XMPP Service Operators - 2021-07-30


  1. kuba_ has left
  2. kuba_ has joined
  3. sonny has left
  4. sonny has joined
  5. kryptos has left
  6. stpeter has left
  7. sonny has left
  8. sonny has joined
  9. sonny has left
  10. sonny has joined
  11. stpeter has joined
  12. Jonny has left
  13. Calvin has left
  14. DebXWoody has left
  15. alex11 has left
  16. stpeter has left
  17. Holger has left
  18. hhu has left
  19. hhu has joined
  20. kryptos has joined
  21. patasca has joined
  22. alex11 has joined
  23. kuba_ has left
  24. kuba_ has joined
  25. Holger has joined
  26. patasca has left
  27. Calvin has joined
  28. greenkeeper has left
  29. greenkeeper has joined
  30. Jonny has joined
  31. spicybits has left
  32. patasca has joined
  33. kuba_ has left
  34. spicybits has joined
  35. kuba_ has joined
  36. kryptos has left
  37. kryptos has joined
  38. mieum has left
  39. Douglas Terabyte has left
  40. Douglas Terabyte has joined
  41. Douglas Terabyte has left
  42. Douglas Terabyte has joined
  43. screamerbeetle has left
  44. johgus78 has left
  45. kuba_ has left
  46. mieum has joined
  47. kuba_ has joined
  48. johgus78 has joined
  49. Amolith has joined
  50. Amolith has left
  51. Amolith has joined
  52. patasca has left
  53. kuba_ has left
  54. kuba_ has joined
  55. ian has left
  56. ian has joined
  57. kryptos has left
  58. ernst.on.tour has joined
  59. patasca has joined
  60. stpeter has joined
  61. jgart has left
  62. jgart has joined
  63. hhu has left
  64. hhu has joined
  65. shaarad has joined
  66. kryptos has joined
  67. stpeter has left
  68. balabol.im has joined
  69. wladmis has left
  70. wladmis has joined
  71. greenkeeper has left
  72. greenkeeper has joined
  73. alex11 has left
  74. kryptos has left
  75. kuba_ has left
  76. kuba_ has joined
  77. hhu has left
  78. hhu has joined
  79. Calvin has left
  80. alex11 has joined
  81. hhu has left
  82. spicybits has left
  83. hhu has joined
  84. ian has left
  85. ian has joined
  86. spicybits has joined
  87. Douglas Terabyte has left
  88. Douglas Terabyte has joined
  89. takaeshi has joined
  90. patasca has left
  91. hhu has left
  92. takaeshi has left
  93. takaeshi has joined
  94. hhu has joined
  95. patasca has joined
  96. x0n has joined
  97. Django has joined
  98. Jakob has joined
  99. thndrbvr has left
  100. thndrbvr has joined
  101. hhu has left
  102. hhu has joined
  103. ernst.on.tour has left
  104. ernst.on.tour has joined
  105. patasca has left
  106. patasca has joined
  107. takaeshi has left
  108. spicybits has left
  109. ian has left
  110. spicybits has joined
  111. Licaon_Kter has left
  112. ian has joined
  113. p55s has left
  114. takaeshi has joined
  115. lorddavidiii has joined
  116. chronosx88 has left
  117. alex11 has left
  118. alex11 has joined
  119. wladmis has left
  120. patasca has left
  121. ChronosX88 has left
  122. pod has joined
  123. takaeshi has left
  124. wladmis has joined
  125. patasca has joined
  126. takaeshi has joined
  127. ibikk has joined
  128. ian has left
  129. ian has joined
  130. patasca has left
  131. ian has left
  132. ian has joined
  133. ian has left
  134. ian has joined
  135. raghavgururajan has joined
  136. takaeshi has left
  137. takaeshi has joined
  138. wladmis has left
  139. Licaon_Kter has joined
  140. patasca has joined
  141. writer77 has joined
  142. alex11 has left
  143. writer77 has left
  144. writer77 has joined
  145. patasca has left
  146. emus has joined
  147. patasca has joined
  148. tsk has joined
  149. Bjarkan has left
  150. Bjarkan has joined
  151. raghavgururajan has left
  152. kikuchiyo has left
  153. raghavgururajan has joined
  154. takaeshi has left
  155. neox has joined
  156. arcseconds has left
  157. arcseconds has joined
  158. takaeshi has joined
  159. Bjarkan has left
  160. Menel has joined
  161. screamerbeetle has joined
  162. patasca has left
  163. DebXWoody has joined
  164. 404.city has joined
  165. greenkeeper has left
  166. greenkeeper has joined
  167. bung has joined
  168. Wuuko has joined
  169. bung has left
  170. Wuuko has left
  171. bung has joined
  172. Wuuko has joined
  173. 404.city has left
  174. spicybits has left
  175. mx has joined
  176. tsk has left
  177. arcseconds has left
  178. arcseconds has joined
  179. me9 has joined
  180. ernst.on.tour has left
  181. takaeshi has left
  182. karme has joined
  183. ian has left
  184. da Stein has left
  185. ian has joined
  186. wancat has joined
  187. kikuchiyo has joined
  188. p55s has joined
  189. Bjarkan has joined
  190. kikuchiyo has left
  191. ernst.on.tour has joined
  192. abslimit has joined
  193. 神楽坂喵 has left
  194. kikuchiyo has joined
  195. bung has left
  196. bung has joined
  197. takaeshi has joined
  198. kikuchiyo has left
  199. takaeshi has left
  200. mjk has joined
  201. Bjarkan has left
  202. kikuchiyo has joined
  203. takaeshi has joined
  204. kuba_ has left
  205. Bjarkan has joined
  206. antranigv has left
  207. antranigv has joined
  208. arcseconds has left
  209. kuba_ has joined
  210. arcseconds has joined
  211. takaeshi has left
  212. mightyBroccoli has joined
  213. thndrbvr has left
  214. writer77 has left
  215. Huxx has joined
  216. screamerbeetle has left
  217. takaeshi has joined
  218. hhu has left
  219. Bjarkan has left
  220. ChronosX88 has joined
  221. Bjarkan has joined
  222. bung has left
  223. Wuuko has left
  224. bung has joined
  225. Wuuko has joined
  226. takaeshi has left
  227. hhu has joined
  228. Bjarkan has left
  229. Christopher M0YNG has left
  230. bung has left
  231. Wuuko has left
  232. bung has joined
  233. Christopher M0YNG has joined
  234. Wuuko has joined
  235. takaeshi has joined
  236. kuba_ has left
  237. Bjarkan has joined
  238. sven has left
  239. kuba_ has joined
  240. Bjarkan has left
  241. writer77 has joined
  242. Bjarkan has joined
  243. takaeshi has left
  244. Dave has left
  245. takaeshi has joined
  246. Martin has left
  247. kikuchiyo has left
  248. Martin has joined
  249. me9 has left
  250. takaeshi has left
  251. takaeshi has joined
