I locked in at the 2nd floor of the Thon hotel because I forgot my card in the gymn bathroom
jc
Anybody about to help me?
jc
Can't use the lift because it get back into the gymn
jonasw
ow
jonasw
I’m here to chat with you if that helps ;)
jc
Sorry, autocomplete
jc
Can't get into lift because that requires card, and can't get back into gym
jc
Thanks jonasw 😃
jonasw
(you should’ve brought the sword and just slashed your way out of that)
jc
Good idea, however I found a room service phone
jc
Less body solution
jonasw
hah
jc
Sigh
jc
Less bloody solution
jonasw
ah, body works too
jonasw
depending on how thorough you are
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
Tobiashas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
vaulorhas left
vaulorhas joined
MattJ
Tip: You don't actually need a card to get down to the ground floor
SaltyBoneshas left
dwdhas left
SamWhited
hi all, I'm going to be late today. Still feeling very poor and I want to see if I have a fever before exposing you all
SouL
Is there any group of people going together to Cisco's today?
SouL
SamWhited, oh, so sad to read that!
SouL
Let me know if you need anything, please.
dwdhas left
alameyohas left
ralphmhas joined
dwdhas left
Guus
Sorry to hear that Sam. I hope you'll feel better soon.
Guus
SouL: a bunch of us is leaving from Thon EU to Cisco at 8:30.
SouL
Guus, thanks for the reminder :D
jonasw
SamWhited, all the best!
Guus
SouL: I figured that I'd repeat this in public for everyones benefit. 😉
jonasw
would someone kindly pick me up in Dresden? ;-)
SouL
Guus, yes, that's what I guessed. Hehe, thanks!
dwdhas left
alameyohas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
Guushas left
Guushas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
alameyohas left
dwdhas left
Sevehas left
dwdhas left
SouLhas joined
vanitasvitaehas left
ralphmhas joined
vanitasvitaehas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
alameyohas joined
alameyohas left
alameyohas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
Vaulorhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
Ge0rG
What's today's agenda?
dwdhas left
alameyohas left
jonasw
more interesting question: what’s todays webex link?
ralphmhas joined
Ge0rG
I won't be able to participate full time today. The one topic I saw on someone's agenda that's not covered yet but I might contribute to is: SPAM
dwdhas left
Sevehas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
Guushas left
Guushas joined
jcbrandhas joined
Thanoshas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
alameyohas joined
Kevhas joined
dwdhas left
danielhas left
ralphmhas joined
mathieui
Well, we'll be as late as yesterday, I guess
Kev
Ge0rG: Well, we've lost the piece of paper with the agenda, but the remaining items were:
Spam
Bacon
XMPP Diet
IoT
Dutch trains and flight numbers
MIX
Client feature supersets
ralphm
The webex is not started yet, we need a Cisco person to do this and will let you know when that has happened
jonasw
bacon
jonasw
I want bacon now
Ge0rG
Kev: shouldn't "diet" be a sub-topic of MIX? I still consider it an order of magnitude over-engineered and would like to kill a third of the spec completely (proxy jids) and move another third into additional XEPs
Holger
I'll be late as well. My cold has gotten worse.
Kev
Different topic - someone wanted to talk about XMPP shrinking, rather than protocol lightness.
Intosihas joined
jonasw
Ge0rG, this may get messy, but I think proxy JIDs is one of the better ideas
Ge0rG
Kev: besides of that, I can offer at the uppermost 1h of my attention today, and I suppose "SPAM" is the best place to put it.
mathieuihas left
Ge0rG
jonasw: I think that having a separate external proxy service gives the same benefits without the enforced complexity
Tobias
Ge0rG, something better than whitelisting or blocking tons of domains, right?
jonasw
Ge0rG, wha--
jonasw
I’m not in a frame of mind to discuss this reasonably :)
Ge0rG
Tobias: yes
Thanoshas left
Kev
I think we'll start with the market share stuff then, as I think that's most interest but least remoteish thing, and we can't webex yet.
Ge0rG
What's "the market share stuff"?
mathieuihas left
Tobias
Ge0rG, what people think about that less and less products in the IM market use XMPP
Ge0rG
I have a strong opinion on that. We need a Jabber Software Foundation.
