XSF Discussion - 2010-10-20

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  37. Nÿco


  38. Nÿco


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  40. stpeter

    I think we begin in 1 hour, no?

  41. stpeter


  42. stpeter

    maybe not :|

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  44. Nÿco

    I cannot be there in an hour, sorry

  45. Nÿco

    it is so hard to organize a Board meeting!... ;-)

  46. stpeter


  47. stpeter

    who is online? we can poke them about showing up

  48. stpeter

    I don't see Will online

  49. stpeter

    Florian is around

  50. stpeter

    and Jack is away

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  52. Jehan


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  54. Florian


  55. stpeter

    hi Florian

  56. stpeter

    and Jehan

  57. stpeter

    I pinged Jack but he is away

  58. Florian


  59. Jehan

    Hi Peter. And Florian. ;-)

  60. Florian

    Will seems to be away too

  61. Nÿco

    well... what should we discuss about

  62. stpeter

    I didn't see Will online

  63. Nÿco

    is the agenda (copied-pasted from last minutes) ok?

  64. stpeter


  65. Nÿco

    so 1/

  66. Nÿco

    - New Website

  67. Nÿco

    but Will's not here

  68. Nÿco

    next item?

  69. stpeter


  70. stpeter


  71. Nÿco

    2/ Sponsors

  72. stpeter

    bear volunteered to maintain some pages

  73. stpeter

    e.g., the software pages

  74. Kev

    I've given bear access to do that.

  75. stpeter

    Jehan sent some bug reports but I don't know if those were fixed

  76. stpeter


  77. stpeter

    thanks, Kev

  78. stpeter

    and I've been pinging some folks about the services page, which I'm way behind on fixing

  79. stpeter

    or updating, rather

  80. Florian

    we've got our first sponsor Voxeo

  81. Florian

    we just need to put them on the site

  82. stpeter


  83. stpeter


  84. stpeter

    next week I will contact some other potential sponsors

  85. stpeter

    or maybe this Friday

  86. stpeter puts it on his calendar

  87. Florian


  88. stpeter


  89. Florian

    I'll bug Nokia once more

  90. stpeter

    Nÿco: I'm sorry about the time confusion

  91. Nÿco

    no pb

  92. Nÿco

    it's fixed now ;-)

  93. stpeter


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  95. stpeter

    so I think that's sponsors

  96. stpeter


  97. Nÿco

    - Roadmap update

  98. stpeter

    ah yes

  99. stpeter

    Florian was going to send a summary to the members@ list

  100. Nÿco

    have we summarized the discussions?

  101. Nÿco


  102. Nÿco

    is it a duty of the next Board?

  103. stpeter

    well Florian can send the summary as a regular member :)

  104. Nÿco


  105. Nÿco

    I mean, a duty to re-write and supervise?

  106. stpeter


  107. stpeter

    no, just to send the summary

  108. stpeter

    then we can update the document, or I can send proposed changes to the members@ list

  109. Nÿco


  110. stpeter

    I'll also put that on my calendar for this Friday

  111. Nÿco

    ok, thx

  112. Nÿco


  113. stpeter

    I think we can drop GSoC off the agenda, although I haven't followed up with payment -- that should be happening automatically because they have our data on file

  114. stpeter

    Friday will be my XSF day :)

  115. Nÿco

    - Elections

  116. stpeter

    yes, fun stuff

  117. Nÿco

    what do we need to talk about here?

  118. stpeter

    lots of good candidates this year -- it was hard to figure out my voting preferences!

  119. Nÿco

    maybe a few bot issues?

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  121. stpeter

    Kev raised a possible issue in the Council meeting the other day, but I'd prefer not to discuss that unless we experience a problem in the voting :)

  122. Kev


  123. stpeter

    but after this round of voting I think we might need to fix the procedures yet again :(

  124. Kev

    On the plus side, this isn't a bylaws change needed to fix it :)

  125. stpeter

    http://xmpp.org:5290/muc_log/muc.xmpp.org/council/101018/#18:10:14 is you're curious

  126. koski

    stpeter: Merci

  127. stpeter

    Nÿco: what else is on the agenda? I'm running another meeting while I'm in this one and I haven't found the agenda email yet :/

  128. Nÿco

    - Mini Summits

  129. stpeter

    do we need to sanction these? have some meetups and enjoy! :)

  130. stpeter

    but perhaps people would like some kind of official blessing?

  131. Nÿco

    yes, this can be done without the XSF ascend

  132. Nÿco

    so, no more items in this agenda

  133. stpeter

    Florian: what do you think?

  134. Kev

    As long as they get announced on the sensible MLs, I think it's fine.

  135. Nÿco

    any more item you should to talk about?

  136. Kev

    For my non-Board opinion.

  137. stpeter laughs at Kev's message on the XMPP WG list

  138. Nÿco

    ok then, last item: next meeting => should we let the next board decide?

  139. stpeter

    so it seems :)

  140. Nÿco

    http://typewith.me/YPtgqcetvL minutes, please review, fix, correct, amend, etc.

