XSF Discussion - 2011-01-19

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13:34:20 Nÿco Board meeting in 3:30: http://typewith.me/iwX1hcKPyk
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16:55:18 bear board meeting in 10?
16:55:23 bear (minutes)
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16:58:23 stpeter bear: yes
16:58:30 Florian well ... 5 mins now :)
16:58:35 bear are you doing the twitter thang?
16:58:37 stpeter yeah
16:58:43 stpeter I can
16:59:03 bear I have one lined up - after my 4 post FAIL session last time I figured I would ask
16:59:05 bear :)
17:03:58 Will has joined
17:03:59 bear waiting on Will and for Nÿco (tho I see he was active 3,5 hrs ago
17:04:08 Will hi
17:04:08 stpeter ok
17:04:16 Will phone call, sorry
17:04:17 bear just as I pressed enter - figures
17:04:19 Will but here now
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17:04:59 Sylvain Hellegouarch has joined
17:05:28 stpeter I'll be in another chat meeting here soon, but I can do more than one chat at the same time :)
17:05:35 bear while the agenda seems short, we will probably consume the whole meeting talking FOSDEM
17:05:41 Will yup
17:05:45 Florian prolly :)
17:05:48 bear then let's start - Nÿco can read scrollback
17:05:54 stpeter yep
17:06:02 bear bangs the gavel to start the meeting
17:06:07 bear any agenda bashing?
17:06:17 stpeter where did you post the agenda? :)
17:06:27 Will http://typewith.me/iwX1hcKPyk
17:06:32 stpeter ah, naturally
17:06:55 bear I so want to change that behaviour and post to the wiki the day *before* the meeting
17:06:56 Nÿco hi
17:07:04 Nÿco sorry, was on the phone
17:07:06 stpeter hi Nÿco
17:07:46 bear ok, first item - FOSDEM
17:07:52 bear florian - you here?
17:07:55 Florian I am :)
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17:08:03 Florian so ... FOSDEM ...
17:08:07 bear can you give a quick update
17:08:23 Florian the summit's dev challenge: We have an N8 confirmed as prize
17:08:26 Florian from Nokia
17:08:36 Nÿco how many? ;-)
17:08:41 Florian just one prize
17:08:51 Nÿco btw, has it got an XMPP client by default?
17:08:55 Florian and demo devices are being gathered .. which seems harder this year
17:09:03 Florian the N8 doesn't afaik
17:09:07 Florian maybe the Ovi Chat one
17:09:09 Florian not sure
17:09:12 Nÿco ok
17:09:14 stpeter shall we hold an in-person board meeting in Brussels? :)
17:09:29 Florian +1
17:09:29 Nÿco ah good idea
17:09:37 Florian maybe on Friday?
17:09:37 bear just let me know what time zone so I can skype/muc in
17:09:38 Will +1
17:09:49 Florian if everyone is around?
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17:10:01 bear I think i'm the only one not going
17:10:06 jack i'm here
17:10:09 jack but i'm not going :(
17:10:13 Will I'll be there afternoon on Fiday. suggest we hold board meeting in the bar ;-)
17:10:14 jack had to cancel those plans
17:10:21 Will oh dear
17:10:22 Nÿco btw, I am now sure I can't be there on Friday (customer meeting all day)
17:10:44 stpeter Nÿco: customer meetings are no fun, but customers are good :)
17:10:50 Florian :)
17:11:14 bear coughs and points politely to FOSDEM update agenda item
17:11:21 Florian right ...
17:11:25 Florian so .. Dev Challenge ...
17:11:27 Nÿco jack: what do you mean "not going"?
17:11:51 Florian I asked Nokia about the rules for the entries
17:12:06 jack I will be in the US during all the FOSDEM nad XMPP Summit days.
17:12:19 Florian nothing confirmed yet, but I was told that they'd like to see Qt apps (Nokia's SDK)
17:12:43 bear ouch - Qt can be hard to setup a dev env for if your not used to it
17:12:56 Florian well, it seems their SDK is quite nice by now
17:12:59 Nÿco can we push the use of reusable libraries?
17:13:03 Nÿco I mean XMPP libs
17:13:13 Kev bear: It's pretty easy these days, Creator is nice enough (I don't use it, but anyway...)
17:13:27 bear mutters: on linux maybe ... ;)
17:13:31 stpeter when does the dev challenge begin?
17:13:31 Nÿco thus one could write an app with a Qt frontend, and port it
17:13:32 Florian OSX now :)
17:13:52 stpeter e.g., can developers start working now?
