XSF Discussion - 2018-08-22

  1. thorsten has left
  2. thorsten has joined
  3. lorddavidiii has left
  4. lorddavidiii has joined
  5. lorddavidiii has left
  6. lskdjf has joined
  7. daniel has left
  8. lorddavidiii has joined
  9. daniel has joined
  10. apach has left
  11. Dave Cridland has left
  12. thorsten has left
  13. pep. RFC6120, 7.6.1 > Once the server has generated an XMPP resourcepart for the client, it MUST return an IQ stanza of type "result" to the client, which MUST include a <jid/> child element that specifies the full JID for the connected resource as determined by the server. From what I understand, we generally assume that the resource can be forcibly assigned by the server. Does this sentence also mean any other part of the JID can be rewritten? (localpart, domain)
  14. thorsten has joined
  15. Dave Cridland has left
  16. Dave Cridland has joined
  17. daniel has left
  18. Dave Cridland has left
  19. Dave Cridland has joined
  20. Guus has left
  21. Guus has joined
  22. MbJ3 has joined
  23. daniel has joined
  24. Guus has left
  25. Guus has joined
  26. Guus has left
  27. Guus has joined
  28. Guus has left
  29. Guus has joined
  30. mrdoctorwho has left
  31. thorsten has left
  32. thorsten has joined
  33. Dave Cridland has left
  34. Dave Cridland has joined
  35. Dave Cridland has left
  36. Dave Cridland has joined
  37. Guus has left
  38. Guus has joined
  39. moparisthebest New messenger, LAN only, https://github.com/dakhnod/Meshenger
  40. daniel has left
  41. Guus has left
  42. Chobbes has joined
  43. daniel has joined
  44. thorsten has left
  45. dos has left
  46. dos has joined
  47. thorsten has joined
  48. Steve Kille has left
  49. Steve Kille has joined
  50. peter has joined
  51. dos has left
  52. dos has joined
  53. daniel has left
  54. dos has left
  55. dos has joined
  56. Guus has joined
  57. Yagiza has joined
  58. dos has left
  59. dos has joined
  60. dos has left
  61. dos has joined
  62. dos has left
  63. dos has joined
  64. dos has left
  65. dos has joined
  66. Guus has left
  67. Guus has joined
  68. dos has left
  69. dos has joined
  70. mrdoctorwho has joined
  71. dos has left
  72. dos has joined
  73. daniel has joined
  74. dos has left
  75. dos has joined
  76. dos has left
  77. dos has joined
  78. dos has left
  79. dos has joined
  80. dos has left
  81. dos has joined
  82. dos has left
  83. dos has joined
  84. dos has left
  85. dos has joined
  86. dos has left
  87. dos has joined
  88. dos has left
  89. dos has joined
  90. dos has left
  91. dos has joined
  92. dos has left
  93. dos has joined
  94. dos has left
  95. dos has joined
  96. js has left
  97. dos has left
  98. Guus has left
  99. thorsten has left
  100. thorsten has joined
  101. Guus has joined
  102. apach has left
  103. daniel has left
  104. Guus has left
  105. Guus has joined
  106. daniel has joined
  107. daniel has left
  108. Guus has left
  109. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  110. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  111. thorsten has joined
  112. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  113. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  114. dos has joined
