marmistrz, well, the XSF can’t and won’t give you legal advice on that matter
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jonasw
we will work on a guideline of things you should definitely look into, and a few non-legal opinions on things
jonasw
but that’s in no way legal advice
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jonasw
Ge0rG, any news on your schedule w.r.t. GDPR meeting?
jonasw
(tomorrow, 12:30 CEST)
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Ge0rG
Can't do tomorrow 12:30 (lunch break)
jonasw
Ge0rG, winfried, pep., what would work for you instead?
pep.
any, not later on friday as usual
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Ge0rG
I've got some time after the 25th.
Ge0rG
Sorry, not funny.
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winfried
Ge0rG: any way we can keep you involved while not attending the meetings, or is your schedule too packed for that too?
winfried
(BTW, I do like the 25th pun)
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Ge0rG
winfried: my problem is that I'm fully booked on a project that just began today, so I need to be available on short notice. I can't schedule anything for the next days, except Friday and *maybe* Thursday.
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winfried
jonasw pep. Ge0rG I propose we will meet tomorrow without Ge0rG and friday in full? (both 12:30 CEST)
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Ge0rG
It might work for me at 11:30 or 13:30 tomorrow, but I can't say for sure.
winfried
both 11:30 and 13:00 tomorrow wfm
Ge0rG
But please don't nail me on either.
Ge0rG
Just saying that it won't work at 1230 for sure.
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winfried
Ge0rG: I understand, won't nail you for it
jonasw
winfried, pep., I’m fully available except Thursday and late Friday
Ge0rG
Except maybe with NIN.
jonasw
so 1130 CEST would workforme tomorrow
jonasw
or 1330 CEST, I think I’d prefer the latter slightly
Ge0rG
Or is it NIИ?
winfried
Ge0rG: NIИ, that is a youth memory!
winfried
jonasw: would friday 1330 CEST work for you or is that to late?
jonasw
winfried, that would work
winfried
jonasw: oops, meant to ask 12:30 on friday , but 13:30 would work for me too ;-)
jonasw
winfried, 1330 works better than 1230 on friday, I think :)
winfried
pep.: would tomorrow at 13:30 CEST AND friday at 13:30 fit you? Ge0rG may then attend tomorrow and friday for sure (correct Ge0rG ?)
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Ge0rG
winfried: besides of the music, I also loved the Quake1 ammunition...
Ge0rG
winfried: I can't promise it 100% yet, sorry.
winfried
Ge0rG: sorry, I am from the wulfenstein era ;-)
Ge0rG
winfried: "Mein Leben!"
jonasw
my new portable digital audio player unfortunately cannot run doom anymore
jonasw
not enough colors (1 bit color depth)
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Ge0rG
https://op-co.de/vr3/files/doom.gif - I had doom running on my first Linux PDA.
jonasw
that’s more than one bit ;-)
Ge0rG
Last modified 2004-01-31 18:48. Wow, that's less than I thought it'd be.
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jonasw
(granted, people *did* run doom on black/white LCD TI Voyage 200 calculators by tricking the display into displaying 2 bit grayscale or something)
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edhelas
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17063761
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winfried
edhelas: there we go again...
Zash
ZZzzz...
edhelas
> That said, I think that main problem with Jabber is lack of a single entity pushing it. So it'll naturally lose fight against corporation with billion-dollar marketing budgets. With Matrix it might be better.
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edhelas
:D
edhelas
let's built a decentralized network, but handled by a single entity :-°
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daniel
Wait the performance of the matrix server is so bad that had to disable presence?
Ge0rG
Where can I find old versions of XEP-0045 (which define the GC1 behavior)
daniel
Is this for real 😂
Wiktor
maybe that's just me but I think they have a point, Arathorn is very active both on social media, and getting publicity (French government case), they operate like a corporation but Matrix is still federated (anyone can run the instance etc.)
goffi
catching a bit conversation on standard@ after a while, for the record I'm strongly willing/needing a deletion mechanism for file sharing (I'm not using HTTP upload, but would be nice to make it generic enough so it can be used by HTTP upload). I was planing to use ad-hoc commands for that, and propose a XEP after testing on the field.
