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lovetox
i have a user, which host its muc service and httpupload service on the same hostname
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lovetox
is this something usual which a client needs to deal with, or is this something a server opterator should rather not do
19:49:26
Zash
I don't think that should be a problem
19:49:40
edhelas
ah this :D I had to fix my database schema for those cases
19:50:03
edhelas
why XMPP admins always want to do funky things :p
19:50:25
Zash
Because they don't want to deal with a pile of subdomains, I gather.
19:50:57
edhelas
subdomains are expensives things nowadays
19:51:00
Zash
They'd put the MUC on the base host if they could (and some do this)
19:52:26
pep.
(yes!)
19:52:37
pep.
Also, it's prettier :)
19:52:48
edhelas
*doubts*
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pep.
Totally not subjective
19:53:05
pep.
like it's totally not subjective to ask for multiple domains anyway :P
19:53:15
Zash
Namespacing and separation of concern is of course bad things that we should avoid.
19:53:20
Zash
/s
19:53:25
edhelas
I remember that we talked about some MAM sync strategy, is there some documents somewhere that explains some good practices ?
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edhelas
better than "grab all the things since the begining of times"
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edhelas
found that one
19:57:43
edhelas
https://github.com/modernxmpp/modernxmpp/pull/41/files
19:57:54
Zash
https://github.com/modernxmpp/modernxmpp/pull/41
discussion: https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2021-August/038483.html
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edhelas
ok I see
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edhelas
hopefully I don't have the JS clients limit
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edhelas
finally, some good things of having a server side based XMPP client !
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flow
lovetox> i have a user, which host its muc service and httpupload service on the same hostname
should be perfectly fine, in fact, you should be able to run most services under the main XMPP name, which makes many things a lot easier, e.g. less dns entries, less stuff to put in the certificate (and to authenticate)
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Zash
flow, can I interest you in authoring a XEP saying that?
20:16:15
Zash
currently some clients don't work unless you put HTTP Upload on a subdomain
20:16:34
Zash
while some others don't work if you put XEP-0215 on a subdomain
20:17:10
Zash
MUC has the thing where it occupies nodeparts@ and you'd have take care not to cause conflicts with users
20:18:40
flow
but that's something the service implementation has to take care of
20:19:11
Zash
yes
20:19:47
Zash
IIRC some clients had to fix problems when you did put users and MUCs at the same hostname
20:19:50
flow
that said, I believe MUC occupying the same "namesapce" as user JIDs is a valid reason to have an extra subdomain
20:19:59
flow
but http upload would be better without one
20:20:47
Zash
flow, yes, but the examples show a subdomain, so that's what at least one client did, and thus you have to deploy it like that or it doesn't work
20:20:51
flow
Zash, did you open issues for clients which need http upload on an extra XMPP address?
20:20:57
Zash
and they didn't want to change because look at the XEP!
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flow
I think I could be presuaded in writing a patch for the http upload XEP to not use an extra XMPP address if it has consensus ✎
20:22:04
flow
I think I could be persuaded in writing a patch for the http upload XEP to not use an extra XMPP address if it has consensus ✏
20:22:09
Zash
I'm only really aware of Siskin, and that issue was closed
20:22:18
flow
closed as WONTFIX?
20:22:45
Zash
https://github.com/tigase/siskin-im/issues/37
20:24:36
flow
https://github.com/tigase/siskin-im/issues/37#issuecomment-625876730 is probably a hint that some tribal knowledge of XMPP got lost
20:25:03
flow
IIRC there is a way to iterate all "services" of a user's server to discover the feature
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flow
e.g. that PSI does to find components
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flow
that way, it should be trivial to discover that http upload is provied by the user's server address directly
20:26:18
MattJ
FWIW my preferred fix is for someone to write an informational "how to discover services" XEP
20:26:40
flow
yes, but I wonder why this is not part of xep30 already
20:26:58
flow
not saying that it must go int xep30, only that it feels like the right place to mention it from the beginning
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MattJ
Yeah, in hindsight it should have been I think
20:27:51
Zash
What's this saying? https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0030.html#items-relationship
20:29:07
flow
seems to come pretty close to it
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Zash
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0045.html#disco-service seems to perpetuate the subdomain requirement
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Zash
There's also the thing with node-less MUCs
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lovetox
in case of gajim, it works if you put httpupload without subdomain
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lovetox
what it seems the user did was, it put muc and httpupload on the same subdomain
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lovetox
which was unexpected because i discover these with disco-items
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lovetox
and for some reason i thought, every items belongs to one service
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lovetox
so after i found a service in the subsequent disco info for the item
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lovetox
i stopped looking for furhter ✎
20:57:15
lovetox
i stopped looking for further ✏
20:57:51
Zash
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0030.html#info-basic
> An entity MAY have multiple identities.
20:58:29
Zash
I thought it made sense to put all file transfer related things on the same host, ie proxy65+http upload+xep215
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