17:13:56 bear k, it sounds like we need to announce this as soon as possible then
17:14:00 Florian yes
17:14:05 Florian that's the question
17:14:10 Nÿco we need to set the rules first, no?
17:14:12 Florian last year we kicked off the challenge on Friday
17:14:26 Florian yeah, rules are good :)
17:14:39 Florian but I was wondering, should we allow pre-FOSDEM work?
17:14:41 Nÿco the kickoff date can happen one week before FOSDEM
17:14:55 Nÿco do we announce the dev challenge on our blog?
17:14:55 Florian right
17:15:01 Florian we should
17:15:07 stpeter Nÿco: yes, one week before is good
17:15:12 Nÿco +1 for pre-FOSDEM work
17:15:17 Florian +1
17:15:20 bear I think we should allow for pre-fosdem work and progress must be in a public repo
17:15:20 stpeter of course, people reading this chatroom could start today
17:15:23 Will +1
17:15:57 bear +1
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17:16:04 jack +1 from me
17:16:09 Florian ok ... so I'll get Nokia to agree to some terms
17:16:10 jack more sophisticated apps are always better
17:16:14 Florian and then we can prepare the rules
17:16:18 bear Florian - can you work up some rules text with nokia and email list?
17:16:29 Florian bear: yup, will do.
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17:16:42 bear k, then we can post to summit and jdev list whent hat is ready
17:16:45 Nÿco so what should we target? Jingle stuff? PubSub plumber?
17:17:02 Florian I'd say anything XMPP
17:17:06 Florian on mobile
17:17:12 Nÿco so mobile
17:17:23 Nÿco restrict to it?
17:17:39 Florian I think that will be a requirement by Nokia, but I can try to negotiate that
17:17:48 Florian but it was a requirement last year
17:17:50 bear I'm not seeing a reason not to
17:18:00 bear easer to do with Qt I would suspect
17:18:05 Nÿco for me it's ok, from restrictions come great inventions ;-)
17:18:10 stpeter :)
17:18:15 Florian I think Mobile is cool
17:18:19 Nÿco ok
17:18:21 Florian and we'll have some devices
17:18:27 Florian and an N8 to give away
17:18:34 Kev To clarify - you mean it must be for mobile -not it must *only* be for mobile, right?
17:18:36 Florian and tbh... we ran Tigase on a mobile :p
17:18:40 stpeter so we will post a blog entry about this on January 28?
17:18:44 Sylvain Hellegouarch has left
17:18:57 bear +1 to Jan28 post
17:19:00 Florian +1
17:19:03 stpeter ok
17:19:04 bear marks calendar
17:19:18 stpeter so let's get this straightened out and work on the post next week
17:19:26 Florian sounds good.
17:19:38 Florian I'll get Nokia to agree to some terms then.
17:19:46 Florian and write up rules
17:19:50 Florian what about remote submissions?
17:19:53 Florian same as last year?
17:20:03 Florian presentation needs to be done locally
17:20:06 stpeter right
17:20:15 stpeter so if you can find someone to present it, start coding
17:20:18 Florian right
17:20:22 Florian sounds good.
17:20:23 stpeter shouldn't be too hard to find someone who can present it
17:20:28 bear yea, they need to negotiate a proxy and figure out themselves how to share an N8 ;)
17:20:31 stpeter just split the N8 in half as the prize ;-)
17:20:36 Florian :D
17:20:43 Kev I'd suggest the requirement is immediate production of source under a sensible license.
17:20:54 Florian Kev: eh?
17:21:02 Kev Last year I wasn't entirely sure that the source for all entries ever got released.
17:21:17 stpeter nods
17:21:20 Florian right
17:21:28 Florian I think a public repo for that matter might be cool
17:21:29 bear I was suggesting that it be done in a public repo
17:21:42 Kev bear: Yes, I'm agreeing with your suggestion.
17:21:53 stpeter does it need to be licensed under open-source terms?
17:21:53 bear stops multitasking
17:21:59 Florian actually ...
17:22:01 Florian maybe not
17:22:07 Kev stpeter: We required that last year. I think it's sensible to do so again.
17:22:10 Florian but we can require that it's released on the Ovi Store at some point
17:22:27 bear +1 to open-source compatible license
17:22:45 Florian -1
17:22:46 stpeter updates http://typewith.me/iwX1hcKPyk
17:23:41 Nÿco as a standards org, we can authorize people to code proprietary (even if ithurts me to say so)
17:23:55 Florian right
17:23:57 Nÿco I would prefer opensource
17:24:03 Florian I think OS is preferred
17:24:06 Florian but not required
17:24:09 Nÿco right
17:24:16 Florian the thing is ... if people want to build a cool shareware app...
