XSF Discussion - 2018-08-01

  1. Guus has left

  2. Guus has joined

  3. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  4. kasper.dement has joined

  5. kasper.dement has left

  6. kasper.dement has joined

  7. Guus has left

  8. 404.city has joined

  9. kasper.dement has left

  10. kasper.dement has joined

  11. daniel has left

  12. jjrh has left

  13. 404.city has left

  14. kasper.dement has left

  15. Guus has joined

  16. Chobbes has joined

  17. kasper.dement has joined

  18. Guus has left

  19. ta has joined

  20. SamWhited has left

  21. daniel has left

  22. daniel has joined

  23. mrdoctorwho has joined

  24. Dave Cridland has left

  25. Dave Cridland has left

  26. kasper.dement has left

  27. jjrh has left

  28. kasper.dement has joined

  29. Zash has left

  30. Chobbes has joined

  31. Dave Cridland has left

  32. Guus has joined

  33. Zash has left

  34. Guus has left

  35. Chobbes has left

  36. Chobbes has joined

  37. kasper.dement has joined

  38. kasper.dement has joined

  39. Dave Cridland has left

  40. Dave Cridland has left

  41. Guus has joined

  42. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  43. kasper.dement has left

  44. kasper.dement has joined

  45. SamWhited has left

  46. alacer has left

  47. alacer has joined

  48. Guus has left

  49. Dave Cridland has left

  50. alacer has left

  51. alacer has joined

  52. kasper.dement has left

  53. 404.city has joined

  54. kasper.dement has joined

  55. Dave Cridland has left

  56. Guus has joined

  57. kasper.dement has left

  58. kasper.dement has joined

  59. Guus has left

  60. Yagiza has joined

  61. kasper.dement has left

  62. Guus has joined

  63. Guus has left

  64. Guus has joined

  65. Guus has left

  66. Guus has joined

  67. kasper.dement has joined

  68. mrdoctorwho has joined

  69. kasper.dement has left

  70. moparisthebest has joined

  71. moparisthebest has joined

  72. mrdoctorwho has left

  73. Dave Cridland has left

  74. ta has joined

  75. jere has joined

  76. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  77. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  78. 404.city has left

  79. mimi89999 has left

  80. mimi89999 has joined

  81. moparisthebest has left

  82. SamWhited has joined

  83. Dave Cridland has left

  84. moparisthebest has joined

  85. Dave Cridland has left

  86. Dave Cridland has left

  87. waqas has left

  88. Ge0rG has joined

  89. goffi has joined

  90. Nekit has left

  91. Nekit has joined

  92. Tobias has left

  93. Tobias has joined

  94. moparisthebest has left

  95. moparisthebest has joined

  96. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  97. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  98. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  99. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  100. andy has joined

