XSF Discussion - 2019-03-21

  1. MattJ


  2. waqas


  3. Guus


  4. MattJ

    Are we meeting today?

  5. Guus

    I assume so

  6. Guus

    ralphm nyco Seve ?

  7. MattJ

    I was concerned I hadn't received any messages since last night from the room, good to know everyone is just busy making XMPP better :)

  8. Guus

    I actually was! 🙂

  9. Ge0rG

    MattJ: wouldn't have happened with XEP-0410

  10. MattJ


  11. Guus

    We didn't receive any cancellations this week, did we?

  12. MattJ

    Not that I recall

  13. Guus

    hmm, this is disappointing...

  14. Guus prods Seve, nyco and ralphm

  15. Seve

    Yes me is here

  16. Guus

    yey 🙂

  17. Guus

    let's get started then

  18. Guus

    Seve would you like to take the chair please?

  19. Seve

    Guus, next time :P

  20. Guus

    why not now?

  21. Seve

    So who do we have? Guus, MattJ, Seve?

  22. Guus

    sounds abou tit.

  23. Guus

    sounds about it.

  24. Seve

    We have... Two items for discussion.

  25. Seve

    1) Define strategy to reach out to (and reap benefits) high profile XMPP applications/users.

  26. Seve

    There are some quotes in the trello card https://trello.com/c/dGy6D0yl/334-define-strategy-to-reach-out-to-and-reap-benefits-high-profile-xmpp-applications-users

  27. Guus

    I think we've established that we want to do this, right?

  28. Guus

    it's just a matter of how to go about it?

  29. MattJ


  30. Guus

    good, that was my impression too.

  31. Ge0rG

    Seve: I've recently talked to somebody from Tigasee who's under heavy NDAs but _might_ ping the right people at XMPP-using orgs

  32. Seve

    I think this is the important bit from the quotes in that trello card

  33. Seve

    "I'd first like to see if we can come up with some kind of strategy that defines what exactly we want to ask/tell them, before doing actual reaching-out." - Guus

  34. Seve

    Ge0rG, that is very great news :) Will that person get in touch with the XSF?

  35. Guus

    yeah. I've got little to no experience there. Can we outline what we can offer?

  36. Guus

    and what we expect?

  37. Seve is paying attention

  38. Guus

    my goals would be to a) associate, (very) publicly, XMPP with major players, b) get their input / involvement in protocol development, c) have sponsors.

  39. Seve

    Looks very good

  40. Guus

    More thoughts on what we'd like to achieve?

  41. Ge0rG

    (a) should also cover the why and how of their deployments

  42. Seve

    This is what I had in mind for this topic

  43. Guus

    the 'how' might be NDA-d, but, sure.

  44. Guus

    okay, I suggest we use these three as a base to start from

  45. Guus

    so, what can we offer?

  46. MattJ

    Publicity? (in a small way)

  47. MattJ

    Many of these large organisations do have developer advocacy roles though, who may want to be known within the community

  48. Guus

    I don't think Fortnite would benefit, publicity wise, from being associated with XMPP, tbh 🙂

  49. pep.

    Among a really small circle of users yes :-°

  50. Ge0rG

    developer advocacy is an interesting angle. Show how sexy your devops team is by... leveraging XMPP

  51. pep.

    Among another bigger circle of users it might actually be bad publicity for them, (because of the usual "ugh XML" etc. etc.)

  52. Seve

    We tie featuring companies to sponsorship, so we have to think what can we offer for getting XMPP awareness without being a sponsor

  53. Ge0rG

    Seve: blog articles?

  54. Guus

    I think we already offer that to sponsors

  55. Ge0rG

    if we offer something to non-sponsors that used to be unique to sponsors, this raises issues.

  56. Guus


  57. Seve

    Ge0rG, like blog articles :D

  58. Guus

    I do believe that these perks are less appealing nowadays, with XMPP having lost much of its 'hip and happening' vibe.

  59. Ge0rG

    Seve: blog posts are not _exclusive_, just the fact that you can buy some.

  60. Guus

    would it be appealing to offer them help with protocols, in any way/shape or form?

  61. Guus

    we've got expertise there.

  62. Seve

    I had something in mind to try to get in touch with these large companies using XMPP, that is making a written interview that we could send to them. Appealing questions for both parties

  63. Seve

    So they could express themselves, what do they use, why, what is their company about, so on.

  64. Seve

    I bet if we could get some interviews from them, we could use them as some marketing bump on our side as well

  65. MattJ

    Yeah, I think Winfried was possibly working on something along those lines

  66. Zash

    Can they be interested in making XMPP hip again?

  67. Guus

    sure, that's nice _for us_. I'm trying to identify things that'd benefit them.