  141. stpeter

    I'll check the minutes a bit after my other meeting finishes

  142. stpeter

    and presumably Will and Jack might show up in 15 minutes, at which time we'll have this meeting all over again ;-)

  143. Nÿco


  144. Nÿco

    ok, I need to leave you now

  145. Nÿco


  146. stpeter

    no problem!

  147. stpeter


  148. Nÿco

    thank to you

  149. Nÿco


  150. stpeter

    sorry again about the confusion

  151. Nÿco

    np ;-)

  152. stpeter


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  154. Jehan

    So that's a board meeting...

  155. Jehan

    Fast. :-D

  156. stpeter


  157. Jehan

    So the XSF has actually only one sponsor right now?

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  160. stpeter

    Jehan: well, it depends on how you count :)

  161. jack

    sorry. i was out doing errands and planning to be back at noon :)

  162. Jehan

    I don't know: up to 10, with my hand fingers, up to 20 with my foot fingers, after this I cannot count.

  163. Jehan


  164. jack

    just in time to have made it to the meeting that was at the wrong time :)

  165. will.sheward

    and i was stuck in traffic

  166. will.sheward

    so we both fail :-(

  167. stpeter

    it was my fault

  168. will.sheward

    i'm happy to blame others :-)

  169. Kev

    I suspect it was a marketing problem.

  170. will.sheward

    shut up

  171. will.sheward

    oh, actually the calendar says the meetings starts in 3 mins

  172. stpeter

    minutes at http://typewith.me/YPtgqcetvL

  173. stpeter

    will.sheward: because I got it wrong

  174. stpeter

    so you guys can review the minutes and see if you have other issues

  175. will.sheward

    so it was just me missing then?

  176. stpeter

    and Jack

  177. stpeter laughs

  178. stpeter

    I like Will's edits

  179. will.sheward

    i'm a stickler for accuracy

  180. will.sheward

    is there a chat log to read?

  181. stpeter

    I can paste the log from this room into the minutes

  182. stpeter

    please hold

  183. Kev

    Yes, this room is logged isn't it?

  184. stpeter


  185. stpeter


  186. stpeter


  187. will.sheward

    thanks peter

  188. Kev

    That's the puppy.

  189. stpeter

    now you have two options for your reading pleasure

  190. will.sheward

    ok read the minutes (that was a quick meeting!).

  191. stpeter

    it just seemed quick :P

  192. will.sheward

    I'm of to get dinner. I may see you at the next meeting, or I may not :-)

  193. stpeter


  194. stpeter

    will.sheward: anything we need to know about the website?

  195. will.sheward

    yes, it's awesome.

  196. stpeter


  197. will.sheward

    i'm still writing up notes, i'll make sure the correct people have them. but things are settling down. just need to sort redirects.

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  199. Jehan

    Yeah I really like the new website as well. Just to say.

  200. stpeter


  201. stpeter

    Will gets the credit

  202. Jehan


  203. Jehan


  204. stpeter

    he did the work, so we praise him above all others :)

  205. Jehan

    Will, as Will Sheward, not "will" as future auxiliary. :-D

  206. stpeter


  207. stpeter

    it's quite confusing to write the minutes :)

  208. Jehan

    Why is that?

  209. stpeter

    "Will will do X"

  210. stpeter

    so I write them as "Will to do X, Jack to do Y"

  211. stpeter

    jack: any feedback on the minutes or log?

  212. jack

    looked good to me

  213. Jehan


  214. Jehan

    jack: why is your writing displayed in big characters?

  215. stpeter

    most excellent

  216. Jehan

    At least here (with Pidgin today).

  217. stpeter

    XHTML-IM, I suppose

  218. jack

    adium hates me i think

  219. stpeter laughs

  220. Jehan

    I guess. But I was wondering if he made it on purpose. Something like he has such an ego that he modified his default conf, thinking "everyone must see my text soooo much bigger!!!". :-D

  221. Kev

    We can configure the room to strip that if you like.

  222. Kev

    Ah, no we can't, this is xmpp.org.

  223. stpeter


  224. Jehan

    What is the difference with jabber.org?

  225. Kev

    Different software.

  226. Jehan

    The server?

  227. Jehan

    Ok. Wht is on xmpp.org?

  228. Kev


  229. Jehan


  230. stpeter

    and they are run on different machines, too

  231. Jehan

    Is that also an opened server?

  232. Jehan

    I mean, people can make JID with xmpp.org?

  233. Kev

    There are no user accounts, if that's what you're asking.

  234. Kev


  235. Jehan


  236. stpeter

    I suppose we could create accounts @ xmpp.org for XSF members

  237. Jehan

    Yeah, it would be classy. :-D

  238. Kev

    I don't think there's much value in this.

  239. Kev

    The iteam have enough to do without managing an IM server as well :)

  240. Jehan

    I don't think either indeed, except for the ego.