Ge0rG
feel free to discuss creating one. I'd volunteer into any position within that doesn't require to do actual work.
Ge0rG, jonasw, the webex url seems to have been updated
jonasw
indeed
Ge0rG
awesome camera perspective, as always.
Tobias
Ge0rG, you can thank ralphm for that :)
jonasw
a few words on context would be great
Ge0rG
Many users have user@domain email and "legacy" user@xmpp.domain addresses.
dwd
Reminds me of '90's youth TV, this camerawork.
jonasw
saying "IM" is a few decades too late, unfortunately.
Ge0rG
"Open" is absolutely burned.
jonasw
too
dwd
"Global" might work.
Ge0rG
I tried to resurrect "jabber", but nobody cared.
MattJ
GeorG, not going to happen overnight :)
Ge0rG
MattJ: Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2017 16:08:19 +0200 - there have been some nights since.
Ge0rG
George is okay
ralphm
jc: can you move slightly right?
ralphm
eh, left
Ge0rGraises hand
andrzej.wojcikhas joined
jonaswprepares his ears
jonasw
Ge0rG, highlighting dwd might work better
jonasw
I heard he has some smart thing which tells him
vanitasvitae
XMPP is such a horrible term. If I try to tell anyone about XMPP, they cant remeber it. Also I know of people which are part of the XSF and keep messing up even these 3 characters.
jonasw
exx ess eff is also horrible to pronounce
vanitasvitae
exactly
Ge0rG
jonasw: but at least it doesn't rhyme on "pee"
Zash
Let me tell you about XMMP
vanitasvitae
XMP
Tobias
Zash, Ex Em Pee Pee is rather easy on the other hand
intosi
We had an xmmp.org in our nameserver for a while due to a typo...
vanitasvitae
:D
dwd
Extensible Messaging and More Protocol?
jonasw
great camera work :)
vanitasvitae
maybe you should call it just the "X-Protocol"
vanitasvitae
or "XProto"
Zash
The Protocol
jonasw
"It"
vanitasvitae
ProtoCool
jonasw
might even trigger some remarkable flashbacks
intosi
Log on, Tune In, Drop Out.
Ge0rG
dwd: still raising hand ;)
jonasw
Ge0rG, they’re aware I think
jonasw
I think I need a audio dynamic range compressor behind that webex
Tobias
Ge0rG, ping
jonasw
I can
jonasw
I hear him
jonasw
but I thnik you need tune up a little, Ge0rG
alameyohas joined
jonasw
Ge0rG, CQ CQ CQ? ;-)
Zash
I can't hear anyone.. Not that I'm up or awake yet
Ge0rG
tuned up
jonasw
I can hear you, Ge0rG
jonasw
but I think that doesn’t help :)
Ge0rG
I'm making my point here then
Ge0rG
a) The Jabber name still has strong brand value in Russia and other markets. We probably can bring it back to life with a concentrated effort
Ge0rG
b) The distinction between "Jabber" the network and "XMPP" the protocol is great, like with Email vs SMTP/IMAP
Zash
Take some Cisco people hostage and demand they hand over the jabber trademark :)
Ge0rG
c) The Trademark usage rules are frighteningly arcane.
jonasw
hah
ralphm
Ge0rG: can you try saying something every once in a while?
Ge0rG
ralphm: just did
Ge0rG
d) I want to straighten that and have a "Jabber Software Foundation" to do client/server certification, nice logos etc.
edhelashas joined
edhelas
hi
Ge0rG
ralphm: please don't beat up the microphone
edhelas
the webex url is oudated I think
SaltyBones
I wish I could +1 some of the things you just said.
Ge0rG
edhelas: the one in the topic works
ralphm
edhelas: the one in the room topic
edhelas
Ge0rG indeed, thanls
Ge0rG
"works", video and audio are very pixelated
jonasw
I think that’s ralph messing with things
jonasw
hoping to get your audio working
Ge0rG
We also don't have the resources to rename our brand to something that's not "XMPP" or "Jabber"
dwd
That's true.
Tobias
Ge0rG, yeah..that would probably require new Logos et al. ...
Ge0rG
Tobias: that would require commitment from somebody.
edhelas
mhhh no video
Tobias
Ge0rG, more than somebody
edhelas
need chrome?