  101. Martin has left

  102. Martin has joined

  103. Chobbes has joined

  104. Guus has left

  105. Guus has joined

  106. Guus has left

  107. Guus has joined

  108. Guus has left

  109. Guus has joined

  110. Guus has left

  111. Guus has joined

  112. Guus has left

  113. Guus has joined

  114. Guus has left

  115. Guus has joined

  116. Guus has left

  117. Guus has joined

  118. Guus has left

  119. Guus has joined

  120. Guus has left

  121. Guus has joined

  122. rishiraj22 has left

  123. Ge0rG has joined

  124. rion has left

  125. rion has left

  126. marc has joined

  127. Dave Cridland has left

  128. Dave Cridland has left

  129. ThibG has joined

  130. ThibG has joined

  131. karp has left

  132. karp has joined

  133. labdsf has left

  134. mrdoctorwho has left

  135. Guus has left

  136. Guus has joined

  137. Guus has left

  138. Guus has joined

  139. Ge0rG has left

  140. lnj has joined

  141. Guus has left

  142. Guus has joined

  143. Guus has left

  144. Guus has joined

  145. Guus has left

  146. Guus has joined

  147. blabla has joined

  148. Ge0rG has left

  149. SamWhited has left

  150. marc has left

  151. mrdoctorwho has left

  152. mrdoctorwho has left

  153. Ge0rG has left

  154. rishiraj22 has joined

  155. Guus has left

  156. Guus has joined

  157. Guus has left

  158. Guus has joined

  159. karp has left

  160. karp has joined

  161. Ge0rG has left

  162. Ge0rG has left

  163. la|r|ma has joined

  164. Guus has left

  165. Guus has joined

  166. Guus has left

  167. Guus has joined

  168. Ge0rG has left

  169. Guus has left

  170. Guus has joined

  171. daniel has left

  172. daniel has joined

  173. mikaela has joined

  174. Ge0rG has left

  175. jubalh has joined

  176. Ge0rG has left

  177. Guus has left

  178. Guus has joined

  179. Ge0rG has left

  180. lskdjf has joined

  181. Guus has left

  182. Guus has joined

  183. jubalh has joined

  184. Guus has left

  185. Guus has joined

  186. Ge0rG has left

  187. Guus has left

  188. Guus has joined

  189. Ge0rG has left

  190. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  191. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  192. efrit has left

  193. Chobbes has joined

  194. Ge0rG has left

  195. Ge0rG has left

  196. jubalh has joined

  197. rishiraj22 has left

  198. Ge0rG has left

  199. Ge0rG has left

  200. Steve Kille has left

  201. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  202. Steve Kille has left

  203. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  204. Alex has joined

  205. Valerian has joined

  206. jubalh has joined

  207. jubalh has left

  208. blabla has joined

  209. Dave Cridland has left

  210. Dave Cridland has left

  211. Ge0rG has left

  212. jubalh has joined

  213. mrdoctorwho has joined

  214. Ge0rG has left

  215. Steve Kille has joined

  216. mikaela has left

  217. rishiraj22 has left

  218. ta has joined

  219. labdsf has joined

  220. lumi has joined

  221. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  222. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  223. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  224. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  225. Ge0rG has left

  226. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  227. Guus has left

  228. Guus has joined

  229. Dave Cridland has left

  230. muppeth has joined

  231. muppeth has joined

  232. Dave Cridland has left

  233. andy has left

  234. andy has joined

  235. Steve Kille has left

  236. Valerian has left

  237. jubalh has left

  238. Alex has left

  239. dos has joined

  240. lskdjf has left

  241. lskdjf has joined

  242. lumi has left

  243. muppeth has joined

  244. Steve Kille has left

  245. Steve Kille has joined

  246. muppeth has joined

  247. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  248. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  249. ThibG has joined

  250. ThibG has joined

  251. lskdjf has joined

  252. Alex has left

  253. Valerian has joined

  254. alacer has left

  255. alacer has joined

  256. daniel has left

  257. rishiraj22 has left

  258. mrdoctorwho has left

  259. edhelas

    hi everyone

  260. Seve/SouL


  261. Ge0rG has left

  262. edhelas

    I was wondering it there is a way to quote/reference a pubsub item in a chat message ?

  263. edhelas

    there's muc#roominfo_pubsub that allows to link Pubsub nodes to a MUC, and I'm planning to display the related pubsub node items in the MUC UI, then you can comment/reference it

  264. jonasw

    edhelas, the References XEP has a syntax for that I think

  265. edhelas


  266. jonasw

    ... a syntax which I don’t like, and I haven’t heard back from the authors yet on whether they’re willing to change it

  267. alacer has left

  268. alacer has joined

  269. mikaela has joined

  270. andy has left

  271. andy has joined

  272. tux has joined

  273. Guus has left

  274. Guus has joined

  275. Alex has joined

  276. remko has joined

  277. remko has left

  278. vanitasvitae has left

  279. vanitasvitae has left

  280. vanitasvitae has joined

  281. vanitasvitae has left

  282. Steve Kille has left

  283. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  284. j.r has joined

  285. Dave Cridland has left

  286. mikaela has left

  287. mikaela has joined

  288. daniel has joined

  289. Dave Cridland has left

  290. Steve Kille has left

  291. matlag has left

  292. pep. has left

  293. j.r has left

  294. j.r has joined

  295. Steve Kille has left

  296. Alex has left

  297. Zash has left

  298. rishiraj22 has left

  299. Steve Kille has left

  300. blabla has joined

  301. Guus has joined

  302. lumi has joined

  303. lskdjf has left

  304. Zash has left

  305. dos has left

  306. daniel has left

  307. Alex has joined

  308. daniel has joined

  309. karp has left

  310. karp has joined

  311. j.r has joined

  312. muppeth has joined

  313. lumi has joined

  314. rishiraj22 has left

  315. tux has joined

  316. rishiraj22 has joined

  317. mikaela has left

  318. mikaela has joined

  319. i12ttyl has joined

  320. i12ttyl has left

  321. muppeth has joined

  322. Chobbes has joined

  323. andy has left

  324. andy has joined

  325. kasper.dement has joined

  326. andy has left

  327. jere has joined

  328. rishiraj22 has left

  329. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  330. rishiraj22 has joined