  252. sven has joined
  253. Bjarkan has left
  254. Bjarkan has joined
  255. mjk has left
  256. millesimus has left
  257. millesimus has joined
  258. bung has left
  259. Wuuko has left
  260. bung has joined
  261. Wuuko has joined
  262. bung has left
  263. Wuuko has left
  264. Bjarkan has left
  265. bung has joined
  266. Wuuko has joined
  267. bung has left
  268. Wuuko has left
  269. bung has joined
  270. Wuuko has joined
  271. mimi89999 has left
  272. bung has left
  273. Wuuko has left
  274. chronosx88 has joined
  275. Bjarkan has joined
  276. bung has joined
  277. takaeshi has left
  278. Wuuko has joined
  279. Wuuko has left
  280. Wuuko has joined
  281. takaeshi has joined
  282. Bjarkan has left
  283. Bjarkan has joined
  284. loopboom has joined
  285. takaeshi has left
  286. takaeshi has joined
  287. ian has left
  288. Bjarkan has left
  289. Bjarkan has joined
  290. mimi89999 has joined
  291. johgus78 has left
  292. briest has left
  293. briest has joined
  294. Steven Roose has left
  295. alberto has left
  296. takaeshi has left
  297. takaeshi has joined
  298. Ian Macdonald has left
  299. Bjarkan has left
  300. mx has left
  301. ru_maniac has left
  302. xi has left
  303. xi has joined
  304. alberto has joined
  305. Bjarkan has joined
  306. takaeshi has left
  307. takaeshi has joined
  308. Wuuko has left
  309. bung has left
  310. bung has joined
  311. Wuuko has joined
  312. desnajpa has joined
  313. anhydrous has left
  314. raclette has left
  315. takaeshi has left
  316. takaeshi has joined
  317. alacer has left
  318. Licaon_Kter Regarding Calyx maybe we can do better as Ops in the _ecosystem_? Eg. Better than Riseup or Blabber.im's fate I mean :)
  319. Bjarkan has left
  320. MattJ e.g. https://mastodon.nzoss.nz/@strypey/106622172668359482 ?
  321. ij Well, I fear running a free service is often misinterpreted as free of cost. If users realize that running a service is causing costs in terms of money and time and willing to (partly) compensate, this might help
  322. wancat has left
  323. Licaon_Kter MattJ, ij: I meant help their service (calyx) so they don't need to shutdown (riseup) thinking xmpp can't into privacy That blabber reference might have been not needed, my bad :)
  324. Bjarkan has joined
  325. MattJ riseup and calyx are weird. They set up an intentionally limited XMPP service without any modern features, and then complain that XMPP is dead because it doesn't support any modern features :)
  326. MattJ I'm not sure how they can be helped
  327. MattJ Upgrading to Prosody 0.11.x will obviously fix some security issues, but it's not going to change much from a user's perspective
  328. takaeshi has left
  329. millesimus has left
  330. Maranda[m] MattJ: riseup said multiple time they'd shutdown their service this what? October? or something.
  331. Licaon_Kter Right MattJ The message retention is a moot point, use OMEMO, so you can enable MAM and http_upload, use a small retention period, and if you're asked for data from LEA they get useless crypto junk.
  332. Bjarkan has left
  333. Maranda[m] Mantaining a public service absorbs time tbh at least for riseup for example if they made it clear they don't have interest in mantaining it, it's better they shutdown it
  334. ru_maniac has joined
  335. Licaon_Kter Maranda[m]: "late August" https://lists.riseup.net/www/arc/xmpp-users/2021-07/msg00000.html That page sounds like Riseup didn't hear about PGP or OMEMO on XMPP. They recommend other systems with encryption... albeit they mostly say _"hosted by others not us"_ lol
  336. Licaon_Kter Maranda[m]: right, but say that that's the issue, not spread FUD
  337. Maranda[m] I'm not sure where they're spreading misinformation tbh: > We have a _couple of problems with XMPP_, **the most important one is that our labor resources are limited and we need to prioritize services that more people relying on**. Also, the past several years have brought new alternatives which do similar work, while providing important features which XMPP does not have..
  338. Maranda[m] I'm not sure where they're spreading misinformation tbh: > We have a _couple of problems with XMPP_, **the most important one is that our labor resources are limited and we need to prioritize services that more people relying on**. And if for the FUD you mean: > Also, the past several years have brought new alternatives which do similar work, while providing important features which XMPP does not have.. I don't see it much unpolite that's their opinion.
  339. Maranda[m] I'm not sure where they're spreading misinformation tbh: > We have a _couple of problems with XMPP_, **the most important one is that our labor resources are limited and we need to prioritize services that more people relying on**. And if for the FUD you mean: > Also, the past several years have brought new alternatives which do similar work, while providing important features which XMPP does not have.. > I don't see it much unpolite that's their opinion.
  340. millesimus has joined
  341. Bjarkan has joined
  342. Maranda[m] I'd just read the main line that they're stretched on resources and want to provide their users the services that are used most aka email and vpn, pads etc.
  343. Maranda[m] That's all.
  344. Martin Speaking of calyx, I just checked their records and find this one interesting: > xmpp-dns -s jabber.calyxinstitute.org > xmpp-server ijeeynrc6x2uy5ob.onion. 5269 > Priority: 4 Weight: 0 > … Is this a supported thing that servers with mod_onions use?
  345. Martin_ has left
  346. argon3771 has left
  347. argon3771 has joined
  348. Holger has left
  349. mjk has joined
  350. MattJ It probably works for servers that don't use mod_onions (but have tor). It's not secure though, being served via DNS... :)
  351. Holger has joined
  352. xi has left
  353. Martin_ has joined
  354. Bjarkan has left
  355. Licaon_Kter Maranda[m]: it irked me that they say that matrix, email and signal are better at having *less* metadata, which, afaik, it's not true
  356. Maranda[m] Licaon_Kter: they also mention DeltaChat as an alternative IM which is hilarious, tbh I lose interest there.