Ge0rG
Tobias: somebodies. Yeah. If we extrapolate from our current efforts, it's not going to happen realistically
Tobias
edhelas, you need the upcoming Cisco browser for it ;)
edhelas
trying with chrome now
dwd
So I'd probably be against a JSF, but only because we can barely get the business framework for the XSF running sanely. To have a new bank account, new Board, new Treasurer, etc would be painful.
intosi
It will confusingly be either called Spark or Jabber.
Ge0rG
SCAM is doing awesome work, don't want to blame them for anything, but we really need more than we have
Tobias
Ge0rG, indeed...SCAM does very good work
Ge0rG
dwd: you are right. I wonder if we can get away in a useful way without any of that.
dwd
But a client certification programme we could do, especially as we can start off with self-certification stuff.
edhelas
yup, works with chrome
Ge0rG
edhelas: we can see your cheek
Tobias
Ge0rG, what else do you want to see?
dwd
Ge0rG: So I think we can do this within the umbrella of the XSF.
dwd
Ge0rG: Which cheek?
jonasw
whoever was reading this: I’d argue that "We also don't have the resources to rename our brand to something that's not "XMPP" or "Jabber"" should be (e)
jonasw
(timestamp 10:00Z)
jonasw
the audio is really bad from whoever is currently speaking
Ge0rG
jonasw: yes, indeed.
jonasw
Ge0rG, mute your mic pls.
Ge0rG
jonasw: sorry
Ge0rG
jonasw: I hadn't given up hope to speak to the room.
jonasw
I unumte when I want to do that :)
mathieui
Ge0rG, we were able to see edhelas, hope is not lost yet
MartinHhas left
jonasw
daniel, +1
mathieuihas left
jonasw
sweet
Ge0rG
yeah. the curated client list was my attempt to improve that "no clients" situation
mathieuihas left
Zashhas left
vanitasvitae
sad that the term "fediverse" is already taken :(
Ge0rG
Also https://www.jabber.org/ is absolutely inappropriate.
vanitasvitae
yeah and the fact, that the "landing server" is (was?) closed for registration is kinda strange
mathieui
and the link to usshc is https, which does not appear to work
Zashhas joined
vanitasvitae
yeah, I dont get certification programs either
vanitasvitae
its maybe to get a little badge that you can legitimately put on your client
vanitasvitae
like "jabber-ready"
Zash
Nice plant
Ge0rG
Self-certification is sufficient in my eyes, the value is to be able to say things like "modern mobile jabber client"
intosi
Full Jabber / Jabber 4K
vanitasvitae
maybe that convinces clients to add it to their marketing which indirectly promotes xmpp/the network
Ge0rG
so then we have a list of "certified" clients which we can recommend to users
vanitasvitae
Ge0rG, yeah, but we are already recommending clients to peoples
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: and the clients we recommend mostly suck
vanitasvitae
just the fact that it is "certified" - will it change anything?
nyco
on the subject of marketing, we have to be relaxed about it
I went in peace with marketing, when I realised we all do marketing in some ways
so don't name marketing marketing
you have a point Daniel when you say it takes time, and should be done if you have to sell something
I agree the XSF has to sell something
I'd go for the "Lean" marketing, that is minimal amount of effort, for the best value delivery we can
being present by only sharing short thoughts on social network is impactful and costless
vanitasvitae
I mean already you can just recommend good clients
MartinHhas joined
vanitasvitae
there is no certification needed
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: there are no good desktop clients.
vanitasvitae
true
jonasw
nyco, it’s not costless
jonasw
it requires somebody to do that, which takes time, which is money
vanitasvitae
but will a certification program cahnge that?
ralphm
Who remembers this:
ralphm
http://ik.nu/~ralphm/tmp/jabberpowered.png
nyco
jonasw not forcefully, as we all do social networking everyday, it is just a matter of refocusing, using the same amount of time more wisely
jonasw
nyco, I for one haven’t submitted anything to a social network in years
jonasw
(unless github counts)
Link Mauve
ralphm, see at the bottom of https://jabber.apinc.org/
Sorry, it's not easy to adopt to this kind of post factual agenda.
jonasw
Ge0rG, SPAM isn’t happening yet, it’s IoT demo currently
jonasw
I can see SPAM happening afterwards
jonasw
it was said that this demo will be 30minutes or something?
jonasw
(or was it 10?)
