moparisthebest: https://blog.cloudflare.com/esni/
> As ISPs increasingly acquire media companies and ad targeting businesses, being able to mine the data flowing through their pipes is an increasingly attractive business for them and an increasingly troubling privacy threat to all of us.
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jonas’
nice
jonas’
nobody had time to look into the website apparently
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jonas’
I’m back on it, I have a hunch what might have happened
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jonas’
I think I have a hotfix, waiting for the build to prove me either right or wrong :)
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jonas’
bear, can you please confirm that the content somebody reported missing is back?
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edhelas
hi everyone, I've posted a messages on standards a couple of days ago and I'd like some feedback before I start my work on he adjustements :) https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/standards/2018-September/035361.html
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moparisthebest
ugh Ge0rG , not the RFC I was following, it mentions that one of it's hard requirements was 'do not stick out' so they just... decided to stick out anyway...
moparisthebest
still, they are correct if all the browsers support this, it'll no longer stick out
Ge0rG
moparisthebest: it looks like you are responding to a different point than the one I made, but this is okay.
moparisthebest
the other downside is the other RFC draft encrypted *all* extensions, so ALPN etc was free
moparisthebest
ah well I agree with that Ge0rG , but if anything this proves what I said, encryption is the answer, not legislation
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Ge0rG
moparisthebest: you can't encrypt all the things. And if you try, governments will mandate backdoors
moparisthebest
I disagree, I think you certainly can encrypt all the things
moparisthebest
and, only bad governments, plus, they are already mandating backdoors aren't they?
Zash
Encryption does not exist in a vacuum.
Ge0rG
https://www.caliopen.org/en/
> Privacy for all of your online correspondance. Caliopen collects in a single interface private messages from mobile apps (Twitter, Facebook), email, instant messaging, texts…
I can't even...
Ge0rG
moparisthebest: bad governments like the US of A?
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moparisthebest
so far USA hasn't mandated backdoors, only requested them
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moparisthebest
USA seems to have by far the best 'free speech' protections, which also relates to encryption, so hopefully it will be fine
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edhelas
Ge0rG that is the project from Laurent Chemla :p
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flow
edhelas, who is Laurent Chemla?
edhelas
one of the founder of Gandi https://www.gandi.net/en https://twitter.com/laurentchemla
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flow
I see
edhelas
but yeah Caliopen looks weird to me
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Ge0rG
edhelas: they plugged into the WA E2EE thread at https://twitter.com/alexstamos/status/1045045964245950465 and I wondered about their mystical "E2E with business model" pitch, just to land on _that_ page
nyco: my client lost the tab in which I was one-on-one chatting with you
Guus
dind't get the last two lines I think
ralphm
Guus: no MAM?
nyco
I've been omemo'ed
MattJ
Hey
Guus
ralphm: I can't see his contact / tab
ralphm
Ok. Let's go
nyco
no, it's just that azxoraeiczhtrneipvhscrgxueygbuazeyogvxofbouezgxouyewrb
Guus
nyco, ok
ralphm
Any particular agenda items?
nyco
https://trello.com/b/Dn6IQOu0/board-meetings
nyco
prios and executive?
nyco
ongoing topics, I think
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Guus
is there any more for us to do with 'prios' ?
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Guus
(I have no other agenda items)
MattJ
I have none either
nyco
we should agree? reach a consensus?
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ralphm
1. Priorities
ralphm
Ok. So I think the order as nyco wrote it on trello can be improved
nyco
yep, the card is too ra
nyco
raw
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ralphm
As I said last week, I think the item listed as 2. Organisation is our primary priority
ralphm
(as Board)
ralphm
Because that's basically what any Board should do
nyco
bureaucracy, funding: these are the keywords
MattJ
I'd s/priority/responsibility/ I think for clarity
ralphm
sure
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Guus
unsure if we need to split hairs about which of these four topics needs to have highest priority. Can't we just word them nicely, and deliver them as "these are what we believe to be the most high-prio issues"?
Developer/Operator Community (14) => sprints/hackathons
=> that's for software developers, not the XSF, right?
nyco
Organisation (9) => bureaucracy, funding
=> that's for the XSF, especially the Board, correct?
nyco
Protocol (9) => modernization
=> that's for the Council, ok?
nyco
Promotion (8) => usecases/showcases
=> that's for SCAM, isn't it?
nyco
so I guess we (the Board) need to discuss bureaucracy and funding
ralphm
* Generic Board responsibilities.
* Ensure our protocol standardization efforts through Council and Editors
* Support community efforts related to XMPP
* Support SCAM
Guus
nyco, I think you're right - but I do interpret this as "the board should put emphasis on enabling these work teams to do (all of the above)."
MattJ
nyco, I'd agree with that, noting that a number of things fall under the "developer/operator community" topic (e.g. enabling hackathons and other events through SCAM)
nyco
for bureaucracy, I don't clearly understand the problem, thus I am not able to propose solutions
Guus
I think we're agreeing a lot with each-other here
ralphm
This is basically ensuring we have elections for members and board, council
ralphm
liason with other standards bodies
ralphm
and generally be organized as a corporation
nyco
for funding, here is my thought, raw once again, sharing at early stage, please comment:
some software projects need money, we (Board) can help them setup Patreon pages for example
and though SCAM we can promote those campaigns, still respecting our "weak neutrality" (as I call it)
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nyco
anyway, we should not contemplate the problem that has been revealed
we should take some action, and think outcome
doing "not perfect" is acceptable
ralphm
I 'm not sure we should do Patreon or similar, unless we as a foundation need something developed, like a standards compliance testing suite.
nyco
staying still is not wishable
nyco
ah good point
nyco
compliance suite could be funded by donations
nyco
that could be under the responsibility of the XSF
nyco
I was talking about software projects, which the XSF does not support directly
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ralphm
I don't the XSF should be involved in helping, say, Prosody acquire funds.