  331. kasper.dement has joined

  332. Zash has left

  333. dos has joined

  334. jubalh has joined

  335. tux has joined

  336. mrdoctorwho has left

  337. andy has joined

  338. mrdoctorwho has left

  339. bjc has joined

  340. lnj has left

  341. Nekit has joined

  342. kasper.dement has joined

  343. muppeth has joined

  344. mrdoctorwho has joined

  345. Alex has left

  346. lskdjf has left

  347. jubalh has joined

  348. muppeth has joined

  349. mimi89999 has left

  350. lskdjf has left

  351. kasper.dement has left

  352. ta has joined

  353. tux has joined

  354. Alex has joined

  355. Valerian has left

  356. Valerian has joined

  357. Valerian has left

  358. Valerian has joined

  359. Guus has joined

  360. Valerian has left

  361. lskdjf has joined

  362. Valerian has joined

  363. Valerian has left

  364. blabla has joined

  365. Valerian has joined

  366. kasper.dement has joined

  367. Valerian has left

  368. Valerian has joined

  369. ralphm has joined

  370. Valerian has left

  371. Valerian has joined

  372. double has joined

  373. double has left

  374. double has joined

  375. double has left

  376. double has joined

  377. lskdjf has joined

  378. kasper.dement has left

  379. Zash has left

  380. kasper.dement has joined

  381. Dave Cridland has left

  382. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  383. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  384. Dave Cridland has left

