XSF Discussion - 2011-04-13

  1. Tobias has joined

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  10. bear

    FYI board meeting in 1 hour (if my calendar is accurate)

  11. Kev


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  14. stpeter has joined

  15. bear

    board meeting in 15 minutes

  16. bear

    meeting notes are here: http://typewith.me/mLIIGK2glS

  17. bear

    are you doing the twitter'ing stpeter?

  18. stpeter


  19. stpeter

    I can, yes

  20. bear


  21. stpeter

    I was busy writing an email message to the Board about possible discussion topics

  22. bear is trying this new thing called "prepared"

  23. stpeter


  24. stpeter

    so I mentioned several possible topics: 1. GScC update 2. Summit #11 3. Removing "proposed" state from XEP-0001 4. Voxeo page for website 5. Public services list 6. Microblogging / blogging 7. Trademark sublicensing applications

  25. stpeter

    noodle on those, I'll be right back

  26. bear


  27. Florian has joined

  28. Florian

    evening all

  29. stpeter

    hi Florian!

  30. bear


  31. stpeter

    Mr. Sheward and I can also give a report on the website -- I think we're finished with http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/XSF_website_gap_analysis_notes and can think about what new pages to add, if desired

  32. bear adds that to the top

  33. will.sheward has joined

  34. will.sheward


  35. stpeter

    any sign of Jack or NĂ¿co?

  36. Florian

    evening Will :)

  37. bear

    just poked jack

  38. stpeter


  39. stpeter

    yes, he's online

  40. bear

    don't see nyco online

  41. will.sheward

    Anyone know what's happened to collecta?

  42. Florian

    me n'either

  43. stpeter

    at least at his current address -- Jack seems to move around a lot :)

  44. stpeter

    will.sheward: presumably Jack can tell us

  45. stpeter

    I don't know the story

  46. bear

    jack is in SF all week doing contract work for Yammer

  47. bear

    so he will be missing this one

  48. stpeter


  49. Florian

    let's go?

  50. will.sheward

    May need to remove the collect widget from the home page

  51. bear

    time to start then

  52. stpeter

    some of my items will really be for discussion in 2 weeks, they are organizational right now

  53. stpeter


  54. bear

    meeting notes are here: http://typewith.me/mLIIGK2glS

  55. Florob has joined

  56. stpeter

    here is what I posted earlier: 0. Website update 1. GScC update 2. Summit #11 3. Removing "proposed" state from XEP-0001 4. Voxeo page for website 5. Public services list 6. Microblogging / blogging 7. Trademark sublicensing applications

  57. stpeter

    typewith.me is nice

  58. stpeter


  59. Florian

    looks good

  60. will.sheward

    We can combine 0 and 4 I think

  61. stpeter


  62. stpeter

    so GSoC first?

  63. Florian


  64. stpeter defers to bear

  65. bear

    we received the 7 slots we asked for

  66. Florian


  67. bear

    working with the python gsoc group to fit in some of their xmpp related projects

  68. bear

    we have 4 really solid students so far

  69. bear

    and kev is whipping into shape some of the others to see if they will make it in

  70. stpeter


  71. will.sheward

    Do we not have enough of our own?

  72. bear

    my hunch is that we will have 5 or 6 solids

  73. stpeter

    do we need to use all 7 slots?

  74. stpeter

    I'd prefer to have fewer solid students

  75. bear

    we have a lot of really iffy applications

  76. stpeter

    if needed

  77. Kev

    We asked for 7 because that's the number that the mentors asked for.

  78. stpeter nods

  79. stpeter

    last year we had 3

  80. bear defers to kev to fill in the details

  81. stpeter


  82. will.sheward

    Iffy I'm what way?

  83. Kev

    4 the mentors said were outstanding, 3 more the mentors said were good and they wanted.

  84. will.sheward


  85. Kev

    will.sheward: Nothing more than usual. Not all applications are good.

  86. stpeter

    will.sheward: yes you are iffy

  87. Kev

    stpeter: 3, we asked for another and got it.

  88. bear

    most were just from students who gave little to no thought on their app and then were not heard from again

  89. stpeter

    will.sheward: the scent of money attracts some flaky students

  90. stpeter

    hell, I was a flaky student myself once :)

  91. Florian


  92. will.sheward


  93. Kev

    This year the scheme was changed to ask for the number of outstanding (4) students and the number you'd like (7) in an ideal world.