  115. dos has left
  116. dos has joined
  117. dos has left
  118. Guus has joined
  119. daniel has joined
  120. dos has joined
  121. dos has left
  122. dos has joined
  123. apach has left
  124. daniel has left
  125. daniel has joined
  126. dos has left
  127. dos has joined
  128. Guus has left
  129. Guus has joined
  130. Guus has left
  131. daniel has left
  132. daniel has joined
  133. moparisthebest has left
  134. moparisthebest has joined
  135. thorsten has left
  136. thorsten has joined
  137. mrdoctorwho has joined
  138. Guus has joined
  139. apach has left
  140. labdsf has left
  141. Chobbes has joined
  142. peter has left
  143. thorsten has left
  144. thorsten has joined
  145. daniel has left
  146. Dave Cridland has left
  147. Dave Cridland has joined
  148. daniel has joined
  149. thorsten has left
  150. thorsten has joined
  151. daniel has left
  152. daniel has joined
  153. Dave Cridland has left
  154. Dave Cridland has joined
  155. Dave Cridland has left
  156. Dave Cridland has joined
  157. lnj has joined
  158. thorsten has left
  159. thorsten has joined
  160. daniel has left
  161. j.r has joined
  162. daniel has joined
  163. j.r has joined
  164. Nekit has joined
  165. daniel has left
  166. j.r has joined
  167. j.r has joined
  168. thorsten has left
  169. thorsten has joined
  170. daniel has joined
  171. daniel has left
  172. daniel has joined
  173. rion has joined
  174. Guus has left
  175. j.r has joined
  176. Guus has joined
  177. moparisthebest has left
  178. 404.city has joined
  179. moparisthebest has joined
  180. j.r has joined
  181. 404.city has left
  182. 404.city has joined
  183. SamWhited has left
  184. andy has joined
  185. Valerian has joined
  186. 404.city has left
  187. lorddavidiii has left
  188. daniel has left
  189. lskdjf has joined
  190. daniel has joined
  191. l has joined
  192. Maranda pep.: I *don't think so*. Host at least has to honour the stream to attribute.
  193. jonasw pep., yes, it can
  194. daniel has left
  195. daniel has joined
  196. jonasw pep., before binding, there’s not really a JID anyway
  197. jonasw there’s just the SASL identity, and that doesn’t have to match the JID
  198. jonasw everything else (like stream @to) is just informational
  199. j.r has joined
  200. jonasw pep., there was a prosody module which would integrate with some forum software, and it would create a JID which didn’t match the SASL identity (based on the forum username) if the SASL identity contained stuff which wasn’t allowde in the JID
  201. Maranda I'd like to actually see a server that dishes out a different host in the jid than the one you opened a stream to c2s wise
  202. Maranda thinks he *won't*
  203. lorddavidiii has left
  204. jonasw the host will probably stay what the client expects it to be, indeed
  205. jonasw not that it really matters
  206. jonasw (I also confused stream @to and @from)
  207. jonasw (@to isn’t quite that informational given that it’s used for TLS already)
  208. Maranda Aaaand I need cooooffeeee ☕
  209. Zash Maranda: The hosted GTalk thing would assign you a different host IIRC
  210. Maranda Zash: Huhu, I recall it opening s2s streams with no to or from and expecting those to be set from dialback. But that one sounds more hilarious
