XSF Discussion - 2017-10-10

  1. Nathan

    What I tried to say was what happens when MAM is implemented to a server?

  2. Zash

    Assuming there's an accompanying server-side message archive, then users can query it.

  3. zinid

    guys, when pubsub#publish-options form definition will be fixed?

  4. zinid

    or, if everyone is lazy doing this, where can I find definitions of every fields of pubsub#publish-options form

  5. zinid

    I recall Push, Persistent Storage, what else?

  6. jonasw

    zinid, make a PR? ;-)

  7. zinid

    but I'm lazy

  8. Flow

    zinid: what is broken?

  9. Flow

    Anyway, I wonder if MIX shouldn't really be PubSub2. Persistent group chat requires PubSub at the lowest level, MIX could provide that, while additionally fixing PubSub for everyone else (while keeping the old spec around)

  10. zinid

    Flow: pubsub#publish-options doesn't define pubsub#persist_items defined in XEP-0223 and 'secret' (without pubsub# ???) defined in XEP-0357

  11. Flow

    define where? in xep60? don't we have a registry for that?

  12. zinid


  13. zinid

    in xep60

  14. zinid

    I have no idea what "having a registry" means

  15. zinid


  16. edhelas


  17. Flow

    zinid, this one I think: https://xmpp.org/registrar/formtypes.html#http:--jabber.org-protocol-pubsubpublish-options

  18. zinid

    still not defined there ;)

  19. Flow

    right, PRs welcome ๐Ÿ˜‰

  20. zinid

    also, this registry is unusable, it doesn't define possible values of pubsub#access_model

  21. Flow

    zinid, it just defines the fild name, everything else is written in the defining XEP

  22. Flow

    field name, type and description

  23. zinid


  24. zinid

    so should be fixed both XEP-0060 definition and the registry?

  25. Flow

    zinid, I found persist_items in the registry. what else is missing?

  26. Flow

    An 'secret' from the push xep

  27. Flow

    Seems like 'push#secret' would be more idiomatic, also xep357 doesn't have a registry submission for that

  28. Flow

    If i recall correctly, Kev wanted to take of xep357

  29. Flow

    *take over

  30. zinid

    Flow: persist_items should be defined in every form where it's used, just like pubsub#access_model (it's defined in several forms)

  31. Flow

    what are the other forms where persist_items is used besides node_config?

  32. zinid


  33. zinid

    see XEP-0223

  34. zinid


  35. zinid

    example 4

  36. zinid

    possibly in others, dunno

  37. Flow

    I'm not sure if it's righ to use persist_items with publish-options

  38. Flow

    like access_model it appears more like a per node thing, not per item

  39. Flow

    could it be that ex1 in xep223 is wrong?

  40. jonasw

    Flow, no, that was discusesd on the ML

  41. Flow

    jonasw, ahh, must have missed that, do you have a pointer?

  42. jonasw

    nobody objected to the interpretation that <publish-options/> is a precondition

  43. jonasw

    will do

  44. Flow

    ahh, it's used as precondition

  45. Flow

    then it probably makes sense that it doesn't appear in publish-options's registry

  46. Flow

    now I remember that there was a discussion around that

  47. Flow

    ahh and xep60 reads like preconditions must also be registered

  48. zinid

    everything should be registered, even if XEP doesn't say that

  49. zinid

    because this form definition can be used by automatic validation (I do this in ejabberd)

  50. jonasw

    still looking for the discussion, hang on

  51. Flow

    jonasw, no worries, I think it was daniel who brought it up

  52. Guus

    any French people around?

  53. jonasw

    Flow, https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2017-May/032631.html

  54. jonasw

    got it

  55. mimi89999


  56. jonasw

    yes, preconditions must be registered to define the meaning of the precondition

  57. Guus

    in a certificate, what's the most appropriate value for "state or Province Name" for Paris?

  58. Flow

    Guus: does anyone care about the value of that field?

  59. Guus

    รŽle-de-France? Nothing?

  60. mimi89999

    Keep that empty. Nobody cares.

  61. Guus

    Flow: I don't want to find out, which is why I'm asking for the most appropriate value :)

  62. Guus


  63. mimi89999

    But probably it is that... See other certs...