Guus
we can facilitate a knowledge-base that explains how, as an xmpp project, one could acquire funding.
nyco
that
nyco
what to do, what to expect
ralphm
sure, that's ok
nyco
we can collect people's experience
nyco
s
ralphm
If somebody wants to pick that up
Guus
well, we're drafting recommendations for the next board, right? 🙂
nyco
well, I can start seomthing, come back to the Board, we decide if stop or continue...
ralphm
But if we have to chose between efforts, we probably could do some work on our own funding
ralphm
choose
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nyco
we would not choose, just tell them how others do
Guus
yes - I neglected following up with Peter for to long on that - apologies.
nyco
so, getting back to our own funding: what do we need money for?
ralphm
I mean that we have limited time, as Board, and I think our own continued funding should have priority
MattJ
There's what we use money for now, and there's what we could do with a reliable source of funds
ralphm
Well, if we want to continue having things like Summits, those cost money
nyco
well, first the sponsoring, right?
Guus
we have some recurring costs, but I think having funds to spend could enable us to do more than what we currently do.
ralphm
and they way we've dealt with sponsoring in the past has been less than optimal
ralphm
Guus: this
nyco
a source of fund can be temporary, like a crowdfunding campaign
Patreon and the likes are more split across time
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nyco
more predictible and repetitive, but lower amounts
nyco
sponsoring less that optimal: why? what's the problem?
I think I heard we have not been the best at following up, that's right?
MattJ
Pretty much - to the point where we don't know who our current sponsors actually are
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nyco
so, trying to summarize: we talked about funding but not bureaucracy
in funding, we talked about sponsoring (repetitive, predictible, but need manpower)
ask for more sponsoring, or better follow up?
we could engage the process of developing the comp suite ?
MattJ
and we have had pledges for sponsoring e.g. the Brussels dinner and not collected money from those sponsors for two years running (at least)
nyco
argh
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ralphm
"bureaucrazy" doesn't necessarily need a plan right now, other than maybe figuring out if we want to continue having an Executive Director, and what role they should have.
ralphm
But indeed, we probably need a single person handing all things around sponsoring
nyco
that's 2. in our agenda today?
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Guus
Doorbell, afk
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ralphm
nyco: time permitting
nyco
ok, chicken and egg
what if hire someone? an admin role, not like in sysadmin/devops, but admin like legal and money
that way we could collect the real money, seriously, with proper tracking
this way we could pay that person
logic? ;-)
ralphm
But to me the biggest question on preparing for FOSDEM/Summit in 2019 is: which one person will take that on *and* follow through on all the things.
nyco
SCAM? not the Board?
MattJ
nyco, I actually wouldn't be opposed to that idea
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MattJ
nyco, SCAM is allocated a budget and spends it - it not directly involved in the sponsorship part
nyco
yep
Guus
back
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Guus
and yes, that's for SCAM. And for board to follow up on with SCAM, if they don't act appropriately
nyco
hummm, do we have an organizational chat of the XSF?
nyco
sorry, out of context
Guus
as the WT leader of SCAM, I expect to be scolded 🙂
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MattJ
nyco, you mean like this MUC? :)
Guus
(I'm currently moving house - planning to take up FOSDEM next week)
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nyco
MattJ ;-)
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ralphm
I'm ok with SCAM handling that, but then I want a single person in SCAM to be appointed for it. Of course the same problem of course exists for the generic sponsoring efforts of the XSF. If we say this is the Treasurers responsibility, then we need to make sure that we clean up the site and follow up on acquiring new sponsors with him.
nyco
hiring someone could help, lot of work though
crowdfunding could help as well, but what for?
Guus
Ralph, we'll pick someone from within SCAM to take point.
ralphm
Guus: 💪
Guus
as for Treasurer: I'd be ok with that, providing that the Treasurer is.
nyco
it is all getting back to this: the XSF is in survival mode
we (individuals) do not invest and commit enough time&work to maintain it properly
Guus
maybe plan a sit-down with Peter?
ralphm
Guus: let's do that. You, Peter, and me?
Guus
ralphm: works for me, I'm open for other to attend, but maybe not swamp him?
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Guus
nyco: I don't quite agree with 'survival' mode - there's more potential, but I think we're not doing _that_ bad.
ralphm
nyco: I don't think I agree with that statement. I think the core of what we need to do – be a standards org – is going well.
nyco
not being updated regarding sponsoring pretty much sucks... sorry for the vocab
nyco
it may be harsh, but it is a reality
Guus
nyco, true, but still, we're processing XEPs.
Guus
I agree that we could do _more_
nyco
good, the Council does, not the Board
Guus
but we're not "almost dead"
ralphm
I think we all agree our sponsoring situation is not good.
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nyco
the Board is not very commited, I have to say...
nyco
the engagement is low
nyco
I'm guility of it
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Guus
This is a good time for me to point out that we're out of time for this week 😃 (sorry, but I'm pressed for time)