Dave raised a point about XEP-0412, so that's on the agenda.
Seveis here
nyco
it's even in Trello board
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Guus
I have nothing else for the agenda
MattJ
Me neither
nyco
prios?
nyco
the former board handed it over
ralphm
I don't think they did.
ralphm
But I see you added it as a card, so it is on the agenda
MattJ
Useless bunch
ralphm
1. Note taker
ralphm
dwd around?
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ralphm
Guess not.
ralphm
Continuing as we have a bunch of items.
ralphm
2. XEP-0412, Compliance Suites 2019
ralphm
I agree with Guus' comments on the board list: let's create a place holder for this XEP until such time it is clear what the Council decides.
ralphm
Probably similar to what was done for XEP-0028.
Guus
As I've replied on the board list (which is not publicly accessible, so let me repeat: I'm against keeping a XEP that was prematurely published around.
nyco
Guus's words make sense, indeed
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MattJ
wfm
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ralphm
jonas’: can you take care of this?
Guus
for the record:
My main argument is that third parties might take the fact that it is published as a reason to start work based on it. As long as there's a chance that the XEP will be revoked/unpublished, we should take steps to avoid people from spending resources on something that we're not sure of yet.
nyco
the probability that it happens again is non-zero
so let's revert like code can be in a repo
Guus
Second, I don't like how this can be perceived as putting pressure on council members that yet need to vote. A veto now will cause more issues (having to retract the XEP), which takes away from the freedom of choice of these council members. I'm sure that Kev can hold its own, but lets not create a precedent here. We can prevent this by rolling back before the remaining council members cast their vote.
Guus
ralphm I don't think jonas’ has access to that mailing list
Guus
so he would not have seen my response.
Guus
or suggestion to fix
nyco
the pressure might be already felt, by mistake of course
ralphm
nyco: the problem is that the number was given out, and if there's going to be any XEP for this, it should be the one for compliance suites, or a tombstone.
ralphm
Guus: I just wrote the fix above: like XEP-0028
nyco
that's only a technical workaround
Guus
I'm not sure what happened with XEP-0028, ralphm
ralphm
I'm happy to link it here: https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0028.html
Guus
ah, ok, that never got replaced/restored, but is retracted 🙂
ralphm
I'm not sure if it should be removed from source control, though. Just adding a new commit with a notice like this should suffice.
Guus
yeah, something similar would work.
nyco
XEP-0028: No Such XEP
XEP-0412: No More Such XEP
XEP-0412: Like XEP-0028
ralphm
I'm sure the Editor Team can resolve this.
nyco
yep, not our duty
Guus
The Editor Team being just jonas’ nowadays?
ralphm
nyco: instructing them what to do in this case is, so we just did.
ralphm
Guus: no, but he added this particular commit
Guus
who else is editor? Sam's membership expired.
Guus
https://xmpp.org/about/xsf/editor-team <-- ah, a bunch
ralphm
I don't think think so, work teams don't have an expiry, I think.
nyco
there is a card "Call for editors" in our Trello board
Guus
can non-members be part of a work team?
Seve
When taking back the CommTeam, only members were accepted
ralphm
Guus: no
ralphm
“Participation in Teams shall be limited to elected Members of the Corporation.”
Guus
So, Sam's out, to my disappointment.
ralphm
Ah.
ralphm
Good point
ralphm
moving on
ralphm
3. Compliance Suites (again)
ralphm
This point is about the discussion we had last week, regarding badges
ralphm
Dave suggested, on list, something that was also mention in the meeting:
ralphm
“So I suggest we run an Experiment. This experiment would have some badges that developers can claim on their projects, fully self-certified (ie, we do not attempt to create a compliance suite). The Badges themselves - the images used - would remain copyright XSF - I don't think we need the full weight of trademark law. We agree to revisit the scheme in 6 months and assess how it's being used.”
ralphm
I'd like to put this up for a vote.
MattJ
wfm
ralphm
+1
MattJ
+1
nyco
yep, plus one
nyco
try and iterate, I like that
Guus
"ie, we do not attempt to create a compliance suite" <-- that does not relate to the XEP, but instead to an automated verification tool, right?
ralphm
yes
nyco
we'll see what we make of it
Guus
+1
nyco
given the experience and feedback
ralphm
Seve?
Seve
Not sure yet, honestly, it is a bit abstract, but I like to try and iterate as nyco said
ralphm
is that a +0?
Seve
I'm +0
ralphm
Ok
Seve
Yes, thanks ralphm
nyco
or -0 ?
ralphm
Motion carries.
Guus
I've added a trello card on a backburner list, for us to remember to evaluate this in +6M
ralphm
I'll discuss with dwd how to move forward to actually have images that represent a badge.
ralphm
Guus: thanks
ralphm
4. Call for Editors
Guus
do we need to facilitate the badges being created?
nyco
I have a graphic designer who may help us
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ralphm
if someone volunteers to create such badges, that's be great
ralphm
'd
Guus
nyco if he'd be interested, that would be great
Guus
could you ping him?
nyco
she
Guus
her
nyco
I'm on it
ralphm
Cool
Guus
thanks
ralphm
Now, onto #4
ralphm
So this was raised by Dave on list
ralphm
But I suggested that Council should issue this call, as they actually appoint candidates.