  385. Dave Cridland has left

  386. kasper.dement has left

  387. mrdoctorwho has left

  388. jubalh has joined

  389. kasper.dement has joined

  390. Chobbes has joined

  391. Valerian has left

  392. alacer has left

  393. kasper.dement has joined

  394. Zash has left

  395. double has left

  396. Dave Cridland has left

  397. Dave Cridland has left

  398. Valerian has joined

  399. karp has left

  400. karp has joined

  401. pep. has joined

  402. Dave Cridland has left

  403. kasper.dement has joined

  404. Dave Cridland has left

  405. Dave Cridland has left

  406. Dave Cridland has left

  407. lskdjf has joined

  408. nyco has left

  409. nyco has joined

  410. Dave Cridland has left

  411. Alex has left

  412. Dave Cridland has left

  413. kasper.dement has left

  414. kasper.dement has joined

  415. mrdoctorwho has left

  416. Guus has left

  417. Guus has joined

  418. Guus has left

  419. Guus has joined

  420. andy has left

  421. kasper.dement has joined

  422. kasper.dement has joined

  423. Zash has left

  424. 404.city has joined

  425. Guus has left

  426. Guus has joined

  427. Valerian has left

  428. edhelas has left

  429. Guus has left

  430. Guus has joined

  431. edhelas has joined

  432. lskdjf has left

  433. Guus has left

  434. Guus has joined

  435. Guus has left

  436. Guus has joined

  437. jere has joined

  438. Zash has left

  439. lskdjf has left

  440. Guus has left

  441. Guus has joined

  442. Valerian has joined

  443. nyco has left

  444. nyco has joined

  445. jubalh has left

  446. Alex has left

  447. Dave Cridland has left

  448. Dave Cridland has left

  449. jubalh has joined

  450. Chobbes has joined

  451. Syndace has left

  452. jjrh has left

  453. jere has joined

  454. tux has joined

  455. jubalh has joined

  456. marc has joined

  457. blabla has joined

  458. jubalh has joined

  459. Guus has left

  460. Guus has joined

  461. lskdjf has left

  462. jubalh has left

  463. lskdjf has left

  464. lskdjf has left

  465. Valerian has left

  466. Valerian has joined

  467. jubalh has joined

  468. jjrh has left

  469. jubalh has left

  470. jubalh has joined

  471. waqas has joined

  472. Zash has left

  473. lskdjf has left

  474. lskdjf has left

  475. alacer has joined

  476. lskdjf has left

  477. lskdjf has left

  478. lskdjf has left

  479. daniel has left

  480. rishiraj22 has left

  481. lskdjf has joined

  482. dos has left

  483. kasper.dement has joined

  484. blabla has joined

  485. kasper.dement has joined

  486. jubalh has joined

  487. Steve Kille has joined

  488. alacer has left

  489. alacer has joined

  490. blabla has joined

  491. kasper.dement has joined

  492. kasper.dement has joined

  493. mrdoctorwho has joined

  494. Guus has left

  495. Guus has joined

  496. Guus has left

  497. Guus has joined

  498. Guus has left

  499. Guus has joined

  500. lovetox has joined

  501. daniel has joined

  502. Guus has left

  503. Guus has joined

  504. goffi has left

  505. dos has joined

  506. kasper.dement has left

  507. blabla has left

  508. rishiraj22 has left

  509. kasper.dement has joined

  510. rishiraj22 has left

  511. Guus has left

  512. Guus has joined

  513. Guus has left

  514. Guus has joined

  515. goffi has joined

  516. Chobbes has joined

  517. Ge0rG

    jdev@conference.jabber.org will respond to pings to a non-existent nickname with not-allowed. Yay.

  518. jonasw

    this muc is fubar anyways

  519. Guus has left

  520. Guus has joined

  521. Ge0rG

    It will also respond not-allowed if I'm not joined.

  522. jonasw


  523. Ge0rG

    > this muc is fubar anyways Which is why I'm testing it.

  524. kasper.dement has joined

  525. Ge0rG

    jonasw: https://github.com/xsf/xeps/pull/688

  526. jonasw

    I need an "Out of Order -- Overheated" sign

  527. jonasw

    Ge0rG, no revision block documenting the rename etc.?

  528. Zash

    Wasn't there a 'hot' in {xep user mood}?

  529. Bunneh

    Zash: User Mood (Standards Track, Draft, 2018-03-13) See: https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0107.html

  530. Guus has left

  531. Guus has joined

  532. jonasw

    Ge0rG, another suggestion: I think a safe way to handle nickname-change-vs-ping-races is the following: when receiving a nickname change notification *and* a ping is in-flight, that ping is allowed to fail. issue a new ping.

  533. jonasw

    due to the stream ordering guarantees, you have to see the nick change notification *before* the error reply

  534. jonasw

    s/issue a new ping/issue a new ping and ignore the result of the other ping/

  535. Ge0rG

    jonasw: or do what I did in the PR ;)

  536. Ge0rG

    consider item-not-found as a valid response

  537. jonasw

    Ge0rG, but what if you never get a response because just in that moment your s2s interrupts?

  538. jonasw

    (talking about line 172+)

  539. jonasw

    my suggestion resolves MSN and own nick changes and it’ll work even with jdev@

  540. jjrh has left

  541. kasper.dement has joined

  542. muppeth has joined

  543. Ge0rG

    jonasw: your suggestion requires more logic.

  544. jonasw

    Ge0rG, it’s also fail-safer

  545. Ge0rG

    jonasw: I can live with yet another rejoin ;)

  546. jonasw

    maybe put it in as suggestion for clients which want that amount of logic

  547. Ge0rG

    jonasw: PRs welcome

  548. jonasw

    on a ProtoXEP?

  549. ralphm has joined

  550. Chobbes has joined

  551. Ge0rG

    jonasw: it will stay a ProtoXEP until daniel approves or rejects.

  552. jonasw

    still, you wanna add your revision block there?

  553. Ge0rG

    jonasw: do I need to? I only asked for the revision block for the case that the funny name has to leave the title.

  554. jonasw

    for the sake of record-keeping and e.g. daniel who has to review it later, it makes sense to record it

  555. Ge0rG

    jonasw: as the Council didn't provide much feedback on the technical details, I'm not sure it will matter to daniel

  556. jonasw

    put it another way: if you don’t do it, I’ll do it

  557. jonasw

    but if you do it now, I can merge that now

  558. jonasw

    if you don’t do it now, I’ll drag it out because it’s too hot for me to think about stuff

  559. Kev

    Or until Daniel doesn't vote. There's a two week expiry period on voting.