  357. xi has joined
  358. Licaon_Kter Maranda[m]: well, how would you classify it? Also, that [m] in nick means you've defected?
  359. briest has left
  360. Bjarkan has joined
  361. briest has joined
  362. jgart has left
  363. serge90 has joined
  364. mx has joined
  365. Holger has left
  366. Maranda[m] > <@_bifrost_Licaon_Kter=2foperators=40muc.xmpp.org:aria-net.org> Maranda[m]: well, how would you classify it? > > > Also, that [m] in nick means you've defected? It means I'm testing a lot of things lately, and I was asked to improve matrix <-> xmpp bridging lately so I'm doing that, and I have always been involved in building a developing bridges for xmpp in the past.
  367. me9 has joined
  368. neox has left
  369. Maranda[m] and about classification, as long as they don't blatantly get deep in untruth and unpolite people can have their own opinion, they made it clear about the true reason they shutdown the xmpp service. Rest is pointless to nitpick on.
  370. Wojtek has joined
  371. WojtekIM has joined
  372. Bjarkan has left
  373. MattJ Maybe you can implement better quoting in bifrost like they just did in the IRC bridge :)
  374. mjk has left
  375. Holger has joined
  376. Martin MattJ, but if you get the onion via the DNS lookup for example.com you can check the cert, like you do for other srv records as well. Right?
  377. Maranda[m] MattJ: maybe, if I get in another of my kamikaze moments like I did to fix avatar fetching, I guess being sick and stuck in hospital/home helped having the required time to do that also.
  378. MattJ If the XMPP host is example.com, yeah, I guess so
  379. alberto has left
  380. rozzin Licaon_Kter: Calyx would probably object even to metadata retention. Does OMEMO address that?
  381. Martin Not sure I understand. I meant: I get srv records for example.com and check the cert to be valid for example.com no matter whether the srv record points to xmpp.example.com or examplealernlsfl23002.onion.
  382. andrey.utkin has left
  383. MattJ rozzin, essentially no federated protocol addresses that, by their nature
  384. Licaon_Kter Maranda[m]: classify was about Delta chat...
  385. Licaon_Kter > Maybe you can implement better quoting in bifrost like they just did in the IRC bridge :) Yeah just cutoff the quote after 10 chars, that's good enough?!!?
  386. Licaon_Kter rozzin: which metadata? Roster? Bookmarks?
  387. Maranda[m] > <@_bifrost_Licaon_Kter=2foperators=40muc.xmpp.org:aria-net.org> Maranda[m]: classify was about Delta chat... IM apps need to be RT, one needs to explain me how you can build a messaging app that uses SMTP as transport that is bound for example to a countless number of delaying mechanisms to fight spam like greylisting, tar pitting, etc. to say one.
  388. bung9 has joined
  389. rozzin MattJ: granted, you can't route without cleartext metadata at the time of routing. Encrypting the data that was used for routing *in the archive, after routing is completed* (or even throwing that info away) seems like it could be do-able....
  390. bung9 has left
  391. wuuko has joined
  392. Maranda[m] So you send a message on DeltaChat and it arrives one minute later to the recipient, sounds "nice"
  393. MattJ That's called tor, and it exists and is usable :)
  394. Maranda[m] Ah also I need to mention daily rate limiting of most free mail services.
  395. wuuko has left
  396. jgart has joined
  397. ij > MattJ, ij: I meant help their service (calyx) so they don't need to shutdown (riseup) thinking xmpp can't into privacy > That blabber reference might have been not needed, my bad :) Wasn‘t it part of the calyx complain that it is too much work to continue the service? If there‘s some kind of money in it, that might change, but I‘m also no fan of all services need to be payed, so it‘s a difficult topic to find the best way between cost free and payed premium services
  398. rozzin Licaon_Kter: within the scope of the "limited message-retention period and OMEMO" remarks, which is the thing to which I was responding, I guess just the from/to info. But yeah, "can I encrypt and/or time-limit roster entries and bookmarks" is an interesting question too, however separate.
  399. MattJ Maybe start an XMPP operators shared fund? :)
  400. ernst.on.tour has left
  401. serge90 has left
  402. mx has left
  403. mx has joined
  404. ernst.on.tour has joined
  405. lorddavidiii has left
  406. millesimus has left
  407. WojtekIM has left
  408. Wojtek has left
  409. rozzin Hmm... So for the most part, DeltaChat = Google Mail?
  410. Licaon_Kter _Decentralized mail it is_
  411. jgart has left
  412. rozzin In theory anyway....
  413. schmillin has left
  414. ross has left
  415. ross has joined
  416. schmillin has joined
  417. tsk has joined
  418. jl4 has joined
  419. rozzin but "how will this work when those pre-existing e-mail accounts are hosted by Google" is a pretty good practical example to consider—both because so many e-mail addresses are hosted there and because those users have such a limited ability to actually receive e-mail from outside sources.
  420. wuuko has joined
  421. 4223 (private) has left
  422. wuuko has left
  423. millesimus has joined
  424. Wojtek has joined
  425. WojtekIM has joined
  426. Ian Macdonald has joined
  427. Ian Macdonald has left
  428. Ian Macdonald has joined
  429. Ian Macdonald has left
  430. Ian Macdonald has joined
  431. Ian Macdonald has left
  432. Ian Macdonald has joined
  433. ian has joined
  434. Ian Macdonald has left
  435. Ian Macdonald has joined
  436. Ian Macdonald has left
  437. Holger has left
  438. mx has left
  439. Ian Macdonald has joined
  440. Ian Macdonald has left
  441. lorddavidiii has joined
  442. Ian Macdonald has joined
  443. Ian Macdonald has left
  444. Ian Macdonald has joined
  445. Ian Macdonald has left
  446. Ian Macdonald has joined
  447. Ian Macdonald has left
  448. 4223 (private) has joined
  449. lorddavidiii has left