Ge0rG
is it worth tuning in?
jonasw
dunno :)
jonasw
depends on whether you’re into IoT I guess
Ge0rG
I am, but not via XMPP usually
jonasw
heretic!
Ge0rG
pragmatic!
goffi
why does it take a while to propagate with pubsub on LAN ?
jonasw
goffi, a few roundtrips I guess
Zash
zeroconf/avahi stuff?
jonasw
browser -> webapp -> xmpp server -> client
jonasw
Zash, they said something about autodetection, but I didn’t find anything about serverless in there
Holgerhas left
goffi
it's not in IoT XEP ? Haven't read them
Zash
you can use avahi without doing the serverless xmpp thing
jonasw
there are no IoT XEPs anyomre, I think
jonasw
Zash, yeah
goffi
it's probably depend on what you call "take a while" then, if it's 1 s it's OK (it should not take more that that on LAN)
Zash
"multicast dns service discovery"
jonasw
End-Of-Demo
goffi
are the communications encrypted between devices and hub ?
goffi
and how auth is working ?
Tobias
next up SPAM
Ge0rG
right now?
Tobias
yep
Zash
What about Bacon?
Ge0rG
Meh. Ongoing business call :(
goffi
I'm on jabber.fr, working well for classic SPIM, but not for presence requests.
intosi
Presence requests are very problematic, I agree.
goffi
I wonder if proof of work could help here
goffi
but it would break compatibility
intosi
Renders some of my clients almost useless on some days. Can't find my chats in Conversations, for instance, because they're drowned by new subscription attempts.
danielhas left
danielhas joined
Ge0rG
I had to add a "Reject all" button to yaxim's subscription dialog.
intosi
Ge0rG: not a terrible idea.
Ge0rG
intosi: better idea is https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/issues/2246
danielhas left
danielhas joined
goffi
we where talking about XMPP popularity this morning, this issue is probably a major treat to it
goffi
were*
Zash
otoh, spam is an indicator of popularity
Zash
nobody would send spam if there were nobody to receive it
Ge0rG
Zash: popularity in russian hacker circles
goffi
on UI, it could be improved by not using popup, but a separated panel keeping all requests, and a not intrusive notification.
intosi
Despite its many flaws, Adium got that bit actually right.
Ge0rG
goffi: yes
Ge0rG
my next step is to make incoming messages from non-contacts silent
Ge0rGraises hand
goffi
anyway popup should generally be avoided
Ge0rG
> XEP-0157: Contact Addresses for XMPP Services
was that mentioned as well?
Ge0rGwants to discuss https://gist.github.com/ge0rg/2e4accf6950821ca45f743fdf587c08e
Zash
Ge0rG: I think someone mentioned that number, yes
mathieui
Ge0rG, Link Mauve talked about it
jonasw
Ge0rG, no video :(
jonasw
now with video
goffi
not sure that removing multiline messages is a good idea
MattJ
goffi, from non-contacts only
goffi
I have though of question too, and looks nice, but you don't know contact language
jonasw
ralphm, can we get that on the screen? https://gist.github.com/ge0rg/2e4accf6950821ca45f743fdf587c08e
andrzej.wojcikhas joined
danielhas left
danielhas joined
goffi
MattJ: yes make it maybe alright. I'm trying to think if people could have a good reason to send multiline. But anyway one spammer see that it is blocker, they'll just send single line messages
goffi
blockerd*
goffi
blocked*
MattJ
Already started :)
goffi
does anybody use reputation ?
goffi
is it efficient ?
Ge0rG
Yeah, IBR is essential to good UX
Ge0rG
We can't just block it
goffi
https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0275.html
goffi
actually I kind of forgot this one, but 275 seem a nice tool
goffi
why nobody is using that?
Zash
Because nobody is using it
goffi
the snake and the tail
goffi
we have to start at some point
goffi
also if a user is kicked from 2 MUC in a row, it's a good sign that other people can ban him
Ge0rGraises another hand.
goffi
could not we do a centralized blacklist also ?
