XSF Discussion - 2010-12-08

Council meeting in 0:30+? Board meeting in 1:30+

Correct for the former, don't know about the latter :)

;-)

running to the corner store - just realized I am without beverage of choice

why am I double posting?

You're not.

psi is showing each twice, mine and yours

I suspect that you've joined the MUC from two resources, and your server is routing the ghost one instead of rejecting it (which it should, but (almost?) no-one does yet, as it's a relatively recent bis-ism)

Prosody rejected it even before the spec was fixed :)

meeting notes and agenda: http://typewith.me/geydlB7gFR

Current working agenda: Agenda: - Roadmap - Summit 10 - Summit 10/FOSDEM - dividing responsibilities - Dinner - Limit to Members / Sponsors? - Location - Interop

meeting to start in 10 minutes, will shoot for 35-40 minute timeframe, 2 rounds of me with claws and knives if we get to 50 minutes

anyone have "eyes" on Jack? can they poke him

poked

oh - hehehe - I do also

he'll start to feel persecuted

or loved if he is into that kind of thing :/

florian was here ...

hi all

hi jack

hi

hi all

coolness - looks like we have 100%

on the dot :)

anyone have any issues with the agenda as suggested by Nÿco

looks good to me

if so, edit the doc please

ok, Item 1 - Roadmap

I've started to edit the wiki page outlining this - not sure exactly (given my n00bness) what this involves

what was done last year?

nothing, which was kind of the point :-)

of doing something this year

ok then :) - i'll draft an email asking for suggestions and also giving some thoughts and report back next meeting - sound ok?

ok

I think we had a good discussion among the members

we just need to capture the conclusions somewhere

yes, thread needs summary

I'd suggest a wordpress page

yea, I was going to sift thru that for the big ideas

rather than wiki

I did post a summary

ah

missed it

can you remind where?

oh coolness, that will make the task much easier

http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/members/2010-October/006040.html

there was some discussion after that

thx

the wiki is for dicussions, wordpress/xmpp.org for announcements - so wordpress page yes

but not much

right, this is a more permanent page

ah yes, I remember now that I've read it

*editor note: can someone update the typewith.me doc*

it might not seem like it, but I'll have more time before long to help out further

you can

bear: will do

i'm hoping to be able to offload some of this from you if you don't mind :)

from or to? :)

:)

on you :-)

any other issues to worry about with the roadmap?

bear: I think not

moving on to item 2 (speak up if not)

bear: the Council discussed this last week and concluded that focusing on MUC and file transfer for this term would be reasonable

bear: I'll find the log for you

k

seems good. i get a lot of questions about file transfer

link in the notes is fine

http://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/members/2010-October/006040.html

ok

Summit?

yep

yes :)

announcements are out to members, will post to other places soon

Will posted a great outline of the summit to the members list and has started a wiki page: http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/FOSDEM_2011

I've prepped a page on xmpp.org

oh cool, in typewithme you can choose your color :)

excellent

http://xmpp.org/participate/the-xmpp-summit/xmpp-summit-10/

I wanted to talk about division of responsibilities

is the FOSDEM booth / room confirmed?

Florian: the room is, not sure about the booth, let's check

ok

I noticed we have already started the annual t-shirt discussion

stands have not yet been announced

but we did put in a request, yes?

bear, Traditions are important.

to me that's always the sign when planning is started for real

http://fosdem.org/2011/ looks bad -- we need to put out a call for talks

we have

ah, so we need to tell them about the link :)

yes

I wanted to start collecting participants on the XMPP.org page

through comments

Florian: good idea

Will: I can let the FOSDEM organizers know

I got someone at Nokia to forward a sponsor request

stpeter: thats why i wanted ot talk about responsibilities....

Ping

:)

pong

Will: you mean we need to get organized?

ok .. iPad works :)

we need to make sure that not everything is your responsibility this year. spread the load a bit

:P

yeah, sure

although others have done a lot in the past, e.g. Alex and Mickaël

what areas of need are there?

so for instance, if we get a booth, 'm happy to be the responsible adult for that :-)

Will: much needed

"adult"?

shut up dwd, you're supposed to working

I guess I'm not allowed to do anything :(

Will, "from home" - doesn't count.

dinner? who's organizing

florian organises our social life

:D

I've been wondering ... Hotel ... Brussels vs. Diegem?

heehee

are there hotels in the boondocks of Diegem?

stpeter, Bound to be some near the airport.

any Brussels Airport Hotel, yes

Remko said the train to Diegem is a 15-minute ride from the center

yeah

and leaves every 30 minutes

Florian, Do they run late?

or something like that

late

?

haha ... normally not

we'll be working late?

are we going for a hotel in brussels and ride out to diegem or the other way around?

they're better than SouthWest Trains

yes

Will: right ...