  560. jjrh has left

  561. ta has joined

  562. jjrh has left

  563. peter has joined

  564. Guus has left

  565. Guus has joined

  566. blabla has joined

  567. Martin has left

  568. Martin has left

  569. Martin has left

  570. Martin has joined

  571. muppeth has joined

  572. Ge0rG

    Kev: that's an option as well. But I don't want to delay changes based on the Council feedback by two weeks because of that.

  573. jjrh has left

  574. muppeth has joined

  575. Guus has left

  576. Guus has joined

  577. moparisthebest has joined

  578. kasper.dement has joined

  579. Dave Cridland has left

  580. peter has left

  581. Tobias has joined

  582. Tobias has joined

  583. Dave Cridland has left

  584. Steve Kille has left

  585. muppeth has left

  586. muppeth has joined

  587. kasper.dement has joined

  588. marc has left

  589. marc has joined

  590. Zash has left

  591. kasper.dement has left

  592. blabla has left

  593. Zash has left

  594. kasper.dement has joined

  595. blabla has joined

  596. Dave Cridland has left

  597. mrdoctorwho has joined

  598. alacer has left

  599. alacer has joined

  600. kasper.dement has left

  601. Guus has left

  602. Guus has joined

  603. nyco has left

  604. kasper.dement has joined

  605. nyco has joined

  606. Dave Cridland has left

  607. Dave Cridland has left

  608. Dave Cridland has left

  609. kasper.dement has left

  610. peter has joined

  611. blabla has joined

  612. kasper.dement has joined

  613. Guus has left

  614. Guus has joined

  615. marc has left

  616. Guus has left

  617. Guus has joined

  618. Guus has left

  619. Guus has joined

  620. ThibG has joined

  621. ThibG has joined

  622. blabla has joined

  623. SamWhited has left

  624. ThibG has joined

  625. ThibG has joined

  626. muppeth has joined

  627. Dave Cridland has left

  628. Guus has left

  629. Guus has joined

  630. SamWhited has left

  631. muppeth has joined

  632. marc has joined

  633. blabla has left

  634. labdsf has left

  635. Steve Kille has left

  636. MattJ

    If I'm reading XEP-0060 right, you can't support max_items and simultaneously support unlimited items

  637. Dave Cridland has left

  638. MattJ

    Hmm, more simply - there is just no way to have an unlimited-item node

  639. ThibG has joined

  640. Zash

    Set max_items > 9000

  641. ThibG has joined

  642. MattJ

    Seems like quite a limitation for e.g. microblogging

  643. waqas

    640K Ought to be Enough for Anyone <https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&amp;rct=j&amp;q=&amp;esrc=s&amp;source=web&amp;cd=2&amp;ved=2ahUKEwjDrZWPuczcAhUBvVkKHXecAi0QFjABegQIAhAB&amp;url=https%3A%2F%2Fquoteinvestigator.com%2F2011%2F09%2F08%2F640k-enough%2F&amp;usg=AOvVaw1pt8pBSu4B_G2oN6QxGUP0>

  644. waqas

    640K Ought to be Enough for Anyone <https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&amp;rct=j&amp;q=&amp;esrc=s&amp;source=web&amp;cd=2&amp;ved=2ahUKEwjDrZWPuczcAhUBvVkKHXecAi0QFjABegQIAhAB&amp;url=https%3A%2F%2Fquoteinvestigator.com%2F2011%2F09%2F08%2F640k-enough%2F&amp;usg=AOvVaw1pt8pBSu4B_G2oN6QxGUP0>

  645. labdsf has joined

  646. rion has left

  647. Dave Cridland has left

  648. Dave Cridland has left

  649. Dave Cridland has left

  650. Guus has left

  651. Guus has joined

  652. Dave Cridland

    Set max_items to be, dynamically, 10k more than the current count.

  653. j.r has joined

  654. blabla has joined

  655. Kev has left

  656. Dave Cridland

    But yeah, you're right. If an implementation supports multiple items, it has to expose max_items.

  657. MattJ

    So people complained Prosody's PEP only supported a single item

  658. MattJ

    so how many did they want it to support?

  659. MattJ

    Let's say OMEMO used an item per device for keys, what would Conversations configure max_items as?

  660. Dave Cridland

    MattJ, Well, Prosody can support unlimited items, or at least, support any value for max_items.