  450. Ian Macdonald has joined
  451. Ian Macdonald has left
  452. mx has joined
  453. Ian Macdonald has joined
  454. Ian Macdonald has left
  455. Ian Macdonald has joined
  456. Ian Macdonald has left
  457. kuba_ has left
  458. Ian Macdonald has joined
  459. Ian Macdonald has left
  460. Ian Macdonald has joined
  461. Ian Macdonald has left
  462. lorddavidiii has joined
  463. Ian Macdonald has joined
  464. Ian Macdonald has left
  465. Ian Macdonald has joined
  466. kuba_ has joined
  467. Ian Macdonald has left
  468. Ian Macdonald has joined
  469. Ian Macdonald has left
  470. Ian Macdonald has joined
  471. Ian Macdonald has left
  472. ru_maniac has left
  473. ru_maniac has joined
  474. Ian Macdonald has joined
  475. vanitasvitae has joined
  476. Ian Macdonald has left
  477. Ian Macdonald has joined
  478. Ian Macdonald has left
  479. alberto has joined
  480. Ian Macdonald has joined
  481. Ian Macdonald has left
  482. Ian Macdonald has joined
  483. Ian Macdonald has left
  484. Ian Macdonald has joined
  485. Ian Macdonald has left
  486. Ian Macdonald has joined
  487. Ian Macdonald has left
  488. Ian Macdonald has joined
  489. Ian Macdonald has left
  490. Ian Macdonald has joined
  491. Ian Macdonald has left
  492. Ian Macdonald has joined
  493. Ian Macdonald has left
  494. Ian Macdonald has joined
  495. Ian Macdonald has left
  496. Ian Macdonald has joined
  497. Ian Macdonald has left
  498. writer77 has left
  499. Ian Macdonald has joined
  500. Ian Macdonald has left
  501. Ian Macdonald has joined
  502. Ian Macdonald has left
  503. Ian Macdonald has joined
  504. Ian Macdonald has left
  505. Ian Macdonald has joined
  506. Ian Macdonald has left
  507. Ian Macdonald has joined
  508. Ian Macdonald has left
  509. Ian Macdonald has joined
  510. Ian Macdonald has left
  511. Ian Macdonald has joined
  512. Ian Macdonald has left
  513. Holger has joined
  514. Ian Macdonald has joined
  515. Ian Macdonald has left
  516. Ian Macdonald has joined
  517. Ian Macdonald has left
  518. Ian Macdonald has joined
  519. Ian Macdonald has left
  520. Ian Macdonald has joined
  521. Ian Macdonald has left
  522. arcseconds has left
  523. Ian Macdonald has joined
  524. Ian Macdonald has left
  525. arcseconds has joined
  526. Ian Macdonald has joined
  527. Ian Macdonald has left
  528. neox has joined
  529. Ian Macdonald has joined
  530. Ian Macdonald has left
  531. Ian Macdonald has joined
  532. Ian Macdonald has left
  533. Ian Macdonald has joined
  534. Ian Macdonald has left
  535. Ian Macdonald has joined
  536. Ian Macdonald has left
  537. Ian Macdonald has joined
  538. Bjarkan has joined
  539. x51 has joined
  540. Holger has left
  541. Bjarkan has left
  542. Holger has joined
  543. Mel has left
  544. Mel has joined
  545. bung has left
  546. Wuuko has left
  547. takaeshi has joined
  548. Maranda[m] rozzin: as long as they exchange some dozen of messages a day.. No problem
  549. millesimus has left
  550. Mel has left
  551. Mel has joined
  552. Maranda[m] When they start using DeltaChat as a real IM app, somewhere along the way they'll hit send/receive rate limit
  553. alacer has joined
  554. ru_maniac has left
  555. ru_maniac has joined
  556. WojtekIM has left
  557. Wojtek has left
  558. millesimus has joined
  559. kuba_ has left
  560. rozzin Maranda[m]: I typically don't worry about my e-mail to GMail users getting rate-limited or delayed, I worry about it getting delivered at all (and when it doesn't, it's dropped silently).
  561. Wojtek has joined
  562. Wojtek has left
  563. takaeshi has left
  564. takaeshi has joined
  565. da Stein has joined
  566. kuba_ has joined
  567. WojtekIM has joined
  568. Wojtek has joined
  569. wancat has joined
  570. vanitasvitae has left
  571. takaeshi has left
  572. takaeshi has joined
  573. jl4 has left
  574. jl4 has joined
  575. takaeshi has left
  576. sss has joined
  577. takaeshi has joined
  578. Wuuko has joined
  579. Martin In my experience mails are not dropped but moved to spam and gmail users seem to not check their spam folder…
  580. lorddavidiii has left
  581. Wojtek has left
  582. WojtekIM has left
  583. WojtekIM has joined
  584. Wojtek has joined
  585. Maranda[m] Martin: no all daily rate limits are 550 errors. Messaging too quickly will end in transient errors (450) as well
  586. Bjarkan has joined
  587. wladmis has joined
  588. takaeshi has left
  589. takaeshi has joined
  590. bung9 has joined
  591. stpeter has joined
  592. rozzin Martin: Right. Same thing.
  593. takaeshi has left
  594. takaeshi has joined
  595. Maranda[m] In other words those messages will get bounced not spammed.
  596. Mel has left
  597. Mel has joined
  598. takaeshi has left
  599. rozzin Martin: In general I can't really fault them for "not monitoring the spam folder"—I mean..., if you have to read through all of the messages in the spam-trap anyway, what's the point?
  600. patasca has joined
  601. bakunin1848 has joined
  602. bakunin1848 has left
  603. takaeshi has joined
  604. [czar] has left
  605. Bjarkan has left
  606. Bjarkan has joined
  607. [czar] has joined
  608. Holger has left
  609. stpeter has left
  610. wladmis has left
  611. vanitasvitae has joined
  612. wladmis has joined
  613. millesimus has left
  614. millesimus has joined
  615. Holger has joined
  616. undefined has left
  617. me9 has left
  618. jl4 has left
  619. undefined has joined
  620. andrey.utkin has joined
  621. xi has left
  622. wladmis has left
  623. xi has joined
  624. Bjarkan has left
  625. Martin The point is you don't get pinged if a message is marked as SPAM. But you should still check it every few days for false positives.
  626. undefined has left
  627. patasca has left
  628. Martin Especially if using gmail which flags every message as spam which is not coming from the big players but a small private server.