Brussels at night has pubs

and nice places

hotel in/near the center, train to the meetings

Florian, So's a horse and cart.

better to be near the beer i think

Diegem is quite industrial

right

it's basically Airport land

the only thing there are business parks

and a small town center

yep

Brussels is nicer

agreed

and seeing as we have FOSDEM

trsut cisco to put an office somewhere boring ;-)

you betcha

the thing on our Meetings

they end at a certain tie

but at least we'll have Internet access this time

*time

FOSDEM is more flexible

so I think it's nicer to be in Brussels

yet ... I'll be the person living outside Brussels :p

yes we all agree :)

hotel organiser is ?

so we need to find a hotel that might give us a discount?

I can be

yes ... Discount Hotel

ans Summit room?

what about the one last year?

good or bad?

with hardcore wifi

wifi sucked

Nÿco: I've arranged to use a meeting room at the Cisco office in Diegem, outside Brussels (near the airport)

ok

boring location, but better connectivity

fine

there is also a catering service of some kind, I need to find out more about that for lunch and coffee

:)

so I can handle that stuff via Cisco

sounds like we have hotel/dinner consensus of some kind - who is going to follow up?

ah

Dinner up next?

yes, dinner

so ...

who is point person for hotel?

as posted to board@

- devroom: ?? - hackfest: ??

Florian is hotel point person

bear: I can manage hotel

k, sorry - just saw typewith.me update

Nÿco: right we need to discuss those, too

as Nyco pointed out, still need devroom and hackfest organisers

Devroom is Saturday?

yes

yes

no volunteers?

who is going to be there? stpeter? bear?

I am collecting speaker list but won't be able to coordinate space/location

I can:)

regarding the devroom, we need someone to arrange the schedule of talks etc.

I can handle the talk schedule

Kev?

I'm a student ... so I've got loads of free time :)

haha

bear = devroom

+1

with onsite help via florian ;)

sure :)

I know some of the FOSDEM guys now so I can work with them onsite as needed

ok

great

Sorry, was saying Hi to Cath.

yes, Florian and I can work with the FOSDEM folks onsite

What did you volunteer me for, Dave?

and Ralph, too, slackr that he is :)

Kev, it's ok you escaped

haha

Righty.

kev can do hackfest then

:-)

:)

what's needed for the hackfest?

Righty, am I going to FOSDEM then? )

:)

do we have a room for this?

I'm trying to get some phones from Noknok

come up with interesting topics, herd cats

warm body for room?

I guess start / announce on Friday .. prize on Monday

hackfest = interop or something more?

oh, that hackfest

the code contest?

ohh

/that/ hackfest

Friday @ Cisco?

hackfest = Friday

i can bring more books for prizes

yeah, I need to do that too

I'd say Interop and coding?

last year it was somewhat chaotic, no?

with at the end a lightning round of "progress"?

perhaps our Interop Week folks can help organize some interop stuff on Friday

lightning talks are fun

yeah

that breaks it up a bit, too

I'll be there on Friday this year too :)

me too

I think :)

:)

so yeah, Hackfest ... Interop & Jingle Mingle?

sounds like something for list discussion?

yes

yup

ok

take it to the list!

Anyway, I'm happy to run Friday, assuming I'm going (and I'm assuming I'm going, but haven't discussed with anyone yet).

kev - can you start that list discussion?

Can do. What would we like to do with the day?

that's the question :)

it needs to be engaging, so we may need to find out what the topics of interest are first

but it sounds like summary lightning talks are an "in"

I think I have a smaller room arranged for Friday, let me see how many it seats

:)

I think it's 25

and 40 on Monday

or something like that

(round numbers)

ok...

ok to move on to next item?

+1

usually Friday is smaller

yep

almost up to 30 minutes here

so ... I added Limiting Dinner to Members

heckfest/interop around file transfer also

and Sponsors

and me

dinner: question about limiting to members

the problem:

it's close to impossible to find a restaurant that will seat 50 geeks :)

Nÿco: yes

heh

yeah

in Brussels it's impossible

how aobut we dont tell them we're geeks?

haha :)

I don't see much reason to be seating people with no prior or subsequent interaction with the community.

I raised this with Florian, and I'm fine with non-members turning up, but I'm not so happy that the XSF is subsidizing them.

and there's a point to make ... Why should I be an XSF member?

Kev - money

right

Will: That would be an interaction.

It happened this year that people turned up for FOSDEM, ate the food, and that was about all that I'd seen of them before or since.

so I'd say.. limit it to XSF Member+1 and Sponsors

Will, Oh, for sure - if someone's paying sufficient that the net result is that they're still subsidizing XSF members, great.

members and sponsor reps == great idea IMO

I'm happy for sponsors to have seats, I'm happy for members to have seats.

I don't see why non-community-members should get seats outside those groups, and certainly not why the XSF (through sponsors) should pay for them.

we've already told sponsors they can have seats: http://xmpp.org/sponsor/sponsor-the-xsf/

indeed

Will, Right, that's fine.

I'd say ... Sponsors + Dinner Sponsors

sounds like we are all agreeing vigorously about the same small cluster of ideas - should we stamp it as board approved?

Florian: And members? :)

yup

oh yeah ... those too

:p

bear: yes!

so members can bring a guest, or non-members pay their own way?