  64. mimi89999

    The one of OVH...

  65. Guus

    (I don't know of any other certs)

  66. Guus

    oh, paris probably has a website...

  67. jonasw

    this is how the gandi.net certificate looks: CN = www.gandi.net OU = COMODO EV SSL OU = Ops O = Gandi SAS Object Identifier (2 5 4 9) = 63-65 Boulevard Massena L = Paris ST = Paris Object Identifier (2 5 4 17) = 75013 C = FR Object Identifier (2 5 4 15) = Private Organization Object Identifier (1 3 6 1 4 1 311 60 2 1 3) = FR Object Identifier (2 5 4 5) = 423 093 459 00042

  68. jonasw

    so apparently itโ€™s simply "Paris"?

  69. mimi89999


  70. Guus

    thanks guys :)

  71. mimi89999

    Certbot keeps that empty. Really nobody cares.

  72. zinid

    Flow: whatever, I generate code from this form now: https://github.com/processone/xmpp/blob/master/specs/pubsub_publish_options.xdata

  73. zinid

    secret without prefix 'pubsub#' looks odd though

  74. Flow

    I think 'push#secret' would be more to the point

  75. jonasw

    I agree

  76. Flow

    zinid, would be greate if you did an PR for the registry too

  77. zinid

    can we change the filed name?

  78. Flow


  79. Flow

    zinid: Not without a namespace bump I fear

  80. zinid

    then let's don't do this

  81. zinid

    we have the same in some MUC forms, this is not a major problem

  82. jonasw

    we should have errata sections in XEPs where we can note things for the next Namespace bump

  83. jonasw

    re registrar: I bet that stuff is currently not updated on the website

  84. Flow

    jonasw, I once started https://wiki.xmpp.org/web/XEP_and_RFC_Remarks

  85. jonasw

    yeah, nobody will look there when preparing a PR against a xep :)

  86. Ge0rG

    jonasw [09:56]: > we should have errata sections in XEPs where we can note things for the next Namespace bump There used to be wiki pages for each xep containing that information

  87. Guus

    Who's going to be at the GSoC menter summit this weekend? Arc, Daniel, Edwin and me - anyone else?

  88. Guus

    we should meet up. I'll at least bring some stickers :)

  89. Guus

    Edwin and me are in the Sheraton

  90. mimi89999

    Guus: Bring stickers *to* XMPP.

  91. Guus


  92. intosi

    Guus: +1 on the stickers.

  93. mimi89999

    > I'll at least bring some stickers :) ๐Ÿ˜‰

  94. mimi89999

    The requests for adding stickers...

  95. intosi

    mimi89999: ah.

  96. Guus

    Please note that my two-year-old kept me up all night, and I'm very likely to miss puns, sarcasm, and any other subtilities today.

  97. mimi89999

    Guus: Take some sleep then...

  98. Guus

    mimi89999: customers, deadlines.

  99. Guus

    my wife is actually very jealous of me going to the GSoC meeting. Not because of the trip, but because of the four days of hotel stay without the kids :)

  100. Guus

    four nights of uninterrupted sleep... sheer bliss.

  101. intosi

    Four nights of fighting jetlag ;)

  102. Guus

    intosi: that probably sets in only after I return

  103. mimi89999

    2x no sleep...

  104. intosi

    I'm usually much better going west to east than the other way around. Getting up early is easy, sleeping in is something I'm terrible at.

  105. Guus

    I'll find out in a couple of days

  106. Guus

    oh, at least 4 guys from Jitsi will be there too

  107. Guus

    they're in the other hotel though

  108. Flow

    Guus: If you meet Ingo, then please say hello from me

  109. Guus

    Flow: not sure if he'll be there. by-the-by: the Jitsi guys all but finished merging all of his Smack 3->4 miration work.

  110. Flow


  111. Guus

    it was a lot of work on Ingo's part, but the merge itself was relatively painless, from what I understand. There was one issue with certificate acepptance that they quickly resolved.

  112. Flow

    not that it matters: but it appears to be not yet merged: https://github.com/jitsi/jitsi/tree/smack4-2

  113. Guus

    that's the desktop app I think? I think they were referring to their backend stuff.

  114. Flow

    ahh, k, great