  629. neox has left
  630. takaeshi has left
  631. takaeshi has joined
  632. jl4 has joined
  633. undefined has joined
  634. vanitasvitae has left
  635. Bjarkan has joined
  636. millesimus has left
  637. tsk has left
  638. takaeshi has left
  639. takaeshi has joined
  640. perflyst has joined
  641. jl4 has left
  642. jl4 has joined
  643. jl4 has left
  644. jl4 has joined
  645. takaeshi has left
  646. hhu has left
  647. hhu has joined
  648. ian has left
  649. kryptos has joined
  650. undefined has left
  651. undefined has joined
  652. millesimus has joined
  653. andrath has left
  654. Харпер has left
  655. Харпер has joined
  656. andrath has joined
  657. patasca has joined
  658. Харпер has left
  659. Харпер has joined
  660. andrey.utkin has left
  661. millesimus has left
  662. millesimus has joined
  663. andrath has left
  664. andrath has joined
  665. kikuchiyo has joined
  666. jl4 has left
  667. Ellenor Malik small private player here i have okay deliverability to gmail
  668. jl4 has joined
  669. ij same here, as long as I use IPv4 for delivery and not IPv6
  670. kuba_ sending to gmail is not thard hard
  671. Martin No idea whether v4 or v6 is used. Why should it make a.difference,
  672. kuba_ sending to m$ is real husstle
  673. Martin No idea whether v4 or v6 is used. Why should it make a difference?
  674. Ellenor Malik > Martin wrote: > No idea whether v4 or v6 is used. Why should it make a.difference, people are weird
  675. Martin > sending to m$ is real husstle No problem with them here. 😂
  676. ij > sending to m$ is real husstle It’s sometimes even a hassle for MS to send mails to MS… ;)
  677. kuba_ :)
  678. madmalkav has joined
  679. melvo has joined
  680. kryptos has left
  681. Bjarkan has left
  682. perflyst has left
  683. ChronosX88 has left
  684. ChronosX88 has joined
  685. Ellenor Malik Is there a chatroom about email deliverability?
  686. Ge0rG it would be full of rants.
  687. Bjarkan has joined
  688. Martin Recently I wanted to send an email to my father (t-online.de) and I had to let them manually unblock my servers IP. 🤔
  689. Ge0rG BTDT
  690. ross has left
  691. ross has joined
  692. Holger has left
  693. hhu has left
  694. takaeshi has joined
  695. kuba_ Martin: you selfhost mail?
  696. Martin Yes
  697. jonas’ Martin, but at least getting on their allowlist is comparably easy. while you have zero chance with facebooglemicrosoft
  698. kuba_ congrats
  699. Bjarkan has left
  700. Martin jonas’: Indeed, I sent one email and got unblocked.
  701. wladmis has joined
  702. hhu has joined
  703. kuba_ jonas’: Martin said he has no prob with m$...
  704. Харпер Microsoft
  705. kuba_ Harper: yes, m$ is microshit ;)
  706. ChronosX88 has left
  707. ChronosX88 has joined
  708. eevvoor has left
  709. eevvoor has joined
  710. Dave has joined
  711. Bung has joined
  712. loopboom has left
  713. stpeter has joined
  714. Bjarkan has joined
  715. jl4 has left
  716. jl4 has joined
  717. Mel has left
  718. wladmis has left
  719. takaeshi has left
  720. takaeshi has joined
  721. adrian@kiess.onl has left
  722. adrian@kiess.onl has joined
  723. Bjarkan has left
  724. wladmis has joined
  725. wladmis has left
  726. Bung has left
  727. Bung has joined
  728. Martin m$ and microshit is a bit childish. 😁
  729. Bung has left
  730. Bung has joined
  731. kuba_ i say like this since i was a child.. so probably it is ;)
  732. arcseconds has left
  733. rob I can send to m$, had to request my server unblocked. Which they all are by default
  734. Martin Microsoft was no topic for me when I was I child. Afair we got the first computer when I was 13. 🙂
  735. Martin Microsoft was no topic for me when I was a child. Afair we got the first computer when I was 13. 🙂
  736. kuba_ i got it when i was 7.5
  737. Martin Lucky guy.
  738. kuba_ and it was '94 xmass ;)
  739. wael has joined
  740. Wael has joined
  741. rob Nice, I was probably 6 or 7. Grade 1, an Amiga 128
  742. Bjarkan has joined
  743. Martin '98 here. Late starter. 😁
  744. rob I think 89, because I remember thinking it was weird to start writing the year different later in the school year
  745. Martin I can't follow.
  746. kuba_ OT is ok here?
  747. rob Not really kuba_
  748. rob 😊
  749. Martin Hmm, there have been some incidents lately, so we better stop.
  750. rob xmpp:public@conference.loranger.xyz?join or xmpp:conversations-offtopic-reloaded@conference.trashserver.net?join
  751. Mel has joined
  752. Martin I have too many MUCs already. 😵‍💫
  753. kuba_ so we should shut the ef up, right? ;)
  754. takaeshi has left
  755. takaeshi has joined
  756. rob I only really lurk here and my public room
  757. wladmis has joined
  758. kuba_ im on
  759. kuba_ more than 10 ;)
  760. Holger has joined
  761. melvo has left
  762. Bjarkan has left
  763. arcseconds has joined
  764. kryptos has joined
  765. ibikk has left
  766. ibikk has joined
  767. Bjarkan has joined
  768. takaeshi has left
  769. croax has left
  770. croax has joined
  771. Holger has left
  772. chronosx88 has left
  773. Bjarkan has left
  774. patasca has left
  775. wladmis has left
  776. arcseconds has left
  777. emus has left
  778. arcseconds has joined
  779. Holger has joined
  780. emus has joined
  781. Holger has left
  782. arcseconds has left
  783. kryptos has left
  784. ernst.on.tour has left
  785. ernst.on.tour has joined
  786. wladmis has joined
  787. ian has joined
  788. Menel has left
  789. Holger has joined
  790. bakunin1848 has joined
  791. bakunin1848 has left
  792. wael has left
  793. ChronosX88 has left
  794. ChronosX88 has joined
  795. arcseconds has joined
  796. chronosx88 has joined
  797. Bjarkan has joined
  798. wael has joined
  799. bakunin1848 has joined
  800. bakunin1848 has left
  801. writer77 has joined
  802. wancat has left
  803. WojtekIM has left
  804. Wojtek has left
  805. mx has left
  806. ernst.on.tour has left
  807. ernst.on.tour has joined
  808. mx has joined
  809. tsk has joined
  810. takaeshi has joined
  811. arcseconds has left
  812. arcseconds has joined
  813. bung9 has left
  814. bung9 has joined
  815. bung9 has left
  816. bung9 has joined
  817. desnajpa has left
  818. xi has left
  819. xi has joined
  820. Menel has joined
  821. desnajpa has joined
  822. takaeshi has left
  823. bung9 has left
  824. wancat has joined
  825. bung9 has joined
  826. bung9 has left
  827. bung9 has joined
  828. takaeshi has joined
