XSF Discussion - 2013-01-17

>>> s = nodetree.Stream('<foo><bar>text content') >>> s.root.pop() Traceback (most recent call last): File "<stdin>", line 1, in <module> ValueError: incomplete branch

:-D

just a few test regressions and debugs to cleanup and I think it'll be ready

>>> s.send('</bar>') >>> s.root.pop() <bar>text content</bar>

cool

bear, so, lunch friday?

sure

do you have my number?

yep its in my phone

the plan is (still need to buy bus tix) head up friday morning and back sat night, tho the event im going to has a wishy-washy schedule

I'm flexible so let me know what time range is good friday - I can be in town in 20min

awesome

btw i could use some ideas on how to represent namespaces in this api. i have a few, but its complicated by this not being a purely DOM model; a node can belong to nodes in multiple documents (tho not in the same document twice)

the backend is libxml2 DOM but with a crazy complex linked list allowing a python object to hold multiple xml nodes while keeping the potential branches under them in sync.

icky DOM is icky

yea but its hard to implement xpath or xslt without it

this project came from a convo i had with fritzy 2 years ago about the sad state of python xml packages and how much headache it was to implement xmpp, or any stream parsing, with them

yea, python and stream processing are a bad mix

need a middle ware solution that can be used by any script

well python has had generators where yield can return a value (s.send() is an example) and coroutines for awhile, and has async now which uses that

yea, but those are bolted onto a GIL that doesn't make for *real* event processing

python xml stream processing?

Lance, yea nodetree.org - its nowhere near ready, but im about to push 0.3 release which adds this via nodetree.Stream class

I was waiting for you :)

bear: he mentioned xpath :)

no namespace support yet, no xpath/xslt support yet, but its going in as fast as i can. these early releases im mostly pushing to get feedback

one of my goals is to be able to implement stanza routing via xslt

i find a critical bug in the code for every hour or two i spend in it, too, though its becoming increasingly difficult to find the edge cases that produce them

arcriley if you want any help, let me know. this stuff would be great for sleekxmpp

Lance, yea this came from a convo i had with fritzy regarding how much of a PITA it was to use lxml in sleekxmpp

ah, yeah

we switched to elementtree

yea, elementtree is awesome(ish)

plus, nodetree is already several times faster than either celementtree or lxml since we let libxml2 do the parsing, and lazy create the Python objects representing nodes on demand

bear, elementtree is an awesome idea until you start to use it, and then it becomes a nightmare really fast. treating text nodes as a property of their parent element rather than as a node in the children list was a really bad design decision

there's several warts on the API like that

yea, I'm holding my nose and not "seeing" those issues because it allows me to not use libxml2 ;)

i'm not saying libxml2's api is any better :-)

my favorite complaint about etree is how to serialize nodes

et.tostring(node)

vs str(node)

oh yea

i've already implemented the latter, plus repr(node) will give a formatted tree.

hah, yeah. we just made our own serializer, that handled namespaces a little more sanely

so in interactive python, if you type a node name by itself, you'll get it formatted with indentation/etc as above, and with repr() you can output that to a file should you choose

Lance, would love your ideas on how to implement namespaces. obviously preserving both prefix and uri is important, and obviously namespace state needs to be carried with nodes when they're copied moved or disconnected from their parent, and obviously they should be able to be sanely managed from python programmatically

the current code is in http://hg.nodetree.org/nodetree

ignore the debug prints, they're kinda annoying, was tracking down memory management

arcriley: what are you trying to do better than elementtree with namespaces?

i don't have a solid plan for namespaces yet, but etree's namespace handling is atrocious so not hard to improve on

still brainstorming. until parsing was done it was kinda moot, and that just went in very recently

arcriley you'll be at the summit?

no can't afford to travel to europe right now. ill be at pycon tho

ok. i'll check out what you have so far and start playing with it

0.3 should be going out tomorrow. doing cleanup and getting the docs in order now

lance, you going to pycon btw?

i submitted a proposal for a XMPP poster session, if you're going you should do it with me to talk about sleekxmpp

i hadn't planned on it, but I certainly can

when is it?

the poster session is usually on sunday, so march 17

santa clara, ca

ok. i'll see if work will pay for travel and i'll let you know

http://us.pycon.org/

cool. if you can, then draft up a quick speaker profile on the site (just login and go to account, you don't have to register first) and i can add you as a speaker for the session

my experience with pycon poster sessions is you get a lot of people who're looking for a hammer for their pet screw, but its good to spread more general knowledge into the community. at the very least, have people know there's more to XMPP on Python than pyxmpp

right :)

arcriley: I'm approved so I'll write up a profile today

Lance, awesome ill invite you as a co-speaker for the poster

also if you stay for the sprints we'll likely do xmpp stuff

Lance Stout right?

yes

cool invite sent

poor jabber.org server :(

btw you in julython?

Yes. I wonder if the extra load is related to a bunch of really cool 'flooders', who seem to be kids who want to be hackers but lack the inclination to do anything more complicated than sending lots of messages.

Kev, but havent you heard, flooding internet services with traffic is the modern equivalent to a protest! and so any anti-flooding strategy you put in place, including filtering source addresses, is the same as having riot police break up a protest and squash their first amendment rights

No, I hadn't heard that. Thankfully I don't speak 'stupid'.

http://betabeat.com/2013/01/anonymous-wants-ddos-considered-free-speech-hops-on-the-white-house-petition-bandwagon/

Ah. Excellent.

It isn't, incidentally, DDoS attacks on jabber.org as far as I can tell.

Just a bunch of kids who like to join a MUC, send a few hundred/thousand messages and leave.

no, I'm not in julython. didn't even know what it was

Lance, yea our team is first place. our team being copyleft games - including our google code-in students :-)

arcriley: Haha, what the crap

Zash, iptables is the new pepper spray

i think the next logical response of course is to physically tear gas ddos kiddies homes, then beat and arrest them when they flee the building