17:24:17 Kev Nÿco: Yes, I'm not at all opposed to non-OSS code for XMPP. For the XSF competition, however, I don't see any sensible way of it not being OSS and still being reasonable.
17:24:18 Florian good for them
17:24:24 jack i think ti's fine to have OS be preferred not required, as long as source available is required
17:24:49 jack you can ask nokiaif they have a preference for requiring submission be OS
17:24:56 bear concedes his aggressively open source stance
17:25:04 stpeter I
17:25:09 jack certainly at FOSDEM it is going to be a little awkward for people working on proprietary things :)
17:25:15 Florian jack: last year, their stance was ... we don't care... we just want something that can show up on our devices at some point
17:25:17 Nÿco Kev: we can require "open" code? means, code is readable, but authors grant only some rights to others
17:25:19 Florian preferably through the Ovi Store
17:25:24 stpeter I'd prefer open source, but I gave up that religion some time ago
17:25:49 stpeter licensing is a bit of a rat hole
17:25:49 Kev Nÿco: I guess I'm ok with requiring a source license to the XSF, at a pinch, just for logistic's sake.
17:26:12 stpeter is commercial use OK and so on (MySQL-style licenses)
17:26:24 Florian I think so, yes
17:26:26 stpeter I'd prefer to avoid that whole debate if we can :)
17:26:37 Florian not mention licence at all?
17:26:39 Nÿco ok, it's getting too hard to sort that out, maybe we need after all OSI licenses
17:27:22 bear sounds like we don't mention it at all but only require public repo and ovi store push
17:27:23 Nÿco OSI approved licenses
17:27:35 Florian bear: sounds good.
17:28:00 Nÿco what if I do a non-Nokia/Qt (Meego/Symbian), but mobile app? (no Ovi Store)
17:28:16 Florian I'll need to check with them
17:28:22 Nÿco ok...
17:28:35 Nÿco but this is our dev chanllenge, not Nokia's
17:28:35 bear any other concerns about dev challenge before we move on to SWAG
17:28:42 Kev Nÿco: That was outside the scope of the comp. last year - it had to run on a Nokia device. It doesn't seem an unreasonable requirement, given the sponsor.
17:28:43 Nÿco we set the rules, they approve or not
17:29:00 Nÿco ok Kev
17:29:25 Florian Nÿco: if you know anyone at Apple or Blackberry to give us some prizes ... :D
17:29:40 Kev I don't see a reason not to allow other mobile apps - if Nokia don't mind, but I don't see a reason to push them on it.
17:29:41 Florian but yeah, I guess they won't move away from Nokia apps
17:29:42 Nÿco Florian: nothing to answer... ;-)
17:29:55 Nÿco ok then, resolved?
17:29:59 Florian yup
17:30:00 Florian SWAG :D
17:30:15 Nÿco public repo + Ovi Store, but no specific licenses needed?
17:30:34 Florian Nÿco: for now.
17:30:44 Florian I'll pitch them that
17:30:46 Nÿco ok
17:31:34 Will swag then
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17:31:54 Will do we do t-shirts this year given we've no stand to sell them from?
17:32:09 stpeter seems problematic
17:32:10 Florian I'd say yes, but just a few
17:32:17 Florian for Summit participants
17:32:18 stpeter unless we sell them from another booth
17:32:28 Will the problem with a few is you have very small quantities of different sizes
17:32:31 stpeter e.g., the SIP Communicator guys might let us sell some
17:32:41 Will and i dont think selling from another booth is realistic,
17:32:48 Florian Will: agree
17:33:12 stpeter we could try to sell more of last year's design :P
17:33:14 Will we could do some stickers and stuff to hand out to talk attendees
17:33:26 Florian stpeter: we can do that :)
17:33:37 Florian so maybe keep last years shirts
17:34:12 Florian and just get stickers
17:34:25 Will i'll look into stickers and other stuff (it's very cheap)
17:34:33 Florian :)
17:34:45 Florian I need a new laptop ... running out of sticker space :)
17:35:13 Will also, are we recording the talks?
17:35:20 Will video?
17:35:28 Florian if someone has a camera, we can
17:35:43 Florian hmm ... maybe the Nokia guys can bring an extra N8 :)
17:35:45 Nÿco still the same issue with editing
17:35:47 Will was looking at hiring camera plus radio mic for the weekend, not expensive
17:36:02 Florian I think it's worth recording them
17:36:10 Florian we can later always decide to just use the audio
17:36:14 Will ok
17:36:16 bear recording +1
17:36:22 Florian but let's get a video camera anyway
17:36:28 Will +1, i'll report back on costs
17:36:31 Will to the list
17:36:34 Florian great
17:36:51 stpeter thanks, Will
17:37:35 bear hotel package - is that done and advertised?