  829. wancat has left
  830. thndrbvr has joined
  831. patasca has joined
  832. jl4 has left
  833. bung9 has left
  834. bung9 has joined
  835. Bjarkan has left
  836. Bjarkan has joined
  837. takaeshi has left
  838. takaeshi has joined
  839. takaeshi has left
  840. jl4 has joined
  841. takaeshi has joined
  842. Holger has left
  843. Mark has left
  844. Mark has joined
  845. screamerbeetle has joined
  846. kryptos has joined
  847. Bjarkan has left
  848. screamerbeetle has left
  849. screamerbeetle has joined
  850. Bjarkan has joined
  851. hhu has left
  852. takaeshi has left
  853. takaeshi has joined
  854. mjk has joined
  855. tsk has left
  856. Holger has joined
  857. takaeshi has left
  858. hhu has joined
  859. takaeshi has joined
  860. 404.city has joined
  861. jl4 has left
  862. greenkeeper has left
  863. greenkeeper has joined
  864. BaBa has joined
  865. 404.city has left
  866. bung9 has left
  867. bung9 has joined
  868. BaBa has left
  869. bung9 has left
  870. Wuuko has left
  871. undefined has left
  872. neox has joined
  873. Bjarkan has left
  874. hhu has left
  875. mjk has left
  876. Bung has left
  877. undefined has joined
  878. Bjarkan has joined
  879. hhu has joined
  880. mjk has joined
  881. takaeshi has left
  882. briest has left
  883. takaeshi has joined
  884. Bjarkan has left
  885. briest has joined
  886. wael has left
  887. patasca has left
  888. sebastian has left
  889. sebastian has joined
  890. takaeshi has left
  891. Bjarkan has joined
  892. wael has joined
  893. patasca has joined
  894. mjk has left
  895. Bung has joined
  896. bung9 has joined
  897. Wuuko has joined
  898. kuba_ has left
  899. kuba_ has joined
  900. mjk has joined
  901. Bjarkan has left
  902. bung9 has left
  903. Wuuko has left
  904. mjk has left
  905. bung9 has joined
  906. Wuuko has joined
  907. vanitasvitae has joined
  908. mwk has left
  909. mwk has joined
  910. Bjarkan has joined
  911. takaeshi has joined
  912. hhu has left
  913. ian has left
  914. ian has joined
  915. Bjarkan has left
  916. takaeshi has left
  917. rob has left
  918. rob has joined
  919. Bjarkan has joined
  920. kryptos has left
  921. takaeshi has joined
  922. Bjarkan has left
  923. kikuchiyo has left
  924. Echo1 has left
  925. Maranda[x] has left
  926. Maranda[m] has left
  927. takaeshi has left
  928. kikuchiyo has joined
  929. takaeshi has joined
  930. mwk has left
  931. mwk has joined
  932. Bjarkan has joined
  933. hhu has joined
  934. anhydrous has joined
  935. Bjarkan has left
  936. wael has left
  937. arcseconds has left
  938. jl4 has joined
  939. arcseconds has joined
  940. jl4 has left
  941. jl4 has joined
  942. hhu has left
  943. jl4 has left
  944. thndrbvr has left
  945. jl4 has joined
  946. thndrbvr has joined
  947. balabol.im has left
  948. jl4 has left
  949. jl4 has joined
  950. Bjarkan has joined
  951. hhu has joined
  952. jl4 has left
  953. jl4 has joined
  954. x51 has left
  955. takaeshi has left
  956. takaeshi has joined
  957. jl4 has left
  958. jl4 has joined
  959. jl4 has left
  960. jl4 has joined
  961. balabol.im has joined
  962. Bung has left
  963. jl4 has left
  964. jl4 has joined
  965. bung9 has left
  966. Wuuko has left
  967. takaeshi has left
  968. takaeshi has joined
  969. Bjarkan has left
  970. Bjarkan has joined
  971. hhu has left
  972. Bjarkan has left
  973. Bjarkan has joined
  974. jl4 has left
  975. marevalo has left
  976. bung9 has joined
  977. Bung has joined
  978. lorddavidiii has joined
  979. Wuuko has joined
  980. marevalo has joined
  981. lorddavidiii has left
  982. patasca has left
  983. patasca has joined
  984. hhu has joined
  985. lorddavidiii has joined
  986. kuba_ has left
  987. lorddavidiii has left
  988. kuba_ has joined
  989. jl4 has joined
  990. mwk has left
  991. mwk has joined
  992. lorddavidiii has joined
  993. jl4 has left
  994. lorddavidiii has left
  995. jl4 has joined
  996. lorddavidiii has joined
  997. bung9 has left
  998. lorddavidiii has left
  999. jl4 has left
  1000. bung9 has joined
  1001. bung9 has left
  1002. jl4 has joined
  1003. Ge0rG Speaking of email troubles. I tried to send an email today to web.de, and that mailbox had an internal forwarding to a t-online.de address that bounced. Whom am I supposed to contact now?
  1004. bung9 has joined
  1005. neox has left
  1006. lorddavidiii has joined
  1007. lorddavidiii has left
  1008. lorddavidiii has joined
  1009. hhu has left
  1010. lorddavidiii has left
  1011. kikuchiyo has left
  1012. lorddavidiii has joined
  1013. lorddavidiii has left
  1014. kikuchiyo has joined
  1015. takaeshi has left
  1016. takaeshi has joined
  1017. lorddavidiii has joined
  1018. lorddavidiii has left
  1019. hhu has joined
  1020. lorddavidiii has joined
  1021. lorddavidiii has left
  1022. madmalkav has left
  1023. lorddavidiii has joined
  1024. kikuchiyo has left
  1025. lorddavidiii has left
  1026. madmalkav has joined
  1027. lorddavidiii has joined
  1028. Bjarkan has left
  1029. arcseconds has left
  1030. arcseconds has joined
  1031. wladmis has left
  1032. Bjarkan has joined
  1033. takaeshi has left
  1034. takaeshi has joined
  1035. kikuchiyo has joined
  1036. lorddavidiii has left
  1037. bung9 has left
  1038. Wuuko has left
  1039. zp1.net > ‎Martin‎: I have too many MUCs already. You are an intelligent person who has a lot to say and versatile interests. It speaks for you.
  1040. Bjarkan has left
  1041. zp1.net Ge0rG, I recommand to block web.de and t-online ...
  1042. wladmis has joined
  1043. kikuchiyo has left
  1044. neox has joined
  1045. Mark How do I get the Member role?
  1046. andrath has left
  1047. Martin > You are an intelligent person who has a lot to say and versatile interests. It speaks for you. I'm more reading and less writing. If I write it's most of the time offtopic so your conclusion is probably wrong. 😂
  1048. andrath has joined
  1049. Ge0rG "My knee itches" -- "I recommend amputation"
  1050. andrath has left
  1051. andrath has joined
  1052. Харпер Mark, add your jid to your server contact info at least temporarily
  1053. Martin should listen to pungent stench ampeauty again.
  1054. Bung has left
  1055. takaeshi has left
  1056. anhydrous Lol what
  1057. zp1.net > I'm more reading and less writing. this reinforces my thesis, and does not contradict it
  1058. zp1.net Ge0rG, Can your knee send emails ? :)))