Zash
we could
MattJ
Who manages the centralized blacklist?
edhelas
Ge0rG can you please lower a bit your microphone :D the sound level between Ge0rG and the room is quite different
jonasw
edhelas, no, you can’t, ebcause then the room doesn’t understand you :(
goffi
MattJ: it could be a XEP, and server administrator choose which one is OK. But may not be a good idea, I don't know
Ge0rG
edhelas: sorry, lowered now
jonaswraises hand
jonaswlowers hand again
Ge0rG
You could federate with blacklisted servers and just reject all messages with an error
Zash
MattJ: Why aren't you, yet?
Ge0rG
also all presence
Ge0rG
mod_firewall might be able to pull that off
Zash
Ge0rG: it can do aaaaaanything
Ge0rG
Zash: it can't unpresence me.
edhelasraise hand
MattJ
Zash, short answer for you: multiple DNS records and SNI
goffi
we could call the centralized list blocklist. Or blockchain to make it more popular
Ge0rG
jonasw: the manifesto should be a good decision foundation for what to add to the list
vanitasvitaehas joined
Ge0rG
goffi: stfu now
Ge0rG
:P
vanitasvitae
I think purely blocking malicious servers withiut gibing the user a reason why could hurt xmpps reputation (messages do not arrive)
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: yes
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: see https://github.com/processone/ejabberd/pull/2202
jonasw
vanitasvitae, yeah, thus <policy-violation/> which should be bounced back to the user
jonasw
(the sending user that is)
vanitasvitae
Okay
Ge0rGraises hand
mathieui
(I think presence spam is more important than pubsub spam currently)
Ge0rG
mathieui: yeah.
Ge0rG
Somebody is echoing the Summit room
jonasw
edhelas, can you turn your mic of, we’re getting echo from you I think
jonasw
edhelas, and that makes it hard to understand
edhelas
jonasw done
jonasw
ty
Tobias
or just servers subscribing to other server's block lists. So the server admin can subscribe to the block lists of other servers they trust. It would be decentralized and flexible. Although you wouldn't have a single definite list that you can look up.
Zash
Server Buddies! :)
danielhas joined
edhelas
on a decentralized/federated network you always have to base your filtering on defensive rules
intosi
Good name ;)
Tobias
Zash, yeah..something like that, i know there's a XEP about that
Zash
Yes, https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0267.html
Ge0rG
spam bots often come from TOR or open proxies.
Tobias
Ge0rG, right. That would fall into the detecing spammers in new account registration category, right?
Ge0rG
Tobias: or after login
Ge0rG
Tobias: registration and spamming happen from different IPs often
Ge0rG
"Security Question"
Tobias
Ge0rG, interesting. So spammers register via normal IP and then Spam from TOR?
Ge0rG
data form with question and answer value, case-ignorant.
edhelas
I'm keeping track of the IP and location of all the new registered accounts on movim.eu
Ge0rG
> admin278@propanatrx.com wants to subscribe
Sigh.
Ge0rG
Tobias: different IPs, but both are in [tor, proxy] list
dwdhas left
Tobias
Ge0rG, ahh..ok
danielhas left
Ge0rG
Tobias: also often multiple weeks between registration and spamming
Ge0rGraises hand
Ge0rGwill log off for now, unless explicitly pinged again
Is the towel-dispenser in the bathroom still so cheerful? It always gave a black-mirror feeling...
Ge0rG
What are the other pending agenda items after coffee break?
edhelas
mix ?
goffi
ah yes MIX was on the board
Ge0rGwould like to rearrange Client Feature Supersets to Super Client Feature Sets.
goffi
I don't get what is client feature supersets ?
Ge0rG
goffi: if at least one of your clients can do last-message-correction, store that flag in your superset, allow others to send you LMC
goffi
Ge0rG: OK, thanks
andrzej.wojcikhas left
goffi
with MAM that make sense indeed
goffi
Do we have anything for notifications ? It starts to worry me as we have many notifications and we have to take track of messages on a per-client level. I would love to have some server side stuff for that.
jonasw
goffi, that was discussed yesterday
goffi
jonasw: I haven't followed everything, was working at the same time, I hope I'll find it in summary.
danielhas left
jonasw
i think so, you can find the notes from yesterday here: https://xmppsummit2018.opkode.com/2018-Summit%20Day%20one.html
MattJ
What was discussed yesterday was notification configuration sharing
jonasw
goffi, 1.6
Ge0rG
Smart Notifications is an item on my slide deck.