  661. nyco has left

  662. nyco has joined

  663. Dave Cridland

    MattJ, I don't know without looking if there's an upper limit on max_items because it's a xs:positiveInteger, mind, but I'd expect that to be 2**31 at worst case.

  664. karp has left

  665. karp has joined

  666. Dave Cridland

    MattJ, That said, pre-keys are stored in PEP precisely to obviate the need for server code changes, and given that storing them in "the open" potentially leads to a kind of DoS(ish) attack which weakens the cryptographic properties, it's arguing to stick pre-keys in a specialized server-side service anyway.

  667. Dave Cridland

    MattJ, But bookmarks 2 uses multiple items, too, for better reasons.

  668. j.r has joined

  669. Guus has left

  670. Guus has joined

  671. Guus has left

  672. Guus has joined

  673. lovetox

    Im not sure if im understanding you correctly, but omemo does not store multiple items

  674. lovetox

    it needs exactly one item per node

  675. Zash

    It could tho

  676. lovetox

    but it does not care if its more

  677. lovetox

    Zash i dont see the value

  678. Zash

    But it doesn't because it wouldn't work since only one item was guaranteed

  679. lskdjf has left

  680. lovetox

    im not sure what you are suggesting, but i dont see any value in storing anything omemo related in a multiple items node

  681. lovetox

    bookmarks is completely different use case

  682. lovetox

    and it makes sense there

  683. Zash

    individual prekeys could be removed when they are used up for example

  684. Zash

    and devices could publish their own key without having to make sure to not remove other devices keys

  685. jjrh has left

  686. lovetox

    tricky, a prekey in a node is not of any value if you dont have the same prekey in storage

  687. lovetox

    its more foolproof if you just publish the new prekey list on each removal

  688. Zash

    I don't actually have any idea how OMEMO works, I'm just guessing

  689. lovetox

    no you brought up a valid argument

  690. lovetox

    one could do it that way, but then you would have to check from time to time, if your db stored prekeys are really the ones that are published

  691. lovetox

    the second idea, to store device ids per item is more interesting

  692. Zash

    Altho, it uses ... different nodes now? Or something?

  693. Zash

    Which in itself is awkward

  694. lovetox

    you mean the device id?

  695. lovetox

    its serves a multi purpose, 1. it shows you the way to the public key node

  696. MattJ

    Sorry, my question was quite unrelated to OMEMO, it was just an example (multiple items have been discussed in the past, and Prosody not supporting that was one of the reasons against it)

  697. lovetox

    2. it shows other clients which devices are active devices

  698. MattJ

    Bookmarks is just as valid

  699. MattJ

    And probably a better example

  700. Zash

    Both specs bend backwards a bit to fit into "there can be only one item per node"

  701. j.r has joined

  702. jjrh has left

  703. karp has left

  704. karp has joined

  705. lovetox

    MattJ, why do you ask, because you think about a hard max limit for prosody?

  706. lovetox

    i guess its only natural that a server has something like that

  707. ta has joined

  708. lovetox

    i think nobody expects a server to support truly unlimited items

  709. labdsf has left

  710. labdsf has joined

  711. tux has joined

  712. lovetox

    Zash i thought about it some more, and how would you chose a prekey? because more then one client can try to use a prekey while you are offline, you are supposed to choose one per random to reduce the chances that 2 c lients pick the same

  713. lovetox

    so you have to download all items of the node

  714. lovetox

    this does need 100 times the roundtrips you would need with one node, and needs much more time

  715. lovetox

    *one item

  716. lovetox

    If someone would want to improve the prekey use case, a server module is the best way

  717. Dave Cridland

    https://drive.google.com/file/d/1dbf75m-3HG7tssvI0L__99yNCj9mtPt4/view?usp=sharing (In progress) https://drive.google.com/file/d/1K7Y-5N3E0-swSOqmLHdgr7fyNHa0wjhj/view?usp=sharing (And done)

  718. kasper.dement has joined

  719. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, FWIW, I'd like to make prekeying a server module, but I'd just wwait until MLS is ready and use that.

  720. blabla has joined

  721. lovetox

    yes this would take some impl complexity away from clients and additionally would make race conditions impossible

  722. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, Also means you can't "drain" prekeys, or look for especially weak ones to use, or ...

  723. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, It *also* means that a server can potentially inject other prekeys into a set, of course. That ought to be detectable, but it can allow for retention policies etc which are important in enterprise/government cases.

