ralphmDave raised a point about XEP-0412, so that's on the agenda.
nycoit's even in Trello board
GuusI have nothing else for the agenda
nycothe former board handed it over
ralphmI don't think they did.
ralphmBut I see you added it as a card, so it is on the agenda
ralphm1. Note taker
ralphmContinuing as we have a bunch of items.
ralphm2. XEP-0412, Compliance Suites 2019
ralphmI agree with Guus' comments on the board list: let's create a place holder for this XEP until such time it is clear what the Council decides.
ralphmProbably similar to what was done for XEP-0028.
GuusAs I've replied on the board list (which is not publicly accessible, so let me repeat: I'm against keeping a XEP that was prematurely published around.
nycoGuus's words make sense, indeed
ralphmjonas’: can you take care of this?
Guusfor the record:
My main argument is that third parties might take the fact that it is published as a reason to start work based on it. As long as there's a chance that the XEP will be revoked/unpublished, we should take steps to avoid people from spending resources on something that we're not sure of yet.
nycothe probability that it happens again is non-zero
so let's revert like code can be in a repo
Second, I don't like how this can be perceived as putting pressure on council members that yet need to vote. A veto now will cause more issues (having to retract the XEP), which takes away from the freedom of choice of these council members. I'm sure that Kev can hold its own, but lets not create a precedent here. We can prevent this by rolling back before the remaining council members cast their vote.
Guusralphm I don't think jonas’ has access to that mailing list
Guusso he would not have seen my response.
Guusor suggestion to fix
nycothe pressure might be already felt, by mistake of course
ralphmnyco: the problem is that the number was given out, and if there's going to be any XEP for this, it should be the one for compliance suites, or a tombstone.
ralphmGuus: I just wrote the fix above: like XEP-0028
nycothat's only a technical workaround
GuusI'm not sure what happened with XEP-0028, ralphm
ralphmI'm happy to link it here: https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0028.html
Guusah, ok, that never got replaced/restored, but is retracted 🙂
ralphmI'm not sure if it should be removed from source control, though. Just adding a new commit with a notice like this should suffice.
Guusyeah, something similar would work.
nycoXEP-0028: No Such XEP
XEP-0412: No More Such XEP
XEP-0412: Like XEP-0028
ralphmI'm sure the Editor Team can resolve this.
nycoyep, not our duty
GuusThe Editor Team being just jonas’ nowadays?
ralphmnyco: instructing them what to do in this case is, so we just did.
ralphmGuus: no, but he added this particular commit
Guuswho else is editor? Sam's membership expired.
Guushttps://xmpp.org/about/xsf/editor-team <-- ah, a bunch
ralphmI don't think think so, work teams don't have an expiry, I think.
nycothere is a card "Call for editors" in our Trello board
Guuscan non-members be part of a work team?
SeveWhen taking back the CommTeam, only members were accepted
ralphm“Participation in Teams shall be limited to elected Members of the Corporation.”
GuusSo, Sam's out, to my disappointment.
ralphm3. Compliance Suites (again)
ralphmThis point is about the discussion we had last week, regarding badges
ralphmDave suggested, on list, something that was also mention in the meeting:
ralphm“So I suggest we run an Experiment. This experiment would have some badges that developers can claim on their projects, fully self-certified (ie, we do not attempt to create a compliance suite). The Badges themselves - the images used - would remain copyright XSF - I don't think we need the full weight of trademark law. We agree to revisit the scheme in 6 months and assess how it's being used.”
ralphmI'd like to put this up for a vote.
nycoyep, plus one
nycotry and iterate, I like that
Guus"ie, we do not attempt to create a compliance suite" <-- that does not relate to the XEP, but instead to an automated verification tool, right?
nycowe'll see what we make of it
nycogiven the experience and feedback
SeveNot sure yet, honestly, it is a bit abstract, but I like to try and iterate as nyco said
ralphmis that a +0?
SeveYes, thanks ralphm
nycoor -0 ?
GuusI've added a trello card on a backburner list, for us to remember to evaluate this in +6M
ralphmI'll discuss with dwd how to move forward to actually have images that represent a badge.
ralphm4. Call for Editors
Guusdo we need to facilitate the badges being created?
nycoI have a graphic designer who may help us
ralphmif someone volunteers to create such badges, that's be great
Guusnyco if he'd be interested, that would be great
Guuscould you ping him?
nycoI'm on it
ralphmNow, onto #4
ralphmSo this was raised by Dave on list
ralphmBut I suggested that Council should issue this call, as they actually appoint candidates.