MattJ
Read/unread message syncing was discussed though
edhelas
Movim is also sending messages to bare JID
vanitasvitaehas left
vanitasvitaehas joined
ralphm
Just to get this in your heads already. Besides manning the Realtime Lounge over the weekend, we especially need a few hands to build up the stand tomorrow morning at 09:00. Please let me know if you can be there at 09:00 and help out.
andrzej.wojcikhas joined
vanitasvitae
You could also try to stop federation with servers that run software older than n years :D
ralphm
How can you tell?
jonasw
jabber:iq:version?
Petehas left
vanitasvitae
ralphm:
Hm, i assumed that servers also send some kind of version strings, but I have mostly no experience about server software
vanitasvitae
So my idea might be rubbish :)
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: you don't want to punish stable servers... do you?
SouL
I'm guessing the server can always fake that or whatever
Ge0rG
SouL: the unmaintained server?
vanitasvitae
Ge0rG: you just have to select greater values of n then ;)
Petehas joined
vanitasvitae
Ge0rG: that would also improve the experience of users because of more features :D
Thanoshas left
danielhas joined
Ge0rG
vanitasvitae: there was once an awesome article about the two different paradigms of developing software: one is to add new features as fast as possible, the other is to view software and internet services as a kind of "basic infrastructure" - it is good when there are no news about it
Zash
Ge0rG: https://xkcd.com/844/ ?
Ge0rG
Zash: no
vanitasvitae
Ge0rG: but newer software obviously has fewer bugs, because thats how software development works 😉
Daniel_W
attn: we're about to come back
Tobias
we continue now
Zash
Who's paying you for this coffee advertisment?
intosi
Cisco, in a way. Half of the cups were free-as-in-beer.
Thanoshas joined
MattJhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
MartinHhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
MartinHhas joined
dwdhas left
Zash
Inventing the WHOWAS command from IRC?
Tobias
:)
Holgerhas left
Ge0rG
> alex: actionable outcome I'd like to suggest... some kind of discoverability mechanism. For example, giving someone's email address and then getting IM address. That way systems could discover IM details.
it would be nice to have something like that in DNS
Ge0rG
I actually had high hopes on DNSSEC-secured TLSA records for email address S/MIME keys and stuff
winfried
I will be at fosdem too!
Zash
Ge0rG: DANE for SMTP seems to be a thing at least
Ge0rG
Zash: right, DANE was the name.
winfried
there is a nice cloakroam at fosdem
Ge0rG
Zash: but I remember DNSSEC pitches with other, awesome, use cases, like PGP keys
Zash
No idea if that got into the wild. A RFC or two on it at least.
winfried
I will be there for the cleanup
danielhas left
jchas left
danielhas joined
jchas joined
Petehas left
winfried
what kind of extension cord is exactly needed?
Daniel_W
standard 3 prong power lead
winfried
for extending lenght or distribution?
Daniel_W
just to plug the projector in
jcbrandhas left
SaltyBoneshas left
Ge0rG
👏
andrzej.wojcikhas left
dwdhas left
jcbrandhas joined
Kevhas left
intosi
CEE 7/4 to C13
ralphm
winfried: yeah, just the general power lead you'll find on any (desktop) computer
Daniel_Whas left
jcbrand
Just putting it out there again... the minutes are available here: https://xmppsummit2018.opkode.com/
jcbrand
Tomorrow I'll see if I can upload them to the XMPP wiki
intosi
Thanks, jcbrand!
winfried
how many do you want?
winfried
;-)
intosi
Just the one should do.
ralphm
winfried: just one would suffice I think
SamWhitedhas left
intosi
Are you coming tomorrow?
winfried
yeah, not in optimal health, but I will come
jcbrand
you're welcome! Also a disclaimer regarding the minutes. I can't guarantee that they're correct or accurate. If you read something that's false, please let me know and I'll update them
winfried
take the train tonight, will be checking in arountd 21:00
jcbrand
Or perhaps later people can update the wiki
winfried
won't do any beers tonight...
jonasw
jcbrand, :-)
Guus
winfried: good to have you here!
winfried
thank!
winfried
now fetching the cord, before I forget it...