  1059. Martin > Lol what Ge0rGs snarky remark just reminded me to listen to that great album again. 😃
  1060. andrath has left
  1061. andrath has joined
  1062. Ge0rG zp1.net: no, but my arm can. I've got vaccinated.
  1063. wladmis has left
  1064. Bjarkan has joined
  1065. Martin My arm was pretty painful when I lifted it after both chippings.
  1066. Харпер offtopic is leaking 🙂
  1067. neox has left
  1068. Mark > offtopic is leaking 🙂 Same happened in the main of Conversations
  1069. patasca has left
  1070. Ge0rG Martin: you got your arms amputated?
  1071. Martin No, got vaccinated. I'm not talking about phantom pain.
  1072. Ge0rG but you chipped it off and lifted it
  1073. wladmis has joined
  1074. Martin Another type of chipping. Got my 5g chips. 😂
  1075. hhu has left
  1076. bung9 has joined
  1077. Bung has joined
  1078. Wuuko has joined
  1079. jgart has joined
  1080. rob Wait I thought this _was_ the off topic for a second.. lol
  1081. zp1.net To get back to the topoc, there is this Oauth. you can login to Gitlab with an account from github for example.... Couldn't you do something similar for xmpp ? then you log in to a server with an account from another server.
  1082. ibikk has left
  1083. Харпер snikket is working on that iirc
  1084. wladmis has left
  1085. Bjarkan has left
  1086. takaeshi has joined
  1087. tsk has joined
  1088. bung9 has left
  1089. Wuuko has left
  1090. bung9 has joined
  1091. Wuuko has joined
  1092. neox has joined
  1093. info has joined
  1094. takaeshi has left
  1095. takaeshi has joined
  1096. schmillin has left
  1097. hhu has joined
  1098. homebeach has left
  1099. Server Stats Discoverer (traveler bot) has left
  1100. Server Stats Discoverer (traveler bot) has joined
  1101. homebeach has joined
  1102. wladmis has joined
  1103. bung9 has left
  1104. bung9 has joined
  1105. Licaon_Kter zp1.net: https://blog.agayon.be/xmpp_auth_django.html or XEP-0235 ?
  1106. info > Mark, add your jid to your server contact info at least temporarily Here is the account that should be attached to the contact details
  1107. Bjarkan has joined
  1108. wladmis has left
  1109. schmillin has joined
  1110. tsk has left
  1111. Wuuko has left
  1112. Wuuko has joined
  1113. jl4 has left
  1114. jl4 has joined
  1115. MattJ Your server lists no contact details
  1116. Mark Huh, must not have saved or updated, give me a sec
  1117. jl4 has left
  1118. jl4 has joined
  1119. Mark MattJ: Can't you just go look at the website?
  1120. Харпер that is work!
  1121. Харпер their valuble time!
  1122. MattJ For sure
  1123. MattJ You don't need membership to participate here, so it really doesn't matter
  1124. jl4 has left
  1125. jl4 has joined
  1126. Mark MattJ: yeah, but it's something to show I'm an actual operator
  1127. MattJ The shocking truth: not everyone with membership here is an actual operator :)
  1128. jl4 has left
  1129. jl4 has joined
  1130. Mark Really?
  1131. MattJ Really
  1132. Mark Oh
  1133. kryptos has joined
  1134. Bjarkan has left
  1135. emus has left
  1136. Mark Well, not really worth the trouble anyway, but that does expose a problem, why won't it update configurations
  1137. takaeshi has left
  1138. takaeshi has joined
  1139. MattJ In other news, it looks like the Tails project may be migrating from riseup to disroot, which is good news
  1140. alien has left
  1141. Mark Oh
  1142. me9 has joined
  1143. alien has joined
  1144. zp1.net MattJ, Sorry to interrupt, but how to find out who is the contact person of a certain server? Is there an api call for this ?
  1145. ibikk has joined
  1146. alien has left
  1147. MattJ I'm not aware of an easy way right now. There are some bots that can do it, and I want to make a web page that does it. And of course there's always XML consoles in some clients...
  1148. DebXWoody has left
  1149. Bjarkan has joined
  1150. takaeshi has left
  1151. Martin Profanity shows it in disco info.
  1152. info has left
  1153. takaeshi has joined
  1154. bung9 has left
  1155. johgus78 has joined
  1156. Wuuko has left
  1157. bung9 has joined
  1158. Wuuko has joined
  1159. Bjarkan has left
  1160. jl4 has left
  1161. wladmis has joined
  1162. kuba_ has left
  1163. takaeshi has left
  1164. kuba_ has joined
  1165. Bjarkan has joined
  1166. takaeshi has joined
  1167. henrik has left
  1168. jgart has left
  1169. wladmis has left
  1170. jgart has joined
  1171. jgart has left
  1172. stpeter has left
  1173. lorddavidiii has joined
  1174. lorddavidiii has left
  1175. kuba_ has left
  1176. takaeshi has left
  1177. lorddavidiii has joined
  1178. lorddavidiii has left
  1179. kuba_ has joined
  1180. lorddavidiii has joined
  1181. lorddavidiii has left
  1182. wladmis has joined
  1183. lorddavidiii has joined
  1184. lorddavidiii has left
  1185. gav has joined
  1186. thndrbvr has left
  1187. lorddavidiii has joined
  1188. thndrbvr has joined
  1189. wladmis has left
  1190. lorddavidiii has left
  1191. Bjarkan has left
  1192. lorddavidiii has joined
  1193. BaBa has joined
  1194. lorddavidiii has left
  1195. kikuchiyo has joined
  1196. lorddavidiii has joined
  1197. lorddavidiii has left
  1198. lorddavidiii has joined
  1199. lorddavidiii has left
  1200. takaeshi has joined
  1201. Bjarkan has joined
  1202. alien has joined
  1203. lorddavidiii has joined
  1204. lorddavidiii has left
  1205. henrik has joined
  1206. kryptos has left
  1207. lorddavidiii has joined
  1208. patasca has joined
  1209. takaeshi has left
  1210. takaeshi has joined
  1211. alien has left
  1212. ibikk has left
  1213. takaeshi has left
  1214. takaeshi has joined
  1215. Bjarkan has left
  1216. wladmis has joined
  1217. kuba_ has left
  1218. wladmis has left
  1219. mx has left
  1220. kuba_ has joined
  1221. wladmis has joined
  1222. Menel Gajim XML console can do it. https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0157.html
  1223. takaeshi has left
  1224. BaBa has left
  1225. balabol.im has left
  1226. Menel > <iq from='juliet@capulet.com/chamber' > to='shakespeare.lit' > id='disco1' > type='get'> > <query xmlns='http://jabber.org/protocol/disco#info'/> > </iq>
  1227. arcseconds has left
  1228. Харпер Can't you just do it from gajim disco directory?
