XSF Discussion - 2018-02-21

“10% of our chat server codebase is written in C while 90% is pure Erlang" 🤣🤣 I mean just mentioning what are you *really* using, salvaging code from is hard I suppose.

And the memory leak in which XMPP server did cause this: https://www.epicgames.com/fortnite/en-US/news/postmortem-of-service-outage-at-3-4m-ccu ? ;)

Flow: unsure? a cluster of 101 nodes is pretty nice though :)

it is indeed

although I don't understand how the cluster works if every node only connects to 10 other nodes and the still talk about a full mesh

but maybe the definition of full mesh is not what I have in mind

How should a user's MAM archive handle MUC-PMs? Store them, but not return them on normal queries?

Only give them back after the client has joined?

pep.: go for it ;-)

What do I need to tell it? Do I need to add it to my roster as well?

I didn't find a wiki page for it

pep., justsay hi

And it will tell you what to do

nope, doesn't work

Oh yes, you have to add it to your roster.

Can somebody accept the subscription?

Alex, can you, please?

TIL {xep 345}. I thought I read the wiki entirely when I applied, I must have missed any reference to this

pep.: Form of Membership Applications (Procedural, Deferred, 2017-09-11) See: https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0345.html

well, it doesn’t say much more than the wiki page

> The entity shouldn’t be reconnecting after a stream error, jonasw: you are an optimist.

Not an optimist, I'm just not convinced that's right at all.

Kev: me neither.

There was a problem, you want to reconnect.

I know for sure that my implementation can't differentiate between permanent and transient errors, so it will just stubbornly retry until the end of the world

Ge0rG, okay, I meant to say "try to resume"

sorry, that was unclear

I agree with Kev that it will cause annoyance to the users. But otherwise it is a bug which silently eats your messages, so gaining some visible annoyance is a good thing here.

yeah

wow. google talk/hangout works via xmpp again,. was broken the last weeks :o

Too bad the lack of federation though

stefandxm: it's broken since we moved to mandatory TLS in 2013.

Seve, sure. but at least it works from an xmpp client again

-ping gmail.com

Zash: Ping failed (remote-server-not-found): Server-to-server connection failed: Connecting failed: connection refused

stefandxm, do they use XMPP or is it just some kind of transport?

Seve, they use xmpp

but as said before, they do not allow federation

stefandxm: they do, kind of.

it just depends on which Google client you use, and better don't rely on your messages actually arriving anywhere

Gtalk working..? How can it work if xmpp was officially shutdown?

The only other Mandatory Encryption exception I had to leave is cisco.com they don't still encrypt streams

Maranda: they are so 2001.

Verily

The owners of Jabber don't do encrypted Jabber in 2018. So sad.

Ge0rG, the owners of jabber filter 5222 towards the internet in their own network

I think that might be worse

sad face

needs more TLS on 443 I guess :P

which I admit is awful to have to resort to, but, such is the state of things

very sad face

😱

Ge0rG, there is an i18n issue with form field names?

can't you use xml:lang?

flow: since when are all forms in all servers translated into all languages?

Ge0rG, is that an protocol issue?

flow: no, it's an implementation expectation issue

Is there a way to broadcast to other clients, that one client just joined a muc?

I know there are bookmarks, but are updates automatically pushed to all clients?

I find it unfortunate, that when I join a muc on for example dino, i have to relog in conversations to join the muc from there aswell.

well sometimes I don't want to be in all my muc's on all my clients

I have super busy mucs I only join from a desktop client because they'd eat my phone battery

but in the general case what you are talking about would be nice :)

Is discuss@conference.jabber.org still a thing that anyone uses? Someone was asking about general purpose XMPP chats so I tried to join, but Conversations appears to think that I have been banned, which I'm *reasonably* sure is wrong unless I did something really bad and forgot.

was there not something that banned not necessarily means banned

it just the forbidden error stanza

i think its triggered for example if the server doesnt allow you to open a new muc

Maybe discuss@ was deleted or something then; I don't know who the admins are to find out though.

i think MattJ was a admin of jabber.org

but maybe im remembering that wrong

We discussed the 'signal to other clients' thing for MUC at the Summit, and verdict was to switch 48 to 163, set all MUCs to autojoin when they're joined, unset autojoin when left, and all clients to obey immediately.

So at least all your clients are consistent (assuming they do this, naturally).

(Not really 163, but YKWIM)

yes please.