Tobiashas joined
winfried
(can deliver it including a remote power switch :-) )
jcbrandhas left
Ge0rG
jcbrand: do you have the minutes source code as well?
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
ralphmhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
marc.laportehas joined
MartinHhas left
danielhas left
dwdhas left
danielhas joined
SaltyBoneshas joined
dwdhas left
SaltyBoneshas joined
Thanoshas left
alameyohas left
intosihas left
flihas joined
joachim.lindborghas joined
luckyhas joined
MartinHhas joined
dwdhas left
SouLhas joined
Sevehas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
dwdhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
winfriedhas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
depatehas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
intosihas joined
dwdhas left
depatehas joined
winfriedhas joined
dwdhas left
jchas left
winfriedhas joined
winfriedhas joined
jchas joined
MartinHhas left
Sevehas joined
Thanoshas joined
danielhas left
danielhas joined
MartinHhas joined
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
danielhas left
danielhas joined
intosihas left
Kevhas joined
danielhas left
danielhas joined
dwdhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
Vaulorhas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
dwdhas left
danielhas left
danielhas joined
vanitasvitaehas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
vanitasvitaehas joined
dwdhas left
Kev
Anyone know if there's a store nearby for snacks, or a vending machine in the hotel or anything?
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
dwdhas left
mathieui
Kev: I think there's a small shop in the hotel
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
Kev
Ta. I shall go hunt in a moment :)
mathieui
If you walk to kuns-weg there's a carrefour express store too
SouL
I went there yesterday for some toothpaste
Zash
Toothpaste, the number one threat to airplanes
SouL
xD
dwdhas left
MattJ
Is anyone not going into the centre and/or going somewhere with more interesting vegetarian options planning to have dinner soon and want to group up?
MattJ
ESENTENCETOOLONG
MattJ
And completely unrelated, does anyone know of some simple tool to interact with pubsub? :)
marc.laportehas left
SouL
goffi, would jp help in what MattJ requests?
MartinHhas left
goffi
yes
MartinHhas joined
goffi
MattJ: jp (SàT frontend) is quite evolved regarding pubsub
MattJ
Is it easy to set up?
goffi
cf. https://blog.agayon.be/sat_jp.html
goffi
well if you are on Arch, yes
dwdhas left
goffi
else, I will be outdated and you'll have to install SàT by hand
MattJ
which is how hard? (on Ubuntu 16.04)
MattJ
We can take it into private chat
Kevhas left
marc.laportehas joined
mathieuihas left
SouLhas joined
mathieuihas left
Guushas left
Guushas joined
debaclehas joined
dwdhas left
Zashhas left
mathieuihas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
Sevehas joined
mathieuihas left
dwdhas left
danielhas left
danielhas joined
Ge0rGhas left
jonasw
MattJ, depends; is a python shell convenient enough for you? ;-)
jonasw
then you could "simply" import aioxmpp, asyncio;, connect and use PubSubClient to do things
jonasw
but unless you’re proficient with python shell things you probably don’t want that
MattJ
I could also use a Lua shell and verse's pubsub API :)
Zash
MattJ: You mean `clix raw`
MattJ
I'm trying not to get side-tracked, so I just ended up using Prosody's telnet console for now
Zash
clix raw +pubsub <<< pubsub(host, node):publish(...)
MattJ
My dream would have been a simple web-based client
Zash
Weren't you the one who said that generic pubsub doen't make sense by itself
jchas left
jchas joined
MattJ
Maybe
MattJ
But a tool for testing and admin would be handy
MattJ
Something I can see building into Prosody's web admin one day
dwdhas left
goffi
MattJ: what would do such a client, raw things ?
goffi
MattJ: I could easily do it, there is already all the pubsub methods and a web framework in SàT
MattJ
Add/remove/list nodes, add/remove/list items
MattJ
Change config, etc. (as advanced features)
goffi
yes that would be quite trivial to do
goffi
you can drop a feature requests on bugs.goffi.org if you want, so I'll see when I have some time
goffi
(but I personaly think that a shell is way more handy than a any graphical UI for such things)
dwdhas left
ralphmhas joined
peter.moestlhas left
jcbrandhas joined
MartinHhas left
goffi
MattJ: I've created a ticket actually, will see when I have time
MattJ
Ok, thanks!