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Zash
What came first, Jabber Inc. or the JSF?
Ge0rG
https://xmpp.org/extensions/attic/ only goes back to 1.16 :(
edhelas
daniel you don't have performance problems anymore if you remove the heavy features
daniel
I mean honestly I want to like matrix. And I actually hope they will succeed. They do some (non technical) things a lot better than the jabber community or the xsf
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daniel
But from all I hear their stack is just polished shit just as xmpp is
Zash
Marketing?
Zash
It'd be nice if they had learned from XMPP, but from what I can see, they're following the exact same path.
daniel
Yeah Marketing fundraising to employ full time people. Their way of extending the standard that you basically have to submit a PR for the spec, the implementation in the server and the client at the same time
Zash
I'm sure Jabber was just as cool back when there was one client, one server, transports were all the rage and Jabber Inc. wasn't bought by Cisco yet.
Zash
Just wait until there are more than one of independently developed servers and clients, it'll be exactly the same as XMPP.
daniel
Rumor has that they are actively discouraging new server implementations
goffi
Zash: that's one of the main issue I have with matrix (with their initial aggressivity with XMPP), it's all controlled by one company and a few people.
Zash
Wasn't the excuse for the reference server being slow "but we're rewriting it in rust!!!"
Holger
Go!
Zash
Samesame
Holger
Yeah their server story looks like a desaster.
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Zash
But otoh, Jabber was started as an open source project, not as/by a company with a marketing budget.
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Zash
> List of acquisitions by Cisco Systems (redirect from Jabber, Inc.)
Heh
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edhelas
2019, Cisco is buying Matrix.inc
Zash
What about going through the IETF and having a (Software|Standards) Foundation?
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daniel
I mean in a way it's interesting to see how their approach pans out in the next 5-10 years
daniel
If it's still a somewhat open standard in 10 years that you could federate with their approach might have been proven more effective
daniel
I don't think there is anything inherently bad with a single company providing the reference implementation. As long as you always have the *option* of forking while still federation
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daniel
*federating
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winfried
I think the real problem is the difference between an open chat application like Matrix and an ecosystem like XMPP. Getting started is *much* harder in the ecosystem, but in the long run you want an ecosystem not just one implementation.
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Zash
winfried: Doesn't that depend somewhat on who "you" are, and what their goals are?
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Andrew Nenakhov
Matrix uniformity comes from it's relative obscurity. Once it will have multiple implementations, it'll be absolutely same as XMPP.
moparisthebest
except without the specs/documentation ?
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Wiktor
moparisthebest: you mean that https://matrix.org/docs/spec/ ?
Andrew Nenakhov
And of course they are less obsessed with this crypto bullshit
daniel
Are they?
moparisthebest
didn't they develop OLM themselves?
winfried
Zash: don't think so, when maintaining a system for a longer time then 5-7 years, you want an ecosystem, not just one application. Up to that point funding, acquiring technology/knowledge etc is easier when you use a monolithic code base. Once you are up to your first big overhaul, you get your regrets. No matter who you are and what your goal is....
pep.
What about some projects applying for MOSS funding
pep.
Xmpp projects
Zash
winfried: I mean like, a company wanting ultimate control, do they want an ecosystem? Or like, Signal.
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winfried
Zash: If I want ultimate control, I can still use the XMPP ecosystem as codebase. In matter of fact, I expect most XMPP deployments are exactly like that!
MattJ
.
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MattJ
Is it me or is the xmpp.org website slow?
jonasw
I think it might be you
Zash
1.78s
jonasw
loads fine here
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Zash
MattJ: You've just gotten spoiled by how blazing fast the new prosody.im site is ;)
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Link Mauve
About 1.8s here for prosody.im’s home page. :p
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MattJ
Hmm, the link to compliance suites on https://xmpp.org/extensions/ is outdated
Ge0rG: Looks like the origin of the direct invite namespace https://web.archive.org/web/20020214222508/http://docs.jabber.org:80/draft-proto/html/conferencing.html
jonasw
<message type="groupchat" from="act3@gc.denmark">
<body>Hamlet has arrived.</body>
</message>