  94. Kev

    We got all 7.

  95. stpeter

    so typically we need to weed out a lot of chaff

  96. Kev

    If a mentor changes their mind about wanting their student, we give the slot back and Carol hands it out to another org.

  97. stpeter


  98. stpeter

    that works fine

  99. Emil Ivov has joined

  100. stpeter

    hi Emil

  101. stpeter

    anything else related to gsoc?

  102. Kev

    We can't discuss what the applications were here, but Board are welcome to sign up to Melange and look at them there.

  103. Kev


  104. Kev

    We need to devote significantly more effort to it next year.

  105. stpeter


  106. stpeter

    it's always a lot of work

  107. Kev

    Trust me, I know.

  108. stpeter

    is it becoming even more work? :)

  109. Kev

    Well, if we want to get more high quality students, we need to attract them somehow.

  110. stpeter thinks about costs and benefits

  111. bear

    the mentor side is more work this year

  112. Kev

    bear: Based on what?

  113. bear

    the org admin side is minimal

  114. Kev


  115. stpeter


  116. will.sheward


  117. bear

    just seeing how busy you are chasing students and mentors

  118. Kev

    Yes, that's org admin work :)

  119. bear hides

  120. Florian


  121. Emil Ivov

    hey Peter :)

  122. Kev

    Between mentor and org admin, my effort's been measured in hours/day for the last few weeks.

  123. Kev

    But anyway.

  124. Kev

    The reward of getting new contributors to the projects is, I think, significant and worthwhile.

  125. stpeter

    Kev: every year we say we need to plan more fully, and either we don't do the planning or we neglect to capture lessons learned from the previous year...

  126. Kev

    So we can not do any more recruiting than we normally do, and that's fine.

  127. stpeter

    so we need to get better at that

  128. Kev

    stpeter: Well, myself and people from KDE/Gentoo/X.org have been writing a series of lessons on the Google Open Source blog for that.

  129. stpeter

    and I'm part of the problem, so I'm volunteering to help

  130. stpeter

    Kev: excellent

  131. Kev

    http://google-opensource.blogspot.com/2011/04/dos-and-donts-of-google-summer-of-code.html for exampel.

  132. bear

    i'm also part of the problem to be blunt - I have been giving minimal support and will fix that

  133. Kev

    Anyway. We've had an apathy from projects this year. Swift, Buddycloud and PySoy have each put in considerable work and have as a consequence got great proposals.

  134. stpeter


  135. stpeter

    you get out what you put in

  136. Kev

    Others less so, and I'd really like us to have more active projects.

  137. stpeter


  138. Florian


  139. stpeter

    but that's a bigger problem

  140. Kev

    And the OneSocialWeb incident was *not* good.

  141. bear

    I think we need to put into the calendar a couple months *before* the signup to start banging the drum about the next one

  142. Kev

    bear: Yes, that was what I was going to suggest.

  143. bear

    stpeter - can you add a "tickler" event to the calendar for next year?

  144. stpeter

    I was thinking just an hour ago or so that we don't have a lot of active projects, and that's a problem, but it's a bigger problem than GSoC

  145. stpeter

    bear: yes

  146. Florian

    stpeter: indeed ...

  147. Kev

    stpeter: True, although GSoC is a great opportunity for projects to become active.

  148. bear

    maybe we can use the gsoc project list as a bit of guilt for the others - start really talking them up

  149. Florian

    hey ... this might be something ...

  150. Florian

    why not let us organize something post GSoC?

  151. Florian

    i.e. the XMPP Winter of Code :p

  152. Kev

    When fringe groups (And I'm not using the term derogitavely) like BC and PySoy are getting better applications for XMPP than anyone other than Swift, it's a sad sad sign.

  153. Kev

    better is the wrong description.

  154. Kev

    More XSF-relevant.

  155. bear

    can we move this discussion to the list for followup

  156. Florian


  157. Kev

    Sure, I don't have much more :)

  158. bear


  159. will.sheward

    Then we need to define what is relevant well before the event

  160. stpeter

    Kev: thanks for sharing :)

  161. stpeter

    bear: I put it on my calendar for October 10 so that we can raise this topic with the incoming Board at that time

  162. bear

    stpeter - can you add will's comment to the tickler

  163. Kev

    will.sheward: We do. We should generaly be more engaged further in advance.

  164. stpeter


  165. bear

    ok, next - website update?