MattJ
Looks like I just finished pubsub node persistence in Prosody, time for dinner
peter.moestlhas joined
dwdhas left
goffi
good news
jchas left
jchas joined
mathieuihas left
SamWhitedhas left
Link Mauve
MattJ, \o/
depatehas left
Tobiashas joined
xnyhpshas joined
dwdhas left
SouLhas joined
Kevhas left
dwdhas left
winfriedhas joined
dwdhas left
SaltyBoneshas left
ralphmhas joined
marc.laportehas left
dwdhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
marc.laportehas joined
Sevehas joined
Seve
MattJ: such a nice moment to do it, right :D
winfriedhas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
SaltyBoneshas left
marc.laportehas left
jchas left
jchas joined
vanitasvitaehas left
marc.laportehas joined
dwdhas left
jcbrandhas left
jchas left
jchas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
alameyohas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
dwdhas left
SouLhas joined
Sevehas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
Thanoshas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
jcbrandhas joined
marc.laportehas left
alameyohas left
alameyohas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
marc.laportehas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
alameyohas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
ralphmhas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
alameyohas joined
debaclehas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas joined
Intosihas joined
ralphmhas left
ralphmhas joined
alameyohas left
dwdhas left
vaulorhas joined
vaulorhas joined
ralphmhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
ralphmhas joined
ralphmhas left
ralphmhas joined
marc.laportehas left
marc.laportehas joined
dwdhas left
Tobiashas left
Tobiashas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
Sevehas joined
alameyohas joined
vaulorhas left
vaulorhas joined
Guushas left
Guushas joined
Guushas left
winfried
Is anybody who will be helping tomorrow with building the lounge already back in the hotel? I have the extension cord Ralph needs, but I don't know if I will be in time tomorrow...
MattJ
I'm not helping in the morning, but if you need me to take it and pass it on tonight/tomorrow morning, I can
luckyhas left
winfried
Would be fine, where to find you?
vaulorhas joined
vaulorhas joined
alameyohas left
dwdhas left
MattJ
Want me to come down to the lobby?
winfried
Is alright, where the check ins are?
MattJ
Yep, I'm on my way
dwdhas left
SouLhas joined
dwdhas left
jcbrandhas left
dwdhas left
alameyohas joined
marc.laportehas left
marc.laportehas joined
marc.laportehas left
marc.laportehas joined
marc.laportehas left
marc.laportehas joined
ralphmhas joined
SamWhited
oops, just saw this. I will be around and hopefully in fighting shape if help is needed tomorrow morning.
dwdhas left
ralphmhas joined
dwdhas left
Sevehas joined
Zashhas left
alameyohas left
SamWhitedhas joined
SamWhitedhas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
Guushas joined
Vaulorhas left
intosihas joined
jcbrandhas joined
dwdhas left
ralphmhas joined
ralphmhas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
ralphmhas left
dwdhas left
ralphmhas joined
alameyohas joined
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
jcbrandhas left
Guus
Tomorrow at 8 will be a good time to hand over things that need to go to FOSDEM.
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
Guus
Everyone that wants to help build up the stand, please be at FOSDEM at 9.
Guus
Some of us are departing from Thon at 8:15 to go there.
MattJ
I can bring it down to the lobby at 8, or hand it to someone now, whichever is easiest
Kevhas left
intosihas left
MattJ
Going to go with lobby at 8 :)
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
Guus
Also, some pictures of us, here: https://photos.app.goo.gl/4UaP0IEAFropPcxj2
luckyhas joined
ralphmhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
goffihas left
jchas left
jchas joined
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
Tobiashas joined
dwdhas left
dwdhas left
winfriedhas left
danielhas left
danielhas joined
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
Zashhas left
joachim.lindborghas left
joachim.lindborghas joined
Tobiashas left
jchas left
jchas joined
Guushas left
joachim.lindborghas left
alameyohas left
Guushas joined
jchas left
jchas joined
joachim.lindborghas joined
dwdhas left
marc.laportehas left
marc.laportehas joined
marc.laportehas left
Guus
You might want to check for people having breakfast, instead of being in the lobby. 😉