

  4. edhelas

    okay, because it was one of the project that was pushing things around Pubsub in the ecosystem

  5. Zash

    Not much activity since 2015 from what I can see.

  6. edhelas

    ok :)

  7. Zash

    edhelas, last project standing?

  8. Zash

    Not much activity since 2015 from what I can see.

  9. edhelas

    nah, there is SàT :D

  10. Zash

    and `clix publish_atom` !

  11. edhelas

    damn, so much competition

  12. Zash

    Better step up your game ;)

  13. edhelas

    time to release AtomMovim ! fully incompatible with the others

  14. Ge0rG

    go nuclear!

  15. edhelas

    The Movim server is hosted in Germany, so we're more using coal than nuclear there :p

  16. Zash


  17. Ge0rG

    edhelas: I'm sorry for that. I've tried for over twenty years now to get rid of our climate- and science-denialist government.

  18. jubalh

    isnt it mostly the green party that tries to stop nuclear?

  19. edhelas

    Yup, I know, I really hope that at one moment "they" will understand how illogical their decisions are

  20. Zash

    and `clix publish_atom` !

  21. Ge0rG

    edhelas: It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends on his not understanding it.

  22. jubalh

    even when his survival is threatened?

  23. edhelas

    Ge0rG is there a few people in Germany that questions the "full renewable (+coal/gaz)" politics ?

  24. Ge0rG

    jubalh: none of the fat old white guys is actually threatened by climate change.

  25. Ge0rG

    edhelas: pardon?

  26. jubalh

    "fat old white guys" oh now I cannot take any serious anymore what you will say :/

  27. Ge0rG

    jubalh: which of those attributes doesn't match Armin Laschet?

  28. jubalh

    it was plural "guys". So this gave me the impression that you are one of those people who think "white + male = evil"

  29. Ge0rG

    jubalh: no. I think "successful politician = evil + corrupt"

  30. Ge0rG

    and it just happens that most of them are fat old white guys.

  31. jubalh


  32. Ge0rG

    because, you know, unbiased random selection.

  33. edhelas

    damn, I can't have jubalh messages, still this message id bug

  34. edhelas

    yup, profanity

  35. jubalh

    "bug" :)

  36. Zash


  37. Ge0rG

    "message ID too strong"

  38. nephele

    Eh, the german goverment will get rid of coal, and then we get nuclear power from france :P

  39. edhelas


  40. edhelas

    nephele you are already getting it from France :p

  41. Zash

    Mission successful eh

  42. nephele

    yes, but with less coal that means more nuclear

  43. jubalh

    funny thing is, the first contribution i made to profanity (if i remember correctly) was using UUID for IDs instead of incremented number

  44. Zash

    And then south Sweden shuts down their nuclear plants, to then import German coal power!

  45. edhelas


  46. nephele

    sounds good

  47. Ge0rG

    Nuclear is much more safe than coal. Especially when imported from faraway!

  48. jubalh

    https://github.com/profanity-im/profanity/commit/f4fb61b0c83b0eea20f7b60fa83bc116fd103a84 then later we did the crazy ID thing

  49. jubalh

    Ge0rG: but am I wrong that mostly green party in germany is against nuclear? I didn't follow very closely but I was under that impression

  50. edhelas

    Step 1: Wait for Germany to get dependent on foreign import Step 2: Do x5 in French exported electricity to Germany Step 3: PROFITS §§§

  51. edhelas

    Russia is having the same plan with Gaz 😎

  52. Ge0rG

    jubalh: no, that's right. Killing Nuclear was the Greens' main proposition back in the early 2000s

  53. Ge0rG

    If only they had killed coal instead.

  54. nephele

    nuclear could be better, maybe when they stop using the one tech that is good for making nuclear weapons... and invest in any of the countless other safer options

  55. jubalh


  56. edhelas

    Weapons are built in factories that runs on electricity 🤔

  57. Zash

    Reject technology. Become potato farmer. Take over the world with spud guns!

  58. edhelas

    Ge0rG that's why I was asking you if a part of the german population is asking the governement to now change their plans ?

  59. Ge0rG

    edhelas: I had trouble parsing your message. Our government recently decided to pay billions to Big Coal to stop coal power by 2045.

  60. edhelas

    So early

  61. edhelas

    Enough time to replace them with… gaz ?

  62. Ge0rG

    Yes, gas will be increased to compensate for loss of coal.

  63. Ge0rG

    Meanwhile, our governments are sabotaging solar and wind as much as they can.

  64. Ge0rG

    In my state, you can't put a new wind turbine closer than 1km to a settlement, with a settlement being anything with three or more houses.

  65. edhelas

    sabotaging ?

  66. edhelas

    ah :D

  67. Zash

    Nobody wants things in their back yard.

  68. edhelas

    Well if you replace a plant with wind turbines, that's suddenly way more backyards that you need to use :D

  69. Zash

    Good thing our back yards are yüuuuge up here.