Florian, you suggested +1 - I'm not convinced that's needed. Yes, this is a social thing, but still.

hmm

what about "Dinner Sponsors"

like Vodafone for example

they're not a Sponsor

make them sponsors?

but a "Dinner Sponsor"

stpeter: Apart from sponsors, I think non-members should have to at least pay their way, if they're elligible at all.

well ... Dinner sponsors are smaller contributions

like 100€

etc.

ah

right

that sounds like a great way to get a foot in the door to an organization for later larger sponsorship

dwd: some people turn up with partners, excluding them could lead to problems

I'm fine with anyone showing up if they're paying (at least) their way.

right

so ... to sum up ...

Members +1 for the price of the dinner (50€) Sponsors: As per Sponsor chart Dinner Sponsors

those can get access...

i.e. Nokia ... it's easier for them to sponsor a single dinner, than getting them to become an XSF sponsor

don't ask me why ... it just is :)

yep

so I want to keep the "dinner sponsor" thing going

as we had loads of people just pitching in 100@

one is easier to hide in the accounting books :)

€

and the 100€ resulted each year in free food :)

sounds like we have consensus then on the dinner agenda item - true?

From the balcony, yes.

now the challenge is to find a pace to eat :)

ah right

+l

Will will need to pay :D

Florian, Ha!

I guess that means Isode "Will" need to sponsor :D

haha

k, next up - Interop

I guess it's progressing ...

I'd like to see this become an ongoing effort

I am liking the idea of doing this on a very regular basis

i.e. keep the test servers up for longer

because we spent a lot of time just setting them up, getting certs etc.

how "very"?

quarterly? monthly?

well, maybe not up all the time, but if we can get the configs documented ...

very regular could mean once every 10 years, hope you mean frequent

Florian: right, it would be good to build on all that work

I don't think it's a good idea to have the servers stay up.

every 2 months?

biologically regular, not astronically regular ;)

for a week?

wow - what word was that I just typed

I do think it's good to keep the configs (especially the CA) around.

Kev: yes

Kev, Running up a CA, even, is pretty easy.

I think every 3 months with CA and DNS always up

One week every 2 months is 13% of the participants time, if it takes them most of their time to do it.

bear: +1

quarterly

it doesn't have to be full time for someone all week

that way, there's also progress in between

bear: I've spent quite a lot of this week on it.

its better to aim low and over-perform than the other way around.

yea, but that's upfront setup - will that be required in 3 months?

I don't see why it wouldn't.

I have to say we're looking at one now, some interop activity at the summits - that's a lot of time on this.

ok, then let's use that as the baseline

Another 6 months before another one would be good, I think.

Ok...

6 months sounds ok to me

WFM

6 yes

especially since I have no dog in this hunt

I'm fine with aiming for 6 months for the next online one. If we find a need to do one sooner, then that's also okay.

Right.

Doing them too often just devalues them.

Ok... I mean we have the summits too

If they become a burden for participants, there won't be any, and that's bad.

With interop action

agreed

doing server interop at the summit at oscon was *very* time consuming - especially for a one day event

so I could see summit interop being limited to clients and/or libs

Hmm... Ok

bear: If the summit has sensible 'net access, it's not impossible to re-use the infrastructure.

kev - true, that was what we spent a lot of time on - the net access was not sensible :(

That's why I want to keep it up

ok - we are at 45 minutes

Kev, But we can also spin up a new CA for that easily. Same with DNS, it's not hard. Just that *any* interop setup like this takes time.

let's continue the interop discussion after this week finishes

and see how people feel then

Right

+1 to tabling to after meeting and to the lists

ok, any other agenda items to consider?

then we'll have a better idea of costs and benefits

Not from my end

none here

bear: I still owe you that old sponsor list, will do before Christmas

the next board meeting would be the 22nd of December - is that going to be too close to the holidays for anyone?

stpeter: thanks

Nope

22nd is fine with me

i'm ok for 22nd

should be alright here

Nÿco?

ok, 22nd it is

thanks one and all for another great meeting

bye all

thanks, everyone

thx

I guess that's a maybe...

Fucking freezing my hands off here on this iCrap

stpeter - use the non-ietf muc link this time ;)

haha

hadn't noticed that

Bye guys

calendar updated in git, let's see if Tobias's auto-updating works :)

minutes emailed

thanks, bear

hmm, where do I edit this page: http://xmpp.org/xsf/board/

http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/xsf/the-xsf-board-of-directors/ is the new link

we need to set up a whole bunch of redirects

I got to that page from the main page

so we need to fix some hrefs, too :)

hehehe

I need to spend some quality time with the website

the wiki main page I meant - sorry

i can fix that tho...

ah

ok

k, back to my regularly scheduled day off...

heh

thanks, bear

I appreciate it

thanks to you also :)

:)

oh hey - been meaning to ask, sorry for the ambush: did GSoC funds arrive or is there anything we need to follow up with them?

I haven't seen the funds yet, but I'm not on the discussion list -- shall I ping LH?

I don't think it's been talked about at all - I can ping her with my "Admin" hat on

ok

I was just reminded because I got my tshirt in the mail

I don't remember the chronology of payment from years past

I can use "this being my first time, so forgive me my n00bness" wording then

:)

thanks