Wow I didn't know NLNet labs was sponsoring Conversations
aj
Holger: Ah, interesting. I use Swift actually, I didn't realize it was by M-Link
aj
I have a curious question, what was the main motivation behind BOSH/websockets support? Was it to help reduce battery life by reducing the need for a long-lived TCP connection? Or was it for evading corporate firewalls?
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Holger
aj: No, using HTTP doesn't help with battery life. Main motivation is that JavaScript clients cannot open raw TCP connections.
aj
Ahh
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tom
aj, does swift have jingle and omemo?
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Holger
tom: No.
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Holger
tom: Also no inline pics, and their MAM support isn't done yet. Other than that it's actually a nice client IMO (quite robust, and more usable for non-geeks than e.g. Gajim).
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tom
Is it planned for is the isode clients stringly text messaging?
tom
like just IRC-like functionality
Holger
I _think_ they're not big fans of OMEMO but other features are planned, but you'd have to ask them themselves: xmpp:swift@rooms.swift.im?join
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aj
tom: To add to what Holger said, swift also lacks file upload
aj
But it actually has working carbons support unlike adium
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Holger
> tom: To add to what Holger said, swift also lacks file upload
Yup. It just has old-school peer-to-peer file transfer (which works with e.g. Conversations or Gajim on the other end).
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tom
why do people put each componet on a subdomain?
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tom
is that reccomended?
tom
also, if i'm using mod_http_upload_external on prosody, do I still need to use a seperate componet if upload.mydomain.com is on a different domain?
jonas’
tom, you cannot have multiple components on the same domain generally
tom
generally?
jonas’
e.g. you cannot put a MUC service and a PubSub service on the same domain and expect it to not blow up
jonas’
you might get away with putting an upload service on a MUC service domain, depending on the server implementation, but that’s still messy.
tom
is it a protocol problem or a server implementation problem?
jonas’
I wouldn’t call it a problem at all
jonas’
those are just conflicting features to have on a single address
jonas’
e.g. when enumerating the items of that domain with both MUC and PubSub, would it return the pubsub nodes, the MUC rooms, or a mix of both?
tom
ok, so If I just replaced mod_http_upload with mod_http_upload_external and the external server is on a different ip and server, do I still need to configure the server to put the upload componet on upload.mydomain.com ?
jonas’
which server are we talking about?
tom
Prosody
jonas’
maybe ask in xmpp:prosody@conference.prosody.im?join ; I’m not 100% sure how http upload works in that regard
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Holger
tom: Note that the JID of the upload service is usually not user-visible at all (it's unrelated to the URL; though I'm not 100% sure whatever module you're using somehow wants to relate both after all). And as long as you only allow local users to upload stuff, you don't necessarily need a DNS/certificate entry for that either.
tom
only difference is that it doesn't show up is gajim's disco
tom
but gajim detects the new functionality just fine and enables the http upload button
Holger
Fine then. Still hacky :-)
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tom
how can I make in not hacky?
tom
are you saying I don't need a certificate and DNS pointing to the XMPP server?
tom
but I do for the actual upload cdn
tom
?
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tom
and that they can be the same thing?
Holger
I could only repeat myself.
tom
what?
Holger
But whatever. If your setup works it's fine I guess.
tom
I want to make sure i'm doing this all proper
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tom
yeah
tom
turns out some clients freak out and try to use someone elses upload server
tom
no idea why
tom
anyways, on an unrelated note
Would I have any interoperability issues if I migrated from an RSA4096 certificate to a ECC384 one?
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aj
anybody here use siskin before? how is the MUC support?
aj
I can't seem to find their official support MUC, I guess that's a bad sign.
Licaon_Kter
aj: try xmpp:tigase@muc.tigase.org?join
aj
ah thanks
Holger
aj: xmpp:tigase xmpp:tigase@muc.tigase.org?join
aj
but I guess it's a moot point now, I just checked with the #fsf, and they said that GPL apps are not allowed on the Apple app store
aj
so I can't really fork the project for my needs =/
aj
but thanks I'll join it anyway Licaon_Kter and Holger
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Holger
They would have to add an exception for the app store themselves.
Licaon_Kter
aj: what? VLC? Monal?
Holger
It's distributed there.
Licaon_Kter
My bad Monal is BSD.
Holger
Licaon_Kter: Yes, known issue. There was big drama around the axolotl library until Moxie added an exception.
aj
Monal is MIT licensed. I'm not sure about VLC, but they may be treading on a gray area
Licaon_Kter
Exactly
aj
I mean I asked the #fsf, I presume they know what they're saying
aj
they wrote the license
aj
Although they could be wrong, should I go lecture them? =)
Licaon_Kter
ChatSecure is GPL3 afaics
aj
He's the sole author though, so he can do whatever he watns
aj
if we're forking downstream, we don't have that freedom
aj
as the author he can do whatever he wants; the code he gives us is then GPL licensed, which makes it illegal for us to fork without an exception
Licaon_Kter
aj: what? He says this is GPL and publishes ok...but you can't fork it an publish in the same store? Wtf?
jonas’
Licaon_Kter, not necessarily, no.
aj
Licaon_Kter: Think of it like this. As the author, he can publish it, then say no rights given to you whatsoever
jonas’
he owns the code, so he can do whatever he wants, in addition to what the GPL allows/requires
aj
that would be legal. But he chose to release it under the GPLv3. His own code, however, he can do whatever he wants with it
jonas’
so he can also go ahead and give Apple permissions beyond what the GPL allows
jonas’
but you can’t do that, because the code was given to you under the conditions of the GPL
aj
He's not restricted by the GPL license, since he's not a recipient of the code, but the author
Licaon_Kter
> I just checked with the #fsf, and they said that GPL apps are not allowed on the Apple app store
Umm..what does this mean then?
jonas’
that’s one of the amazing properties of the GPL which actually allows commercialisation of free software. many people don’t realize that
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Licaon_Kter
So you need to ask for his permission, at fork time just to be sure, right?
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aj
I guess in this case, it's misleading for these guys to say it's open source then
aj
or free software, since we don't really have the ability to fork
aj
Licaon_Kter I think if you get his permission you can do whatever you want with it.
jonas’
Licaon_Kter, yes, and you need to ask the same permission from all the contributors.
Licaon_Kter
It's free there on Github, not on Apple store since they inject DRM, right?
jonas’
because it’s not obvious to them since they’re contributing under the terms of the GPL
Licaon_Kter
jonas’: that's their problem...when you contribute you should know....not CLAs to sign, F that, but you know...read LICENCE file
jonas’
Licaon_Kter, yes, but the LICENSE file says GPL
jonas’
when you publish on the app store, that’s not under the terms of the GPL
jonas’
so you need extra-permission from the contributors beyond what is in the LICENSE file, to distribute the code via Applecrap
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aj
ChatSecure has the same issue
aj
The dev says if you want 'to relicense this code to distribute it on the App Store', I need to contact him
aj
=/ ok I guess it's monal then
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Licaon_Kter
Secure their ok...first
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tom
jonas’, take a look the the dual licensing mess with the nextcloud apple "app"
tom
if you get it from the developers it's licensed GNU
tom
GPL
tom
if you get it from the app store it's proprietary
tom
it's the same app
tom
apple is so full of crap
tom
no developer should put up with apple's developer treatment
tom
I remember when they gave Vulkan the finger and tried to get game developers to use their own proprietary graphics layer called Metal
tom
and that's why macs have to games
tom
*no
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perflyst
> Conversations has a grant at the moment for implementing A/V, and some money comes in from commercial requests
what is A/V?