  166. stpeter


  167. Florian


  168. stpeter

    so Will and I finished http://wiki.xmpp.org/web/XSF_website_gap_analysis_notes

  169. stpeter

    that took longer than expected, but most things do :)

  170. will.sheward

    Well, you mostly

  171. stpeter

    the last pages to be fixed were related to the public services

  172. stpeter

    now at http://xmpp.org/resources/public-services/

  173. stpeter

    we've had discussion on the operators@ list about that

  174. stpeter

    and some volunteers

  175. stpeter

    open question how to manage that going forward

  176. stpeter

    and whether we need more features

  177. will.sheward


  178. stpeter

    but I think we at least have a path to updating it more often

  179. stpeter

    not sure how to sync the WP page with the .xml file that clients use

  180. Ludovic has joined

  181. will.sheward

    We/I still need to sort out the sponsor stuff..was planning to delete non sponsors tomorrow

  182. stpeter

    but we can work that out

  183. stpeter

    will.sheward: ok good

  184. ben has joined

  185. stpeter

    will.sheward: and we need a page for Voxeo

  186. will.sheward

    As the CEO is on holiday :-)

  187. Ludovic has left

  188. stpeter


  189. will.sheward

    Voxeo, check

  190. stpeter

    will.sheward: by "check" do you mean you'll come up with content?

  191. stpeter

    will.sheward: the sponsor pages are typically brief

  192. will.sheward


  193. stpeter


  194. stpeter

    thank you

  195. Florian


  196. will.sheward

    Then I'll check with the sponsor for changes

  197. stpeter


  198. stpeter

    anything else on the website?

  199. stpeter

    we talked about recruiting maintainers for various sections

  200. will.sheward

    Tunnels coming up, may lose you for a few minutes

  201. stpeter

    I updated the history page recently http://xmpp.org/about-xmpp/history/

  202. stpeter


  203. stpeter

    moving on to the Summit, then

  204. Florian


  205. stpeter

    OSCON is directly opposite the IETF meeting in Quebec City

  206. stpeter

    I am wondering about holding the Summit in QC

  207. stpeter

    e.g., Saturday and Sunday before IETF meeting

  208. Florian


  209. stpeter

    QC is nice

  210. Florian

    would we get the audience we'd want for the Summit?

  211. stpeter

    and I could work with IETF to get the XMPP meeting on Monday

  212. bear

    that will be sad for those of us who normally go to oscon :(

  213. stpeter


  214. stpeter

    not sure what to do

  215. stpeter

    or y'all can meet in Portland, but I can't join

  216. stpeter

    (nor can some others, I'd think, who are involved in IETF stuff -- Joe Hildebrand etc.)

  217. bear

    most of the core summit folk will be missing - it would be a "hey, this is xmpp" type event

  218. stpeter

    not that you need me to be there necessarily

  219. stpeter

    maybe a hackathon would be more productive in some ways anyway

  220. stpeter

    I'm still interested in that XMPP validator :)

  221. Florian


  222. Florian

    well ... if we do it before OSCON

  223. stpeter

    I think I can also raise money for the validator

  224. Florian

    Sat / Sun ... would people be willing to come to the Summit?

  225. bear

    I had wanted to continue the work we started last time, but the core folks will be missing

  226. Florian

    in QC

  227. bear

    we should mail the members and find out

  228. stpeter

    QC is a bit hard to get to, but easier for folks in Europe perhaps

  229. will.sheward

    Let's mail and see if anyone has strong views

  230. stpeter

    Florian: we could potentially do Friday and Saturday in QC

  231. stpeter


  232. stpeter

    next item, "Removing "proposed" state from XEP-0001" -- I think we can discuss that next time

  233. stpeter

    we had discussion on the members@ list

  234. stpeter

    I'd like to poll the Council about that at its next meeting

  235. stpeter

    then ask the Board to perhaps take action

  236. stpeter considers Kev's 30-minute meeting rule :)

  237. Florian

    sounds good.

  238. bear


  239. stpeter

    "Public services list" we already discussed

  240. stpeter

    briefly about "Trademark sublicensing applications" -- I will put three applications in the tracker at http://tracker.xmpp.org/browse/TRADEMARKS?report=com.atlassian.jira.plugin.system.project%3Aopenissues-panel for discussion by the Board at its next meeting

  241. Florian


  242. Florian

    can someone give me an account on there?

