Would it be a good idea to include contact addresses (xep 157) in stream features?
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jonas’
I wonder if we s houldn’t just put the entire disco#info result in stream features.
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Guus
Feels like over optimization to me, adding contact addresses there.✎
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Zash
How would you find contact addresses without an XMPP account then?
Zash
Or in my specific case where I've blocked a bunch of servers and I don't wanna unblock them and drown in spam to see if they have contact addresses.
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flow
Zash, by sending an IQ?
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Zash
flow: Not without an XMPP account
flow
then whatever IBR does
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Zash
Custom stream element that happens to look like an IQ stanza, but really isn't?
flow
hmm, I could be wrong, but it appears to send IQs without an xmpp acount
Zash
No it's not!
Zash
That stuff just looks like IQs for historical reasons. They aren't really.
flow
care to elaborate why they aren't really?
Zash
Because nothing before a resource is bound are stanzas.
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Holger
Zash: 6120 says:
> The client could exchange stanzas with the server itself or the client's account before binding a resource since the full JID is needed only for addressing outside the context of the stream negotiated between the client and the server, but this is not commonly done.
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flow
Zash, first time I've heard that
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Zash
I don't think you should be able to send stanzas before "Completion of Stream Negotiation"
Zash
Prosody treats anything before resource binding as stream elements
Zash
Ie if there isn't something explicitly handling it, you get stream:error'd and disconnected
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Zash
Holger: That's not how it works in Prosody.
dwd
Zash, Presumably anything that isn't handled after resource binding is also stream:error'd...?
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Zash
resource binding enables special handling of the "jabber:client" namespace, so, yeah.
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Zash
Along with all the various source address sanity checking that just doesn't exist before that.
Alex announced board and council elections a couple of weeks ago. So far, only one person (me) has announced candidacy. We need to spread the word and ask people to stand.
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ralphm
For Board, if any one else on Board right now wants to reapply, please add yourself to the wiki, like Guus
ralphm
If you know of someone you'd like to see on Board, please talk to them yourself.
MattJ
I probably shall, I guess... just been a bit busy the past few weeks
nyco
ralphm please apply!
ralphm
I'll also ask Council (via dwd) to consider if its current members want to run again.
ralphm
nyco: I'll reapply.
dwd
That came up last meeting.
dwd
(Raised by Ge0rG)
dwd
It might be worth raising this on members@, and also I'd encourage people to "tap" those they think would be good to encourage them to stand.
Guus
Shall we raise awareness via twitter too
Guus
?
Guus
Alex did raise this in members@, btw
ralphm
Well, if we want to attract people from outside the Membership, I'm not opposed, but I'd rather contact people ourselves than an open invitation.
nyco
members are on the ML and the MUCs, not sure we'll get candidates on Twitter, but we'll surely be transparent here, and talk about XMPP, which is good (not bad)
MattJ
I don't personally have anyone in mind who isn't already a member
ralphm
nyco: there is a difference between transparency ("We are having elections") and an open invitation ("We are having elections, and please sign up to be on Board"), IMO.
nyco
right
ralphm
That was my only point, really.
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ralphm
I'll write another e-mail to Members
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Seve
Thinking on adding the "We are having elections" to our newsletter, would it be interesting?
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Guus
I don't think it'd hurt, Seve.
ralphm
Indeed.
Guus
Go for it. Thanks for thinking of it.
nyco
I'm adding that right away
ralphm
Anything else on this?
Guus
not from me
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ralphm
2. FOSDEM
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ralphm
Devroom prep is ongoing. The RfP is coming soon.
ralphm
I'll put in the request for the Lounge, too.
Guus
I am planning (SCAM-hat on) to work on this (incl. summit, dinner) next week.
ralphm
And propose we reserve the Thursday/Friday for the Summit, in whichever form SCAM comes up with.
Guus
Also, while you're here Seve, I'd love for you to get involved with some on the ideas you offered last year.
Guus
</SCAM-hat>
Guus
ralphm: I assumed that was a given.
Guus
(the dates)
ralphm
Just making sure
Guus
kk
ralphm
3. OAB?
nyco
not for me
Guus
We need to sit with Peter
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Guus
Ralph & me
Guus
other than that, no
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MattJ
None here
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Guus
oh, when does DST changes kick in?
Guus
it's the same for everyone in this board, I think?
Guus
In which case it doesn't matter much...
ralphm
Guus: ack
Guus
I'm assuming we'll keep doing meetings at the same local time, not UTC.
ralphm
DST in the EU ends on 28
ralphm
Guus: yes
ralphm
US has already switched
Guus
good for me to think of it _beforehand_ for once 🙂
“20:20:09 SamWhited> Back to the wiki: is OX XEP-0374? It doesn't appear to have been worked on in a while, is it worth including? Are there many implementations?”, Gajim at least.
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Link Mauve
“21:56:11 Zash> I fear this confusion will eventually lead someone to use a generic markdown library (with html passthrough enabled by default) and then the sky falls.”, someone just did for Converse, fyi.
Zash
Link Mauve: Which was why I wrote that
Zash
Tho I wasn't fully aware that they actually had used one by that time
Zash
Just that they were calling it markdown
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Link Mauve
They used a full-blown Markdown-including-HTML library there.
Link Mauve
So to get back to the XHTML-IM discussions, you can’t win against stupid.
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Yagiza
Link Mauve, someone said XHTML-IM?
SamWhited
So they were trying to implement 0393, or they were doing their own markdown thing?
Link Mauve
SamWhited, they thought that implementing Markdown would give them 0393.
SamWhited
*facepalm* okay, fair enough, maybe my assumption that anyone would notice that it didn't actually work was naive.
SamWhited
But I guess no one actually reads the spec *or* looks at examples.
moparisthebest
you know JS devs, never write 3 lines of code if you can import 43 npm packages to do it for you instead
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Zash
SamWhited: They strongly insinted that it was in fact another flavor like Github Flavored Markdown
jonas’
I can’t say I’m surprised.
SamWhited
WhatsApp flavored Markdown!
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SamWhited
HTML is W3C flavored markdown!
Zash
True fact
SamWhited
Or WHATWG flavored markdown, I guess
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Kev
Everything is proceeding as I have forseen.
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Zash
> If you strike me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
-- XHTML-IM probably
Link Mauve
Kev, same. :(
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jonas’
a good reason for '157 in stream features is that you have a way to contact an operator you cannot reach otherwise due to s2s issues.
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jonas’
ah no
jonas’
or maybe
Zash
I was thinking account registration problems and such
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jonas’
that, too
Zash
Tho in the end there's the xmpp mailbox ( https://xmpp.org/rfcs/rfc6120.html#contact ) one can try, or one of {post,host,foo}master
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jonas’
hm, indeed
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Link Mauve
Zash, the vast majority of the operators I’ve encountered don’t have this mailbox.
Link Mauve
Operators generally don’t do what their server doesn’t require them to do.
Zash
make more noise about it
Link Mauve
Where?
Zash
Somewhere
Link Mauve
There is no way to automatedly check for that even, so no green checkmark race. :(
Zash
We've got this at least https://prosody.im/doc/public_servers#contact
Zash
Link Mauve: Email a thing and see if it gets delivered
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Link Mauve
Zash, sorry, I won’t spam every single XMPP operator there is.
jonas’
and ironically, you’re only spamming those who’re doing it right :(
Link Mauve
Yup.
Zash
If they're unreachable, get them blacklisted somewhere
Zash
Public shaming!
Link Mauve
I’d expect that to cover 95+% (and I’m generous) of the XMPP services.