  724. lovetox

    hm really? would not still the client have to create the keys and suppy it to the server?

  725. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, Yes, but the server can conceal how many are present and loop over the last N instead of discarding them.

  726. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, Anyone trying to constantly request prekeys to see if this is the case is pretty easy to spot, too.

  727. lovetox

    hm no that is not allowed in the signal spec

  728. lovetox

    prekey is to used once only

  729. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, I know. But the MLS spec isn't Signal, just similar. And prekeys can't be used more than once mostly to make the cryptographic proofs simpler.

  730. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, The alternative is that if prekeys are exhausted, then you can't exchange messages (encrypted) anymore.

  731. Dave Cridland

    lovetox, So either that's a DoS waiting to happen, or else unencrypted comms.

  732. Steve Kille has joined

  733. Valerian has left

  734. MattJ

    lovetox [19:47]: > MattJ, why do you ask, because you think about a hard max limit for prosody? Yes, we need a limit

  735. kasper.dement has left

  736. la|r|ma has left

  737. kasper.dement has joined

  738. Steve Kille has left

  739. ThibG has left

  740. ThibG has joined

  741. blabla has joined

  742. alacer has left

  743. alacer has joined

  744. lskdjf has joined

  745. Dave Cridland has left

  746. ThibG has left

  747. ThibG has joined

  748. kasper.dement has joined

  749. kasper.dement has joined

  750. lnj has joined

  751. jubalh has joined

  752. kasper.dement has joined

  753. goffi has left

  754. kasper.dement has joined

  755. la|r|ma has joined

  756. jubalh has joined

  757. mimi89999 has left

  758. mimi89999 has left

  759. mimi89999 has left

  760. mimi89999 has joined

  761. Zash has left

  762. lumi has joined

  763. Yagiza has left

  764. rishiraj22 has left

  765. labdsf has left

  766. rishiraj22 has left

  767. SamWhited has left

  768. labdsf has joined

  769. alacer has left

  770. kasper.dement has joined

  771. kasper.dement has joined

  772. Zash has left

  773. anjan has joined

  774. lorddavidiii has left

  775. j.r has joined

  776. Zash has left

  777. Martin has joined

  778. marc has left

  779. kasper.dement has joined

  780. Zash has joined

  781. lovetox has left

  782. kasper.dement has joined

  783. Martin has left

  784. Martin has joined

  785. mikaela has left

  786. mikaela has joined

  787. jubalh has joined

  788. Guus has left

  789. jubalh has joined

  790. jubalh has joined

  791. Guus has joined

  792. kasper.dement has left

  793. jubalh has left

  794. jubalh has joined

  795. kasper.dement has joined

  796. anjan has joined

  797. Andrew Nenakhov has left

  798. Andrew Nenakhov has joined

  799. kasper.dement has left

  800. kasper.dement has joined

  801. jubalh has joined

  802. kasper.dement has left

  803. kasper.dement has joined

  804. mikaela has left

  805. Syndace has left

  806. Syndace has joined

  807. jjrh has left

  808. Guus has left

  809. Guus has joined

  810. Guus has left

  811. Guus has joined

  812. lumi has left

  813. jjrh has left

  814. Guus has left

  815. Guus has joined

  816. Guus has left

  817. Guus has joined

  818. jjrh has left

  819. blabla has left

  820. pep. has left

  821. bjc has joined

  822. j.r has joined

  823. jjrh has left

  824. lnj has left

  825. jjrh has left

  826. Zash has left

  827. jjrh has left

  828. dos has left

  829. dos has joined

  830. j.r has joined

  831. Guus has left

  832. Guus has joined

  833. j.r has left

  834. j.r has joined

  835. waqas has left

  836. Guus has left

  837. Guus has joined

  838. kasper.dement has joined

  839. Guus has left

  840. Guus has joined

  841. dos has left

  842. kasper.dement has joined

  843. la|r|ma has left

  844. dos has joined

  845. nyco has left

  846. nyco has joined

  847. valo has left

  848. kasper.dement has joined

  849. jjrh has left

  850. MattJ has joined

  851. valo has joined

  852. ta has left

  853. ta has joined

  854. kasper.dement has joined

  855. la|r|ma has joined

  856. SamWhited has left

  857. j.r has joined