  70. edhelas

    Zash where is it ?

  71. Zash

    North Sweden.

  72. edhelas

    :D indeed

  73. Ge0rG

    And if you want to install small-scale solar, you need to create a company and do significant tax work. If you want to do large-scale solar (on your own premises), you need to participate in government tenders.

  74. Zash

    They are putting up wind turbines somewhere here atm

  75. edhelas

    Ge0rG same in France, the gov is basically cutting all the money helicopter on solar

  76. Zash

    Funny because they're too large to move on the large roads which all have bridges over them.

  77. Zash

    So into the woods on tiny dirt roads the go

  78. Zash

    So into the woods on tiny dirt roads they go

  79. edhelas

    They promised a few years back to buy all the solar electricity at a very competitive price, but now they're just stopping it, the result is meh…

  80. edhelas

    Also I find it really dumb to spend all this money on trying to decarbonate electricity in France :D

  81. Zash

    Solar does go up on roofs here and there. You can even sell excess power back to the grid. But you can't make a profit.

  82. edhelas

    We have plenty of things to decarbonate, and electricity is definitely not the main one

  83. Ge0rG

    I'm only using solar+wind, and 80% of the price are taxes and fees to install more solar and wind, except there is no way to do that.

  84. edhelas

    Ge0rG you have a "green" contract ?

  85. Zash

    Tho being up north it tends to be dark during the time you need power. And also snow.

  86. edhelas

    Zash clever

  87. Ge0rG

    If they'd got rid of the taxes and fees on renewable electricity, it would suddenly become as cheap for heating as oil or gas.

  88. Ge0rG

    and much cheaper with heat pumps.

  89. Ge0rG

    edhelas: yeah. I used to have hydro from a regional company, but they stopped selling that.

  90. emus

    Wind goes Offshore 🤘

  91. edhelas

    Ge0rG what is your yearly CO² impact ? because you can have 80% renewable 100% Bio-Vegan electricity, if the 20% that remains you're burning 800g/CO²/kwh lignite, well…

  92. Ge0rG

    edhelas: I have 100% solar + wind in my contract. And I'm using it to charge my BEV

  93. Ge0rG

    (I'm still heating with gas though, because $$$)

  94. edhelas

    when you have such thing, on an individual level, or national level, you need to check the yearly "average" result

  95. Ge0rG

    edhelas: I'm depressed enough already, kthx

  96. edhelas

    because it can be "I didn't took any plane, except the one time I flew into space"

  97. edhelas


  98. edhelas

    Ge0rG heat pumps are great <3

  99. Zash

    Unless everyone has them

  100. edhelas

    Zash ?

  101. Ge0rG

    edhelas: the loud ones aren't

  102. Zash

    Stockholm is apparently such a needlework of wells for heat pumps, so efficiency is lost.

  103. Sam

    They also stop working in winter unless you get the drilled geothermal ones (which are expensive, at least around here)

  104. edhelas

    they, they can't replace A/C or heating

  105. Ge0rG

    I wish I could drill one, but my home is built on stone.

  106. edhelas

    but they can help with only a bit of energy, again you have to check the average each year :p

  107. Zash

    Ge0rG, anything is possible with a big enough drill!

  108. edhelas

    except drilling into 0045 or 0060

  109. Zash

    Solar does go up on roofs here and there. You can even sell excess power back to the grid. But you can't make a profit.

  110. Zash

    Tho being up north it tends to be dark during the time you need power. And also snow.

  111. Ge0rG

    Zash: there is no road to the place where you'd have to drill, but a 100% slope of 3m

  112. edhelas

    what do you mean by geothermal ? just using the "freshness" of the ground ?

  113. edhelas

    like this ? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground-coupled_heat_exchanger

  114. Zash

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground_source_heat_pump rather?

  115. edhelas

    yeah ok

  116. Zash

    We had the shallow surface variant at a previous place. Don't think it had any problem with winter, snow is a great insulator.

  117. Sam

    The ground ones are fine in winter; the above ground ones stop working if it freezes

  118. Sam

    Which is still fine depending on where you live. It only freezes for a few days out of the winter in Georgia so you can revert to electric coil heaters just for those days or something and still be doing pretty good.

  119. Sam

    But then you also have to have that system installed

  120. Sam

    (I really wanted one of these, but it's just impractically expensive here sadly)

  121. edhelas

    Sam you mean a ground one ?

  122. Ge0rG

    Sam: I'm feeling with you!

  123. Sam

    Either; I mean yah, a ground one would be ideal, but it's expensive to drill

  124. edhelas

    yeah, it's better to do it while doing something else at the same time

  125. Sam

    There's an environmental chat room where this might be a good discussion topic, FIY 🙂 I don't have the address in front of me though. I think I found two on the search

  126. edhelas


  127. Sam

    Found it. I was just saying that xmpp:environment@chat.disroot.org?join might be a good place for this conversation (instead of jdev).