  211. Zash On c2s tho
  212. Maranda Yeah but me think clients would tell it where they're opening a stream to in that case 😆
  213. waqas has left
  214. Zash has left
  215. j.r has joined
  216. tux has left
  217. tux has joined
  218. j.r has left
  219. j.r has joined
  220. j.r has left
  221. j.r has joined
  222. Valerian has left
  223. mikaela has joined
  224. Zash has left
  225. daniel has left
  226. daniel has joined
  227. rion has left
  228. Zash has left
  229. daniel has left
  230. daniel has joined
  231. Alex has joined
  232. Valerian has joined
  233. daniel has left
  234. daniel has joined
  235. Steve Kille has left
  236. Steve Kille has left
  237. Steve Kille has joined
  238. jubalh has joined
  239. jubalh has left
  240. mrdoctorwho has joined
  241. daniel has left
  242. 404.city has joined
  243. daniel has joined
  244. daniel has left
  245. Valerian has left
  246. Valerian has joined
  247. jubalh has joined
  248. anjan has joined
  249. jubalh has left
  250. vanitasvitae has left
  251. vanitasvitae has joined
  252. daniel has joined
  253. vanitasvitae has left
  254. goffi has joined
  255. vanitasvitae has joined
  256. Valerian has left
  257. Valerian has joined
  258. anjan has left
  259. ThibG has joined
  260. ThibG has joined
  261. apach has left
  262. mrdoctorwho has left
  263. ralphm has joined
  264. daniel has left
  265. la|r|ma has joined
  266. la|r|ma has joined
  267. la|r|ma has joined
  268. daniel has joined
  269. j.r has joined
  270. lskdjf has left
  271. anjan has joined
  272. andy has left
  273. daniel has left
  274. andy has joined
  275. lnj has left
  276. SamWhited has left
  277. lnj has joined
  278. SamWhited has joined
  279. daniel has joined
  280. lskdjf has joined
  281. lumi has joined
  282. j.r has joined
  283. Valerian has left
  284. 404.city has left
  285. lskdjf has joined
  286. thorsten has left
  287. jubalh has joined
  288. valo has joined
  289. cookie has left
  290. Dave Cridland has left
  291. lskdjf has left
  292. lskdjf has joined
  293. thorsten has joined
  294. Alex has left
  295. lskdjf has left
  296. lskdjf has joined
  297. lskdjf has left
  298. valo has joined
  299. lnj has left
  300. lskdjf has joined
  301. lnj has joined
  302. lskdjf has left
  303. cookie has joined
  304. lskdjf has left
  305. jubalh has joined
  306. Link Mauve Could that mechanism be used for JID aliases?
  307. Link Mauve As a neat upgrade mechanism when for instance a provider upgrades from example.com to example.org?
  308. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  309. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  310. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  311. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  312. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  313. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  314. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  315. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  316. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  317. 404.city has joined
  318. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  319. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  320. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  321. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  322. winfried has left
  323. winfried has left
  324. winfried has left
  325. winfried has left
  326. winfried has left
  327. thorsten has left
  328. winfried has left
  329. winfried has left
  330. thorsten has joined
  331. winfried has left
  332. winfried has left
  333. winfried has left
  334. winfried has left
  335. winfried has left
  336. winfried has left
  337. blabla has joined
  338. blabla has joined
  339. lnj has left
  340. lnj has joined
  341. jonasw has left
  342. jonasw has joined
  343. 404.city has left
  344. thorsten has left
  345. thorsten has joined
  346. winfried has joined
  347. Valerian has joined
  348. Maranda Wasn't there some 301 xmpp version proposal as opposed to that?
  349. jonasw Link Mauve, the main issue with changing domains isn’t the local, but the remote side
  350. Maranda Or rather make that "a xmpp version of status code 301"
  351. Maranda coughs lingua matrix failure 😞
  352. Link Mauve jonasw, sure, but when you did migrate your domain (I remember pep. having to do that), it makes it transparent for your users.
  353. jonasw Link Mauve, how is it going to be transparent when all the remote roster entries are borked?
  354. pep. Yeah, at least you don't have to have a flag day
  355. Link Mauve In a company, where you are already using shared groups and mostly communicating locally, it does make sense.
  356. jonasw right
  357. jonasw Link Mauve, rewriting the bare JID could be a helper, but I think there’s a stream error for it
  358. pep. You will indeed still need that flag day when actually switching the actual account
  359. Maranda thinks something like "Resource Moved Permanently" is far more trasparent and less clunky
  360. Maranda Than tellin' someone his jid magically changed when he/she binds a resource...
  361. jubalh has joined
  362. jubalh has left
  363. Alex has joined
  364. pep. What I meant above would have been the opposite really. "you can use your new _credentials_, but for now it'll still bind to the same old jid"
  365. lnj has left
  366. lnj has joined
  367. Maranda I'm pretty sure at least 95% of the clients out there would start coughing blood if there's a change to either the node or the host portion of a jid they don't expect anyways
  368. ralphm When I was working on XMPP (PubSub) based federation for social networking sites, we had full movability of objects. Something would move to a different site and we'd send a node deletion notification with <redirect/> element pointing to the new place.
  369. pep. It's not like it was explicitely forbidden, nor really specified by the RFC either. Send an errata?
  370. ralphm You can do something similar with the "gone" stanza error. It also has a way to specify the new location by putting a URI in the element.
  371. ralphm If somebody retrieves his roster, the server will send out presence probes. If the remote server responds with "gone" it could rewrite the roster item.
  372. jubalh has joined
  373. pep. also <moved/>
  374. jubalh has left
  375. ralphm There's no <moved/> stanza error
  376. daniel Conversations will happily change the jid and use that for subsequent logins. Which in turn can be a problem some times. For example OpenFire will let you specify a jid like username@ip and on bind it gets changed to username@domain but domain won't resolve properly
  377. pep. -xep moved
  378. pep. bunneh!!
  379. Maranda ralphm: that's for far better than what mentioned by others ☺️
  380. pep. https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0283.html
  381. Maranda That's for sure*
  382. pep. But I don't like the bits in the security considerations, that defeats the point of the XEP
  383. Maranda Damn auto correction
  384. daniel Or they are other weird and broken servers that use something like email@domain to login and then change the jid on bind to username@domain. And then subsequent logins don't work
  385. pep. And I don't think it's much of an issue
  386. thorsten has joined
  387. ralphm Maranda: thanks, there's a reason this stuff is there to begin with :-D
  388. jubalh has joined
  389. ralphm pep.: ah yeah, I forgot about that one. I don't think (now) that this XEP is needed. What does it do better than "gone"?