17:37:39 Florian yup
17:37:44 bear cool
17:37:44 Florian 4 rooms left
17:38:15 bear and dinner plans?
17:38:19 stpeter I got booked into another hotel
17:38:25 stpeter before we decided on one
17:38:33 stpeter so I guess it would be the Best Western :)
17:38:37 stpeter guessed
17:38:41 stpeter FWIW :)
17:38:45 Florian :)
17:38:55 Florian dinner: sorted
17:39:03 bear k
17:39:07 Florian we just need to sort the transport
17:39:21 stpeter ah
17:39:22 stpeter yeah
17:39:27 stpeter I need to call the transport company
17:39:35 stpeter will do that first thing tomorrow morning
17:39:46 stpeter Florian: do you know if I can just fax them the info?
17:39:47 Florian cool
17:39:50 Will got a phone call in 5 mins, might have to leave soon
17:39:53 Will fyi
17:39:54 Florian stpeter: not sure
17:40:08 stpeter Florian: could you please check?
17:40:11 Florian will do
17:40:15 stpeter thanks
17:40:16 bear unless someone wants to bike shed more - I think we are done after this item
17:40:26 stpeter probably
17:40:33 Florian nothing more on my end
17:40:35 stpeter as you saw, I got a room for 50 people
17:40:39 stpeter for Fri and Mon
17:40:44 Florian Monday is full
17:40:49 stpeter yep
17:40:53 Florian a few places left on Friday
17:40:57 Florian and some at the dinner
17:40:58 stpeter I hope we can squeeze a few more people in if needed
17:41:11 Florian yeah
17:41:22 bear florian - can you email me those stats - I want to work up a summit status blog post
17:41:31 Florian all on the summit page :)
17:41:31 stpeter bear: they are on the page
17:41:37 bear I think the fact that we are full capacity so soon is news worthy
17:41:47 Florian :)
17:41:48 bear oh right!
17:41:48 stpeter http://xmpp.org/participate/the-xmpp-summit/xmpp-summit-10/
17:42:24 bear ok, we are 2 minutes away from when my "meetings suck, rant rant rant" persona starts to appear
17:42:29 bear anything else to discuss?
17:42:31 stpeter I think we're done
17:42:37 Florian yup
17:42:42 bear +1 to close
17:42:45 stpeter I might have some finance updates before long
17:42:49 Florian ah
17:42:53 Florian one quick thing
17:42:57 Florian invoices for sponsors
17:43:03 Florian dinner sponsors ...
17:43:05 stpeter we've got more money coming in with Voxeo, GSOC funds, etc.
17:43:07 stpeter ah yes
17:43:15 stpeter I sent invoices to Collabora but not the others
17:43:22 bear drat - I need to send you a check
17:43:22 Florian right ... Isode would need one
17:43:23 stpeter puts it on his calendar for tomorrow
17:43:33 Florian great :)
17:43:36 Florian then that's it
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17:43:47 bear who is the person with the xmpp sponsor - the new one?
17:43:48 pkempgen has left
17:44:05 stpeter ?
17:44:15 bear bangs the gavel to close the meeting
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17:44:25 bear this is not a meeting item - just a question
17:44:34 stpeter I didn't parse the question
17:44:35 bear Voxeo or something - didn't we get them as a new sponsor
17:44:39 stpeter yes
17:44:44 stpeter we need to create a page about them
17:44:50 Florian yup
17:44:53 bear so wondering who has contact info to reach out for their blurb page
17:44:54 stpeter and, I think, we need to remove out of date sponsors from the website
17:45:03 Florian I can chase them for some text
17:45:05 stpeter but we can discuss that on the list
17:45:09 bear yea, I sent email earlier but got crickets back
17:45:25 bear ok, thanks all for attending
17:45:47 Nÿco thx all
17:45:49 Will bye
17:45:57 Florian bye
17:46:30 Will has left
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17:47:07 stpeter sends an email to the board list about sponsors
17:47:42 bear prepares minutes for email
17:48:07 stpeter thanks, bear!
17:48:15 Nÿco Next meeting: 2010-02-02, same place, same time
17:48:35 Nÿco with TypeWithMe in the background ;-)
17:48:38 stpeter :)
17:48:55 stpeter moves focus to his other chat but shall return
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