  243. stpeter

    I have reached out to all the projects listed on our website that have "JABBER" in the name

  244. will.sheward


  245. stpeter

    Florian: yes, will do in a minute

  246. Florian

    great, thanks

  247. stpeter

    Florian: in fact you have an account

  248. stpeter

    it's tied to your florianjensen.com address

  249. Florian

    ah, ok

  250. stpeter

    username florian

  251. Florian

    strange ... but will check :)

  252. Florian


  253. stpeter

    you can ask for a password reset

  254. bear


  255. stpeter is slowly catching on myriad topics after RFC publication

  256. stpeter

    bear: in Brussels, Johann Prieur volunteered to post to the identi.ca / Twitter account

  257. bear

    will he be working from a set list of topics or doing it adhoc?

  258. stpeter

    do we want to just hand out credentials to those accounts, or set up a bot that people can post to?

  259. stpeter

    adhoc, I think

  260. stpeter

    so we need to think about how we want to do that

  261. bear

    a bot would allow for single source for credentials and be able to add/remove cleanly IMO

  262. stpeter

    e.g., do we want to have something of a communications plan / program for microblogging and blogging?

  263. will.sheward

    Adhoc +1

  264. stpeter

    bear: agreed

  265. Florian

    AdHoc +1

  266. stpeter

    I mean, we can always coach people on topics

  267. bear

    I would love to have items go to the list for possible preparation but adhoc for sure

  268. will.sheward

    Well never get a coms plan off the ground

  269. bear

    and the bot could also post to the list

  270. Reid Ellis has joined

  271. Kev

    We've got a whole comm *team*

  272. Kev

    And very active it is too.

  273. stpeter

    it's hard to plan for microblogging -- it's supposed to be a spontaneous kind of activity :)

  274. Kev

    I'd suggest not adding too many barriers to entry in light of this!

  275. stpeter

    Kev: indeed

  276. bear

    i'm more worried about having it seem like spam if 5 people all post in a day on the same topic

  277. will.sheward

    Trust the team to plan itself I think

  278. bear

    +1 for comm team assignment

  279. Florian


  280. bear

    let them tell us what they need

  281. stpeter


  282. stpeter

    but the bot would help -- let's poke that iteam

  283. bear


  284. stpeter

    I think we had a similar bot at one point, didn't we?

  285. stpeter

    I'll poke Matthew Wild about that

  286. stpeter

    I think he had a similar bot

  287. stpeter


  288. stpeter

    so that's it from me

  289. will.sheward

    +1 for poking people other than me

  290. stpeter


  291. Florian

    nothing to add here

  292. will.sheward

    Or here

  293. stpeter

    we have some action items

  294. stpeter

    next meeting?

  295. stpeter

    is it in the calendar already?

  296. stpeter checks

  297. stpeter

    2 weeks from today I will be flying to New Jersey for a W3C workshop on web tracking and user privacy

  298. Florian

    next week?

  299. stpeter

    3 weeks from today I will be flying back from the IESG retreat in Amsterdam

  300. Florian

    as Jack and Nyco were missing?

  301. stpeter

    that's fine with me

  302. bear

    next week works for me

  303. Florian


  304. will.sheward


  305. stpeter updates the calendar

  306. Florian


  307. stpeter

    I'll check the typewith.me page here in a second so we can capture all the action items

  308. will.sheward

    We done? gavel banging tinne?

  309. stpeter


  310. stpeter

    seems so

  311. will.sheward


  312. Florian

    cools ... thanks everyone

  313. bear


  314. stpeter

    yes, thanks

  315. bear

    any changes to the meeting notes?

  316. Emil Ivov has left

  317. Florian

    none from me

  318. bear

    who is mailing the list for the summit poll?

  319. stpeter

    bear: checking

  320. will.sheward has left

  321. stpeter

    minutes look good

  322. stpeter

    thanks for that

  323. bear


  324. bear sends to members list

  325. stpeter

    calendar updated

  326. bear

    i'll email the comm team about bot

  327. bear

    can someone who is familiar with the QC IETF meeting compose the poll question

  328. stpeter

    bear: ok thanks

  329. stpeter

    bear: I can send the poll, sure

  330. bear


  331. stpeter

    message sent to members@

  332. stpeter

    I'll forward to summit@ too

  333. bear

    I emailed the comm team also

  334. stpeter

    I saw

  335. stpeter


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