  390. Maranda thinks he tried to desperately mention "301", "Moved Permanently" keywords for a few minutes to no avail also 😆🤸‍♂️
  391. Maranda 🤷‍♂️
  392. Chobbes has joined
  393. pep. ralphm, with <gone/> you need to keep track of what's gone where. With moved it's a client thing, the account can be tombstoned or deleted
  394. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  395. pep. Only works for roster though
  396. thorsten has joined
  397. ralphm yeah
  398. apach has left
  399. MbJ3 has left
  400. MbJ3 has joined
  401. thorsten has joined
  402. Valerian has left
  403. Zash has left
  404. mikaela has left
  405. lnj has left
  406. mikaela has joined
  407. lnj has joined
  408. lskdjf has left
  409. l has left
  410. l has joined
  411. lskdjf has joined
  412. Zash has left
  413. lskdjf has left
  414. lskdjf has joined
  415. UsL has joined
  416. daniel has left
  417. Syndace has left
  418. Syndace has joined
  419. Alex has left
  420. MbJ3 has left
  421. MbJ3 has joined
  422. Alex has joined
  423. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  424. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  425. 404.city has joined
  426. efrit has joined
  427. vanitasvitae has left
  428. thorsten has left
  429. andy has left
  430. daniel has left
  431. daniel has joined
  432. peter has joined
  433. peter has left
  434. rion has left
  435. andy has joined
  436. Valerian has joined
  437. efrit has left
  438. Chobbes has joined
  439. Valerian has left
  440. j.r has joined
  441. Kev has left
  442. Valerian has joined
  443. blabla has joined
  444. Valerian has left
  445. j.r has left
  446. j.r has joined
  447. peter has joined
  448. Kev has left
  449. blabla has joined
  450. moparisthebest has left
  451. mimi89999 has joined
  452. mimi89999 has joined
  453. Kev has left
  454. daniel has left
  455. daniel has joined
  456. j.r has left
  457. j.r has joined
  458. Valerian has joined
  459. Guus has left
  460. j.r has left
  461. j.r has joined
  462. peter has left
  463. ThibG has joined
  464. ThibG has joined
  465. andy has left
  466. blabla has joined
  467. waqas has joined
  468. Kev has joined
  469. Steve Kille has left
  470. Steve Kille has left
  471. Steve Kille has joined
  472. Valerian has left
  473. dos has left
  474. dos has joined
  475. dos has left
  476. dos has joined
  477. Valerian has joined
  478. j.r has joined
  479. jubalh has left
  480. dos has left
  481. dos has joined
  482. Tobias has joined
  483. MbJ3 has left
  484. dos has left
  485. dos has joined
  486. Alex has left
  487. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  488. dos has left
  489. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  490. dos has joined
  491. Valerian has left
  492. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  493. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  494. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  495. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  496. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  497. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  498. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  499. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  500. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  501. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  502. dos has left
  503. lovetox has joined
  504. dos has joined
  505. jjrh has left
  506. la|r|ma has joined
  507. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  508. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  509. waqas has left
  510. jjrh has left
  511. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  512. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  513. dos has left
  514. dos has joined
  515. Valerian has joined
  516. daniel has left
  517. marc has joined
  518. waqas has joined
  519. mikaela has left
  520. mikaela has joined
  521. la|r|ma has joined
  522. la|r|ma has joined
  523. la|r|ma has joined
  524. Maranda has left
  525. Valerian has left
  526. jjrh has left
  527. Valerian has joined
  528. jjrh has left
  529. Kev has left
  530. Valerian has left
  531. Valerian has joined
  532. Valerian has left
  533. Valerian has joined
  534. Valerian has left
  535. Valerian has joined
  536. Valerian has left
  537. Valerian has joined
  538. jjrh has left
  539. Valerian has left
  540. Valerian has joined
  541. Valerian has left
  542. j.r has joined
  543. goffi has left
  544. Martin has joined
  545. marc has left
  546. 404.city has left
  547. marc has joined
  548. Valerian has joined
  549. j.r has joined
  550. Martin has joined
  551. daniel has joined
  552. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  553. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  554. jubalh has joined
  555. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  556. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  557. ThibG has left
  558. Dave Cridland has left
  559. Dave Cridland has joined
  560. Dave Cridland has left
  561. Dave Cridland has joined
  562. Valerian has left
  563. Valerian has joined
  564. Valerian has left
  565. Valerian has joined
  566. Valerian has left
  567. Valerian has joined
  568. Valerian has left
  569. Valerian has joined
  570. Valerian has left
