XMPP Service Operators

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09:32:22 Ellenor Malik new spmamer
09:32:41 Ellenor Malik jessieb@draugr.de
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10:18:56 tom fcrazytapok@conversations.im OTR spam
10:19:09 tom I've noticed a pattern too
10:19:25 tom They send two roster requests over several days before sending the OTR spam
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10:19:29 tom You don't have to accept them
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10:39:56 Ge0rG interesting
10:40:04 Ge0rG any other visible patterns?
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10:43:13 tom The names
10:43:40 Ge0rG random letter + wordlist item?
10:43:57 tom They appear to be (although I haven't had enough spam to tell for sure if this is definitive or not yet) ascii constisting of a word and a couple random letters
10:44:01 tom But always US-ASCII
10:44:09 tom And at least one word
10:44:12 Ge0rG Well, most JIDs consist of US-ASCII
10:44:26 tom Yeah but the spam is in RU/EN
10:44:33 Ge0rG Are there any pattern that can be used to differentiate them from real users?
10:44:37 tom So you'd think they'd also have a cyrllic name
10:44:55 Ge0rG I have many russian users on my server, but most of them also use latin names
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10:45:01 tom I don't think I can give you any more differentiateable patterns yet Ge0rG
10:45:13 Ge0rG I'd also take raw XML ;)
10:45:20 tom Oh
10:45:25 Ge0rG Unfortunately, the spammers didn't spam me yet.
10:45:30 tom Well I'll be sure to capture that next time
10:45:33 jonas’ I prefer cooked XML over raw
10:45:42 tom But
10:45:53 Ge0rG jonas’: watch out, or I'll serve you some vegan JSON
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10:46:00 jonas’ Ge0rG, JSON can’t be vegan
10:46:04 jonas’ too much suffering associated with JSON
10:46:14 tom When I send out the abuse reports to other operators, it's usually the case I hear back random IPs opened thousands of accounts a while ago
10:46:21 tom And just now started becoming active
10:46:39 Ge0rG tom: that's the usual pattern.
10:46:40 tom And the operator is able to remove the accounts based on a bunch being registered in a timeframe
10:46:53 Ge0rG tom: https://yaxim.org/blog/2020/05/12/new-anti-spam-measures/ has helped significantly
10:46:53 Ellenor Malik I prefer beef and onion json
10:47:22 Ellenor Malik which is less suffery than the vegan json i,ve eaten
10:47:27 tom Well if that's the case maybe we could look at honeypotting new accounts after they dramticlly exceed normal new user rates
10:47:29 tom As in
10:47:41 tom Don't cancel them just capture the XML and pretend success
10:48:12 Ge0rG I prefer not to silently blackhole new accounts, as there can always be false positives.
10:48:28 tom Ge0rG: can you add my jid as a member to the yax.im spamfighting chat?
10:48:35 tom I tried joinging but it was members only
10:48:38 tom I need an invite
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10:49:21 tom Ge0rG: do you know what kind of captcha the spammer is talking about?
10:49:26 tom The one he claims he can bypass
10:49:47 tom Bypassing google recaptcha is hella easy and there are services for that
10:50:02 tom But I was wondering if maybe there was a monoculture of captchas in the XMPP fedisphere
10:50:20 tom And that's why bypassing was so effective, or he/she was talking out of their ass
10:50:59 tom » ** 2020-09-21 » [02:47:01] <fcrazytapok@conversations.im> Реклама по Jabber / Advert on » Jabber » » [RU] Представляем новый сервис рекламы по Jabber! » Вы увидели это сообщение? Значит и десятки тысяч других пользователей » увидят ваше! » » Более 500 000 АКТИВНЫХ пользователей в базе: » - из открытых тем на форумах » - из дампов форумов всех тематик » » Собственное ПО для рассылки: » - обход капчи на стороне клиента и сервера » - поддержка OTR шифрования клиента и сервера » » Более детально здесь: http://gg.gg/m3a3u » » ---------------------------------------------------------- » » [EN] Introducing a new Jabber advertising service! » Did you see this message? This means that tens of thousands of other » users will see yours! » » More than 500,000 ACTIVE users in the database: » - from open topics on forums » - from forums' dumps » » Own software for mailing: » - bypass captcha on client and server side » - OTR client and server encryption support » » More details here: http://gg.gg/m3a3u »
10:51:31 tom You know
10:51:39 tom This same message is repeating every time
10:51:50 tom How resistant exactly is OTR to crypanalysis
10:52:00 jonas’ very
10:52:04 tom Well
10:52:06 tom What about size
10:52:28 jonas’ size?
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10:52:39 jonas’ you need to do a full OTR handshake before message contents are exchanged
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10:52:50 tom If you have a known plaintext can you infer if the ciphertext is the plaintext by looking at the size of the packet?
10:52:56 jonas’ for the handshake to succeed, you’d have to have key material which can recover the plaintext anyways
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10:53:08 tom No i'm not talking about reading the message
10:53:16 jonas’ but messages will not be sent before you could read them
10:53:16 tom The spammer send the EXACT same message every time
10:53:29 jonas’ you cannot send (useful) OTR messages before the handshake is complete
10:53:41 tom I'm wondering if you looked at the SIZE of the OTR ciphertext, if it was very similar or the same each time this message is sent
10:53:53 jonas’ for that you’d first need actual cipheretxt
10:54:00 jonas’ to get actual ciphertext, the handshake must have succeeded
10:54:16 jonas’ the "same" message you’re seeing is probably just the first message of the handshake
10:54:27 tom I've seen encrypted voice systems fall over because people could pretty accurately guess words by looking at the packet size of an encrypted compressed VoIP stream
10:54:43 tom (looking at your SiLK codec)
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10:54:51 jonas’ classic compression-before-encryption problem.
10:54:59 jonas’ but that’s also completely unrelated to OTR
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