XMPP Summit - 2023-02-05

Summit must drive me crazy about XMPP, I see it every where:

https://jabbers.one:5281/upload/3zXHp6QQ5ZeBurKYejaSwakK/20230205_010010807_5351..jpg

GO TO SLEEP

😅

ok ok, good night 🫡

emus: hmm nice

tallship@jabber.org‎: every federated XMPP MUC (like this one) is bridged to a Matrix room (and vice versa), because several organizations run Matrix<->XMPP bridges - see https://aria-net.org/SitePages/Portal/Bridges.aspx for one example

using the above example, the Matrix room for this MUC would be #_bifrost_summit_muc.xmpp.org:aria-net.org

For my understanding thats not a bridged room, but a matrix user joining over a bridge

It's Complicated™

Anyone still at the ibis?

Yes

Been working on my slides, don't wait for me

Aiming to get to FOSDEM before 10

I'm at breakfast now

Not in a particular hurry

K, I'll probably be down in 10min or so

👍

Kev, for the record, my point was that hams aren't allowed to do crypto.

For anyone at the FOSDEM stand... I kinda published on Mastodon that I'd be doing a drop-in Snikket install support from 10am. Ralph and I will be heading for FOSDEM in a moment, but we'll not make it in before 10. I trust anyone present can either delay people, tell them to come back or (best of all) walk them though the Snikket setup: https://snikket.org/service/quickstart/ ;)

I'm at a talk closeby, if I'm needed, ping me, then I can pop-up

MattJ: sorry, didnt manage to toot this

MattJ: maybe later again?

About tear-down. We start around 17:00. At 17:30 everything needs to be cleared out, trash trashed, tables and chair collected, and floors swept.

Menel‎: I guess maybe I don't understand Matrix's representation of things - how would a "bridged room" be different from one that happens to be hosted by a bridge? (and perhaps this is off-topic, so it's fine if we don't get into it here)

ossguy: it is possible to "glue" two rooms together. Matrix users join a matrix rooms and xmpp users an xmpp room. But both see each others users and messages. Thats a bridged room. If I join a matrix room with my xmpp client or a matrix user does the opposite.. Thats just a user joining via a bridge. Not a bridged room.

I think the difference is on what is being bridged. If you bridge a room, it is a single room that has two protocol "sides". If you bridge the user, you represent that user in the other protocol somehow and the room having no knowledge about the user not being a native user.

I suppose I don't see why I'd want a bridged room (or why this would be a thing you'd bother implementing in a federated protocol)

from the joinjabber faq "Gateways" or "transports" enable users to connect to other networks (IRC, Matrix...) as if they had joined it directly; the gateway will create a user session on the remote network in a process called "puppeteering"; "Bridges" connect collective spaces (such as chatrooms) across networks without user intervention ; they can relay message through a dedicated user (relay bot) or by "puppeteering" users on remote networks. Some remote networks also allow the relay bot to temporarily change its name with is referred to as "user spoofing".

Matrix uses a lot of bridged rooms for irc. See the fdroid room. It is bridged via at least three protocols ✏

Federation is hard enough. Federating two federations is something that I don't get know how to do reasonably. You either have to relay and have multiple hops or you need to settle on a single s2s protocol.

Menel: yeah, I can see why for IRC (since IRC isn't federated) but it doesn't make sense to me for other federated protocols

yeah. or you lose all the features and it is just text

like irc bridged rooms

I've never once seen bridged rooms with good UX

Of the matrix bridge would just behave like biboumi, and the users would just know they write for irc too, it would be ok

Vs just having 1 source of truths and other protocols running their own transports, for example biboumi has *excellent* ux for folks in both sides

one of the things that bugs me about biboumi is having to remember how to write the uri to join a room

plus that it is irc of course

ralphm: when you say "the room having no knowledge about the user not being a native user", how does that work? wouldn't people still be able to tell by the user's Matrix ID (or Jabber ID)? or are you saying that the person needs to register an additional Matrix/Jabber ID in order to join a bridged room?

Biboumi could probably help you write the URL with adhoc commands or similar, but it's pretty straightforward

#room%ircserver@yourxmppcomponent.tld. Just remember # % done

of course. looks practically the same as xmpp rooms /s

(which reminds me of another thought I had: if people are concerned about "yucky-looking" JIDs/Matrix IDs for their rooms (i.e. that's why they want to make a "bridge room"), wouldn't a simpler "ID alias" protocol be better?)

MSavoritias (fae,ve): it's channel%server@biboumi unsure how it could get easier

# is part of the channel name typically on most (but not all!) IRC servers

German Train just gave me an extra cookie because I paid cash^^ Was a great experiences folks, hope to see you soon!

Are there any other images from the talks?

https://jabbers.one:5281/upload/AcpDrp-HaFDi1rfJQYEYi2np/20230205_170955479_315a..jpg

At fosdem

vanitasvitae:

> emus‎ Thanks for the picture

airjump: just remind its from the summit. More in our social media

moparisthebest: biboumi lets you dedicate an fqdn to a specific server, so you can do #room@servername.biboumi.example, which is nice

Uh. Didn't yet find that option, interesting!

mathieui: right but that requires running a biboumi per IRC server right? Still a nice option to have for sure ✏

moparisthebest, yep

But anyway if the channel host wants to "bridge" that's 100% the correct way to do it, as you still keep the single source of truth model

MattJ, nice picture in the room, with "[Matrix]" on the board right behind you :P

MattJ: we've parked the bus on the south side of the city. If you're still on the bus, exit around the Royal Palace

Does anyone know if this is still just jitsi meet? https://mastodon.app.stefanberggren.se/@nsg/109812855489337292

(the matrix group video chat)

its native afaik: https://call.element.io/

but they moved away from webrtc to matrixrtc: https://github.com/matrix-org/matrix-spec-proposals/blob/matthew/group-voip/proposals/3401-group-voip.md

so jingle but matrix it seems

ralphm: ah missed that, just returned to the hotel

At some point it was jitsi meet though, I hadn't heard if they changed

Thanks guys for your work and openness there!

ralphm: we're hopping on a bus towards Royal Palace, will be there in 15ish minutes

We're actually here: Skievelat +32 2 502 25 12 https://maps.app.goo.gl/GFxpAPNz4fbK53Sv8

We've already ordered, so you'll have to consider what's the best strategy for food. I'll leave for home right after, but the other guys well surely be up for drinks

will

Syndace: ^

> Arne: > 2023-02-05 06:58 (GMT+01:00) > Thanks guys for your work and openness there! 💚🧡💙

Boarded plane and leaving Brussels for this time. Thanks and good work all!

safe flight

Hope you all had a good fosdem and xsf dinner!

jabberjocke: Thanks!

Sorry for not being so active

Next year 🥳

😊

Syndace: on my way inside

alameyo: we're upstairs (middle floor?)