  571. Valerian has joined
  572. Zash has left
  573. SamWhited has left
  574. Valerian has left
  575. Valerian has joined
  576. Valerian has left
  577. j.r has joined
  578. Kev has joined
  579. Kev has left
  580. SamWhited has left
  581. j.r has joined
  582. j.r has joined
  583. dos has left
  584. dos has joined
  585. Zash has left
  586. thorsten has joined
  587. Seve/SouL has joined
  588. Seve/SouL has joined
  589. Nekit has left
  590. Nekit has joined
  591. ThibG has joined
  592. Zash has left
  593. Ge0rG has left
  594. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  595. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  596. lorddavidiii has left
  597. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  598. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  599. bjc has joined
  600. Yagiza has left
  601. lorddavidiii has left
  602. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  603. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  604. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  605. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  606. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  607. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  608. Zash has left
  609. Zash has left
  610. Zash has joined
  611. Zash has left
  612. Zash has joined
  613. Chobbes has joined
  614. Chobbes has joined
  615. lorddavidiii has left
  616. winfried has left
  617. Tobias has left
  618. jubalh has joined
  619. Andrew Nenakhov has left
  620. Andrew Nenakhov has joined
  621. dos has left
  622. dos has joined
  623. lorddavidiii has left
  624. karp has joined
  625. lorddavidiii has left
  626. dos has left
  627. dos has joined
  628. lskdjf has left
  629. waqas has left
  630. Dave Cridland has left
  631. Dave Cridland has joined
  632. Dave Cridland has left
  633. Dave Cridland has joined
  634. waqas has joined
  635. dos has left
  636. dos has joined
  637. dos has left
  638. lorddavidiii has left
  639. dos has joined
  640. dos has left
  641. dos has joined
  642. Nekit has joined
  643. lorddavidiii has left
  644. dos has left
  645. pep. has left
  646. Dave Cridland has left
  647. Dave Cridland has joined
  648. Dave Cridland has left
  649. Dave Cridland has joined
  650. Dave Cridland has left
  651. Dave Cridland has joined
  652. Dave Cridland has left
  653. Dave Cridland has joined
  654. lskdjf has left
  655. dos has joined
  656. ralphm has left
  657. dos has left
  658. thorsten has left
  659. thorsten has joined
  660. dos has joined
  661. anjan has joined
  662. dos has left
  663. dos has joined
  664. dos has left
  665. dos has joined
  666. dos has left
  667. dos has joined
  668. dos has left
  669. dos has joined
  670. dos has left
  671. dos has joined
  672. la|r|ma has left
  673. MbJ3 has left
  674. Alex has joined
  675. lskdjf has joined
  676. ThibG has left
  677. ThibG has joined
  678. lorddavidiii has left
  679. Dave Cridland has left
  680. Dave Cridland has joined
  681. Dave Cridland has left
  682. Dave Cridland has joined
  683. lorddavidiii has left
  684. rion has left
  685. jubalh has joined
  686. tux has left
  687. bjc has left
  688. lumi has left
  689. lumi has joined
  690. lumi has left
  691. lorddavidiii has left
  692. blabla has joined
  693. marc has left
  694. lnj has left
  695. rion has left
  696. la|r|ma has joined
  697. la|r|ma has joined
  698. la|r|ma has joined
  699. jubalh has joined
  700. blabla has joined
  701. j.r has joined
  702. blabla has left
  703. j.r has joined
  704. blabla has joined
  705. Guus has left
  706. mimi89999 has joined
  707. j.r has joined
  708. j.r has joined
  709. Zash has left
  710. Maranda has left
  711. Dave Cridland has left
  712. Dave Cridland has joined
  713. Dave Cridland has left
  714. Dave Cridland has joined
  715. moparisthebest has joined
  716. Syndace has left
  717. Syndace has joined
  718. Dave Cridland has left
  719. Dave Cridland has joined
  720. Dave Cridland has left
  721. rion has left
  722. Dave Cridland has joined
  723. vanitasvitae has left
  724. vanitasvitae has joined
  725. Ge0rG has joined
  726. lovetox has left
  727. rion has left
  728. mikaela has joined
  729. moparisthebest has joined
  730. moparisthebest has joined
  731. Syndace has left
  732. Syndace has joined
  733. j.r has joined
  734. thorsten has left
  735. thorsten has joined
  736. j.r has joined
  737. j.r has left
  738. j.r has joined
  739. mikaela has left
  740. dos has left
  741. dos has joined
  742. anjan has left
  743. j.r has joined
  744. j.r has joined
  745. Dave Cridland has left
  746. Dave Cridland has joined
  747. Dave Cridland has left
  748. Dave Cridland has joined
  749. peter has joined
  750. moparisthebest has joined
  751. moparisthebest has joined
  752. SamWhited has left
  753. peter has left
  754. Dave Cridland has left
  755. Dave Cridland has joined
  756. Dave Cridland has left
  757. Dave Cridland has joined
  758. Alex has left
  759. MattJ has joined
  760. Dave Cridland has left
  761. Dave Cridland has joined
  762. Dave Cridland has left
  763. Dave Cridland has left
  764. Steve Kille has left
  765. dos has left
  766. dos has joined
  767. MbJ3 has joined
  768. l has left
  769. l has joined
  770. Dave Cridland has left
  771. Dave Cridland has joined