  241. stpeter

    aw, it's all about Facebook now anyway

  242. stpeter

    IM is so 1990s

  243. Jehan

    I still don't understand what people do on Facebook anyway.

  244. Jehan

    And as you need an account to see, I will probably never understand. That's stupid, they sell a service without showing what we can do with it before getting it!

  245. stpeter

    Jehan: trust me, it will change your life!

  246. Jehan


  247. stpeter

    and the whole world will know exactly how your life has changed, too ;-)

  248. Jehan

    I guess so.

  249. Jehan

    Yeah anyway Facebook already has many informations on me. People showed me photos and even videos of me on Facebook.

  250. stpeter


  251. Jehan

    That's stupid, then there are stuffs about me on Facebook and I cannot even see them!

  252. Jehan

    I cannot even search for me with a search engine.

  253. stpeter

    "it's none of your business what we're saying about you!"

  254. stpeter

    Facebook makes me feel like I'm back in high school, and I don't want to go back :)

  255. stpeter


  256. stpeter

    I need to complete a bunch of actions items from the other meeting I was in

  257. stpeter

    but first, some lunch

  258. Kev

    High school was a lot of music for me, I miss that :)

  259. Jehan


  260. stpeter

    plus my wrists hurt from being in two meetings at once

  261. stpeter


  262. Jehan

    Your meetings are only by chat?

  263. stpeter

    these meetings were

  264. stpeter

    I also have phone meetings sometimes

  265. Tobias

    i wonder how well that scales

  266. stpeter

    not very well if you're really involved in the meetings :)

  267. stpeter

    anyway, bbiab, must eat and I need to cook up lunch in order to have something to eat

  268. Jehan


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  270. Jehan

    For scaling phone meeting, I remember someone telling me about some system (I don't remember if it was only software or also hardware) where people needed to be given speak rights before being able to be heard.

  271. Jehan

    Like they request to be able to speak, then the meeting head would see it (lights or whatever) and would enable the audio for this guy. The person who spoke about it said he had done a lot of audio meeting with really many many people.

  272. Jehan

    Of course, then it is not fully "phone" meeting then I guess, more VOIP (unless it was using hardware linked to phones, I don't remember).

  273. Kev

    This approach works well for non-phone meetings, too.

  274. Jehan

    Yes. But it is still easier to "filter" people's writing on a chat (even though if you have a hundred guys all writing together, I agree it will be hard to follow and annoying meeting).

  275. Jehan

    Unless you mean physical meetings.

  276. Kev

    I meant the other type of meeting, the type where you meet.

  277. Jehan

    uhuh ok.

  278. stpeter

    well yeah, I even have physical meetings sometimes :)

  279. Jehan

    stpeter, the online man.

  280. Jehan

    By the way, my idea of running a donation campaign was so bad that nobody even answered? :-/

  281. stpeter

    I, for one, haven't seen that idea because I'm behind on email

  282. Jehan


  283. Kev

    If it was a long mail, I probably skipped it to save time.

  284. Jehan

    Basically I was thinking that we should not rely only on corporate donation and that we could try and run a donation campaign.

  285. Jehan

    Yeah sorry it was long I think. I am a little bad to make short emails.

  286. Jehan

    I saw that some XSF people assumed that not that many people out there would give. But I think otherwise. And we don't lose anything by trying anyway.

  287. Kev

    Well, apart from some credibility if it looks like we're begging ;)

  288. Kev

    Why do all my smiles turn out as winks?

  289. Kev

    - ;) + :)

  290. Jehan

    Hum.. When Wikipedia makes a donation campaign, nobody says they are begging.

  291. Kev

    Wikipedia is providing a service to the public that is a little different from an SDO.

  292. Kev

    I don't have a strong opinion on this, see what Board think.

  293. Jehan

    And that's also linked not only to money for money but as well to a logic of XSF management. Relying only on Corporate donations is in the end more dangerous. Not only because we might say that the bigger donors might end up gaining too much control; but also because if it works well, it means we would be afraid to lose these donors. A little like for Mozilla who would be annoyed I guess if they lost donations from Google (even though they claim otherwise).

  294. Jehan

    Many non-profit groups (some charity group among other things) even makes a clear rule that they cannot have more corporate donation than private donation to remain fully independant. I don't say we should have such rule, but that we should still try the private donation possibilities as well.

  295. Jehan

    It is not as direct a service to common people as Wikipedia, but it is still some service. And in the end, this is for all users of the Internet.

  296. Jehan

    SDO also need to get money to function. XSF decided to makes life easier for its member, like not making crazy prices for meetings (like IETF), which is very good in my own opinion. But it would still be nice for the XSF to have some money...

  297. Jehan

    For infrastructure, meetings, and so on.

  298. Jehan

    Anyway that's just an idea... Maybe the next board (the next board meeting is with the new board now, isn't it?) will be able to discuss this?

  299. Jehan

    Ok. I am going to bed right now.

  300. Jehan

    Good afternoon (I think) everyone!

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