Guus(I didn't see Dave's mail)
ralphmor really, they select them and we appoint
GuusOur website lists 6 editors, one of which is Sam. We furher have Kev, PSA, Jonas', Flow and JCBrand
ralphmMail from 2018-12-12, included this:
> 1) XSF Editor - this team needs more members. Could you put out a call? (I meant to ask last week, actually).
Given your charter, with the XMPP Council selecting volunteers and presenting them to the Board for approval, I believe it would be proper for you to put out the call to our membership. ”
ralphm(the latter is my reply)
ralphmDave agreed and would.
GuusI'm happy for either to issue that call.
ralphmSo I think this item is handled.
GuusI sent a request for help to the mailing list, but did not get any response
ralphmWe put out a request for an admin. Have we gotten candidates yet?
ralphmKeeping this one on.
ralphmLet's nudge in the new year
Guuslet's not keep it to long though
Guusstrive to decide one way or the other mid january?
ralphm6. Summit / FOSDEM
ralphmI don't have anything to report.
ralphm7. Meeting with Peter
ralphm8. Board Priorities
ralphmnyco says this was carried over.
nycoso this is a subject that the former board has passed on, like a hot potatoe
do we want to commit to prios? or we drop it? (or any other option?)
Guusgiven the ineffectiveness of last board on this (them slackers!), I wonder if this has any practical use.
nycoI have the feeling that the board resolves issues as they arrive
we may bot have common, shared, larger goals
MattJI think in general the board's role here is to enable most of these things to happen
MattJWe established SCAM for meetups, for example, and I think that's going well
MattJThe main thing blocking many other priorities is funding
GuusSure, we need to do stuff (c)(r), but do we need a defined list of priorities for that to happen?
MattJwhich is something we are focusing on
nycoMattJ and time
MattJso I don't have any problems with the board's current tasks
MattJi.e. setting a priority is fine, but it has to translate to action items. What are those?
MattJThis was my problem with all the previous discussions about priorities
nycocorrect: prios > actions
do we want to support that train of thoughts?
ralphmSo we continue as we have.
MattJMy #1 priority is fixing our funding problems
nycohow? what actions have (expected) impact?
nycoI guess fixing the following up with sponsors would be a great start, and a big effort
nycoXSF sponsorship AND Summit's
MattJWe have totally failed at dealing with our sponsors for the past few years (at least). ralphm and Guus are working towards fixing that (with help from stpeter)
ralphmWell, we need to clean up our list of sponsors, assess our current financial situation with Peter, and then come up with an idea of what we want to do. E.g. the Summit always costs us money, and if we want to do more, we would need money.
MattJWith funds coming in, we'll be able to better fund meetups and such, which was the main priority we discussed after the survey results were processed
ralphmRight, I'm trying to schedule a meeting before end-of-year
nycolet's not expect fixing sponsorship will fix lots of pain points
nycolet's not expect fixing sponsorship will resolve lots of pain points
Guusit's a place to start.
nycoI generally agree
ralphmSponsorship is our only source of money, so yeah, it does
ralphmThe other resource is people, and that's a tough one to resolve in general.
nyconone from me
ralphm10. Date of Next
ralphmI think I can attend
Guuswith the holidays, all bets are off for me
Guus(As in, I'll have to get permission from my wife 😉 )
jonas’there’s no state which has a more fitting "red text below the metadata" unfortunately
jonas’(and that’s generated by the templating stuff)
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ralphmI think it is fine like this. Thanks!
jonas’you’re welcome I guess? :)
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Ge0rGSo glad we have a process for that. It would have been a horrible oversight if we just waited for the last council member to vote.
Ge0rGIf only somebody had remembered that process after XEP-0403...
pep.To have it as 404
pep.jonas’, I don't guarantee I have time to help with editing as an everyday^H^H^H week thing, but is there anything that I can help automate maybe?
pep.doesn't know anything about editors' work
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jonas’pep., most stuff which can be automated is already
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jonas’the only thing I’m missing is something which hooks on the finished docker builds and tells me that they’re done, so that I can send the emails
jonas’(the email sending is 99% automated, but I’m paranoid and I we agreed on not sending out mails for editorial changes to keep the Signal/Noise ratio good, and that’s not implemented in the tool yet)
jonas’(the email sending is 99% automated, but I’m paranoid and we agreed on not sending out mails for editorial changes to keep the Signal/Noise ratio good, and that’s not implemented in the tool yet)
jonas’soo… if you’re inclined to make a thing which receives the docker-build-has-finished webhook and sends me a message, that’d be good
jonas’via jabber, preferably
jonas’because when it comes via jabber, i can easily hook my buildbots into doing the email sending once I’m confident that the tooling will do the right thing
jonas’Link Mauve, also good
jonas’the buildbots are based on pubsub already ... buuuut I’d have to modify them to be able to subscribe to more than one node