  68. Seve

    I know Guus :)

  69. Guus

    Zash: to foster a larger development pool to hire from, maybe?

  70. Zash

    Guus: Yeah

  71. Zash

    Let me tell you about COBOL ON COGS ;)

  72. Guus

    well... if you need people that know how to do that, talking to the Cobol On Cogs standardization org is a pretty good start.

  73. Seve

    I don't know if the XSF has had previously a job board, but we could manage one maybe, featuring XMPP-related jobs, and we could feature them for those companies, maybe. First thing I had in mind

  74. Seve

    I would be fine taking care of it

  75. Guus


  76. Guus

    I've to think about that

  77. Seve

    Depends on how usually they need to hire XMPP employees

  78. Guus

    if I like having that

  79. Guus

    but it's an interesting thought

  80. Seve

    I know it can be not interesting to some people, but I think it would be good for the community even

  81. Guus

    hiring people is _hard_ - us providing them wiht a platform for that might be a very nice incentive.

  82. Seve


  83. Seve

    I think we need some place to document ideas or possible approaches that we can take on this, though.

  84. Guus

    if we were to offer that, it might be good to have a pre-existing job board.

  85. Guus

    Seve: i'm wrigint them donw in the Trello card right now

  86. Seve

    Only thing I would like to consider is: Job has to be related to XMPP, not some technology has lying around. (In my current opinion)

  87. Seve

    they have*

  88. Guus

    which would be hard to verify, but sure.

  89. Seve

    Well, we would neet to explain this :)

  90. MattJ

    A lot about it is hard to verify

  91. Guus

    do we as a standards organization want to create such a job board?

  92. Seve

    I do want it, with my member hat on, not board.

  93. Guus

    (should we have a job board, even out of context of the sponsoring context?)

  94. Seve

    Yes (again)

  95. Seve

    In my opinion, it would be good to gather XMPP related jobs

  96. Guus

    Seve, would you mind making this suggestion on the members list?

  97. Seve

    Just like there are jobs for a specific web framework: https://djangojobs.net/jobs/

  98. Guus

    I'd be very interested in getting feedback from others.

  99. Seve

    I agree Guus

  100. Seve

    I will make the suggestion and let's see what it comes out of it.

  101. Ge0rG

    +1 on having a Job Board, but not sure how much of an XMPP/XSF property it should be

  102. Guus

    I'm looking at the clock: maybe we should try to come to an actionable conclusion here, and take this up in the next meeting again?

  103. MattJ

    Sounds good

  104. Seve

    Ok then

  105. Guus

    I'd like to get some feedback on that job board idea - not perse in context of sponsoring.

  106. Guus

    can we make something else actionable?

  107. Seve

    Doesn't look like it.

  108. Guus

    let's wrap this up

  109. Seve


  110. Seve


  111. Seve

    Let's meet same time next week?

  112. Guus

    next week is fine for me

  113. Seve

    Let's close then

  114. Guus

    Thanks Seve

  115. Seve bangs the gavel.

  116. Guus

    Seve, do you want me to put a 'poll membership' trello card?

  117. MattJ

    Thanks Seve :)

  118. moparisthebest

    my random thought is a job board would be great, but probably don't need to get too fancy initially, since I can't imagine it having very many jobs

  119. moparisthebest

    maybe just appoint a contact or email who modifies the page on github or something to start?

  120. Seve

    Guus, added :) Sorry guys for the not of the best structured meetings, I got work all of a sudden that couldn't avoid

  121. Guus

    (just created the Trello card)

  122. Guus

    (as did you)

  123. Guus

    woohoo two cards!

  124. Seve

    Guus, removing mine, yours looks better already :)

  125. Guus

    moparisthebest yeah, that might be a good start.

  126. Guus

    we could add paid vs. non-paid categories, to at least get some jobs listed

  127. Guus

    (I'm betting pretty much any open source project would love to have more contributors)

  128. Seve

    I will send an email later today and let's see!

  129. Guus


  130. Ge0rG

    There was no response yet to the OSD job submission.

  131. Ge0rG

    The submission thing is supposed to open a PR on https://github.com/opensourcedesign/jobs but that didn't happen either

  132. Guus

    Ge0rG maybe re-do the posting with the 'for nerds' method

  133. Guus


  134. Ge0rG

    Guus: roger

  135. Guus

    wait: https://github.com/opensourcedesign/jobs/pull/389

  136. Guus

    Ge0rG the PR was created after all

  137. MattJ notes their process for managing their jobs board... relevant :)

  138. Guus


  139. Ge0rG

    Guus: whoops. That's what I get for searchging in "issues" and not in "PRs"

  140. Guus

    I made the exact same mistake at first.

  141. Ge0rG

    Thanks for stopping me just in time. I already had the duplicate PR commit ready :>