  1229. kryptos has joined
  1230. emus has joined
  1231. wladmis has left
  1232. jl4 has joined
  1233. x0n has left
  1234. zp1.net That's suboptimal. We need it as a html/xml api call .. something hat everybody can open in a browser .. Simply like http://server?show_admin_jid
  1235. Menel Don't know, didn't try
  1236. Bjarkan has joined
  1237. Menel > That's suboptimal. We need it as a html/xml api call .. something hat everybody can open in a browser .. Simply like http://server?show_admin_jid I think for that people have websites.. If they want to advertise it to more than some _inner circle_ freaks
  1238. bung9 has left
  1239. madmalkav has left
  1240. kryptos has left
  1241. patasca has left
  1242. Bjarkan has left
  1243. patasca has joined
  1244. alien has joined
  1245. stpeter has joined
  1246. rob I think the suggested xmmp@ is really the best. A jid and email address
  1247. rob I think the suggested xmpp@ is really the best. A jid and email address
  1248. alberto has left
  1249. Bjarkan has joined
  1250. wladmis has joined
  1251. moparisthebest Or email postmaster@ and ask for their XMPP admin :)
  1252. rob Yes, or hostmaster, admin etc
  1253. Holger has left
  1254. jgart has joined
  1255. pod has left
  1256. Bjarkan has left
  1257. wladmis has left
  1258. zp1.net I agree but there should be a rool
  1259. zp1.net rule
  1260. marc0s has left
  1261. wladmis has joined
  1262. marc0s has joined
  1263. Holger has joined
  1264. stpeter has left
  1265. Bjarkan has joined
  1266. wladmis has left
  1267. lorddavidiii has left
  1268. Wuuko has left
  1269. tap has joined
  1270. Bjarkan has left
  1271. Bjarkan has joined
  1272. Jakob has left
  1273. arcseconds has joined
  1274. patasca has left
  1275. wladmis has joined
  1276. x0n has joined
  1277. alex11 has joined
  1278. wladmis has left
  1279. Ellenor Malik For jid, i use root@
  1280. jgart has left
  1281. Bung has left
  1282. ru_maniac has left
  1283. ru_maniac has joined
  1284. Calvin has joined
  1285. zp1.net I agree with any of them but I wish it became a rule
  1286. wladmis has joined
  1287. zp1.net this is something the xmpp consortium should decide and make a rule that everybody have to obey. I don't want clear names just a email where I can contact the admin if I have a problem
  1288. Sammy8806 has left
  1289. wladmis has left
  1290. arcseconds has left
  1291. Sammy8806 has joined
  1292. jl4 has left
  1293. jl4 has joined
  1294. wladmis has joined
  1295. mathieui zp1.net: clients should do 0157 and cache it, no need to add extra steps
  1296. Menel `have to obay` is not how xmpp works
  1297. rob Ya everyone operates how they like. A proposed standard would be good, but no guarantee
  1298. Ellenor Malik yes
  1299. wladmis has left
  1300. zp1.net If a server refuses to follow such a simple rule then I don't want to connect to it.
  1301. me9 This is totalitarian. XMPP is not representing that, is it?
  1302. Jakob has joined
  1303. Menel I mean zp1.net can write a module to block on that.. Thats the freedom
  1304. Menel I don't want or need that
  1305. tap has left
  1306. rob Same, we are all free to operate in our own way. With or without operability with any other server
  1307. Menel If I get spam and can't reach the admins thats a different topic. And then I'll terminate federation too
  1308. zp1.net It's ridiculous, let's not exaggerate, I don't want to change the world, I just want administrators to be reachable at a certain email address and that you don't have to search around ... one clear rule for all of us... .
  1309. wladmis has joined
  1310. me9 Why unseparably connect one service to another?
  1311. patasca has joined
  1312. kikuchiyo has left
  1313. chronosx88 has left
  1314. me9 And you went from everyone obeys to emails for all admins.
  1315. kryptos has joined
  1316. me9 Why not JIDs, if you really need that contacting possibility?
  1317. zp1.net look it is like the port 5222 ... if you do not obey to that rule you can not connect to us
  1318. me9 I disagree.
  1319. zp1.net exact I want a JID
  1320. zp1.net root, or admin, or postmaster or something ...
  1321. zp1.net but it should be the rule
  1322. Martin > look it is like the port 5222 ... if you do not obey to that rule you can not connect to us When I was on a shared hoster I used 51830 and I could connect to other servers just fine as they obeyed to srv… 🙄
  1323. kuba_ has left
  1324. neox zp1.net: well there's disco
  1325. Martin Also I don't understand why we need a dedicated email or jid when there is 0157…
  1326. neox (Martin: snap)
  1327. Martin neox: ?
  1328. Bjarkan has left
  1329. wladmis has left
  1330. neox Martin: I was just talking about discovery of "admin-adresses"
  1331. jl4 has left
  1332. jl4 has joined
  1333. Bjarkan has joined
  1334. kuba_ has joined
  1335. wladmis has joined
  1336. alex11 has left
  1337. hhu has left
  1338. alien has left
  1339. kuba_ has left
  1340. Bjarkan has left
  1341. jl4 has left
  1342. jl4 has joined
  1343. ChronosX88 has left
  1344. ChronosX88 has joined
  1345. Bjarkan has joined
  1346. hhu has joined
  1347. kuba_ has joined
  1348. wladmis has left
  1349. wladmis has joined
  1350. Bjarkan has left
  1351. kuba_ has left
  1352. alex11 has joined
  1353. kuba_ has joined
  1354. 4223 (private) > My arm was pretty painful when I lifted it after both chippings. You didn't got one left one right? It's better for receiver diversity!
  1355. Mel has left
  1356. Mark has left
  1357. patasca has left
  1358. patasca has joined
  1359. wladmis has left
  1360. Mark has joined
  1361. kuba_ has left
  1362. kuba_ has joined
  1363. ross has left
  1364. ross has joined
  1365. Bjarkan has joined
  1366. wladmis has joined
  1367. Харпер has left
  1368. tap has joined
  1369. Maranda[x] has joined
  1370. Bjarkan has left
  1371. neox has left
  1372. Mel has joined
  1373. Mark has left
  1374. Mark has joined
  1375. Martin Both left.
  1376. tap has left
  1377. Menel has left
  1378. patasca has left
  1379. patasca has joined
  1380. Jakob has left
  1381. vanitasvitae has left
  1382. Bjarkan has joined
  1383. alex11 has left
  1384. alex11 has joined
  1385. jgart has joined
  1386. Bjarkan has left
  1387. DebXWoody has joined
  1388. DebXWoody has left
  1389. patasca has left
  1390. patasca has joined