Guus
(I didn't see Dave's mail)
ralphm
or really, they select them and we appoint
Guus
Our website lists 6 editors, one of which is Sam. We furher have Kev, PSA, Jonas', Flow and JCBrand
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ralphm
Mail from 2018-12-12, included this:
ralphm
“>
> 1) XSF Editor - this team needs more members. Could you put out a call? (I meant to ask last week, actually).
Given your charter, with the XMPP Council selecting volunteers and presenting them to the Board for approval, I believe it would be proper for you to put out the call to our membership. ”
ralphm
(the latter is my reply)
ralphm
Dave agreed and would.
Guus
I'm happy for either to issue that call.
ralphm
So I think this item is handled.
ralphm
5. GSoC
Guus
I sent a request for help to the mailing list, but did not get any response
ralphm
We put out a request for an admin. Have we gotten candidates yet?
ralphm
ok
ralphm
Keeping this one on.
ralphm
Let's nudge in the new year
Guus
let's not keep it to long though
Guus
strive to decide one way or the other mid january?
ralphm
Guus: agreed
nyco
yep
ralphm
6. Summit / FOSDEM
ralphm
I don't have anything to report.
Guus
nor me.
nyco
me neither
ralphm
7. Meeting with Peter
nyco
ah
ralphm
Still pending.
nyco
😢
ralphm
8. Board Priorities
ralphm
nyco says this was carried over.
nyco
so this is a subject that the former board has passed on, like a hot potatoe
do we want to commit to prios? or we drop it? (or any other option?)
Guus
given the ineffectiveness of last board on this (them slackers!), I wonder if this has any practical use.
nyco
I have the feeling that the board resolves issues as they arrive
we may bot have common, shared, larger goals
MattJ
I think in general the board's role here is to enable most of these things to happen
MattJ
We established SCAM for meetups, for example, and I think that's going well
ralphmnods
MattJ
The main thing blocking many other priorities is funding
Guus
Sure, we need to do stuff (c)(r), but do we need a defined list of priorities for that to happen?
MattJ
which is something we are focusing on
nyco
MattJ and time
MattJ
so I don't have any problems with the board's current tasks
MattJ
i.e. setting a priority is fine, but it has to translate to action items. What are those?
MattJ
This was my problem with all the previous discussions about priorities
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nyco
correct: prios > actions
do we want to support that train of thoughts?
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MattJ
Sure
ralphm
So we continue as we have.
ralphm
wfm
MattJ
My #1 priority is fixing our funding problems
ralphm
Agreed
nyco
how? what actions have (expected) impact?
nyco
I guess fixing the following up with sponsors would be a great start, and a big effort
nyco
XSF sponsorship AND Summit's
MattJ
We have totally failed at dealing with our sponsors for the past few years (at least). ralphm and Guus are working towards fixing that (with help from stpeter)
ralphm
Well, we need to clean up our list of sponsors, assess our current financial situation with Peter, and then come up with an idea of what we want to do. E.g. the Summit always costs us money, and if we want to do more, we would need money.
MattJ
With funds coming in, we'll be able to better fund meetups and such, which was the main priority we discussed after the survey results were processed
ralphm
Right, I'm trying to schedule a meeting before end-of-year
nyco
let's not expect fixing sponsorship will fix lots of pain points✎
nyco
let's not expect fixing sponsorship will resolve lots of pain points ✏
Guus
it's a place to start.
nyco
ok then
nyco
I generally agree
ralphm
Sponsorship is our only source of money, so yeah, it does
ralphm
The other resource is people, and that's a tough one to resolve in general.
ralphm
9. AOB?
ralphm
?
nyco
none from me
MattJ
None here
ralphm
10. Date of Next
ralphm
+1W, provisionally
nyco
ok
ralphm
I think I can attend
Guus
with the holidays, all bets are off for me
Guus
(As in, I'll have to get permission from my wife 😉 )
there’s no state which has a more fitting "red text below the metadata" unfortunately
jonas’
(and that’s generated by the templating stuff)
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ralphm
I think it is fine like this. Thanks!
jonas’
you’re welcome I guess? :)
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Ge0rG
So glad we have a process for that. It would have been a horrible oversight if we just waited for the last council member to vote.
Ge0rG
If only somebody had remembered that process after XEP-0403...
jonas’
hm?
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pep.
To have it as 404
edhelas
pep. :p
pep.
jonas’, I don't guarantee I have time to help with editing as an everyday^H^H^H week thing, but is there anything that I can help automate maybe?
pep.doesn't know anything about editors' work
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jonas’
pep., most stuff which can be automated is already
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jonas’
the only thing I’m missing is something which hooks on the finished docker builds and tells me that they’re done, so that I can send the emails
jonas’
(the email sending is 99% automated, but I’m paranoid and I we agreed on not sending out mails for editorial changes to keep the Signal/Noise ratio good, and that’s not implemented in the tool yet)✎
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jonas’
(the email sending is 99% automated, but I’m paranoid and we agreed on not sending out mails for editorial changes to keep the Signal/Noise ratio good, and that’s not implemented in the tool yet) ✏
jonas’
soo… if you’re inclined to make a thing which receives the docker-build-has-finished webhook and sends me a message, that’d be good
jonas’
via jabber, preferably
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jonas’
because when it comes via jabber, i can easily hook my buildbots into doing the email sending once I’m confident that the tooling will do the right thing
Link Mauve
PubSub!
jonas’
Link Mauve, also good
jonas’
the buildbots are based on pubsub already ... buuuut I’d have to modify them to be able to subscribe to more than one node