XSF Discussion - 2019-05-23

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  132. Guus

    Ge0rG I'm preparing that email in which I ask members to give feedback on the various designs for badges. Can you provide the links again for the two variants that are out there?

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  136. jubalh

    do clients still support resource locking? if yes, which ones?

  137. jonas’

    pidgin probably

  138. jubalh

    so other clients removed this, since i suppose at some point they supported it, right?

  139. jubalh

    and sending to a specific resource should be removed also or that would be fine?

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  143. pep.

    From what I understand resource locking is not recommended anymore. There are some cases where it's still required, like OTR, but otherwise it's most likely not something you want

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  146. jonas’

    jubalh, the only situation where you would send to a specific resource in the context of a 1:1 conversation is when the data should really only go to one resource

  147. jonas’

    OTR is one exmaple, but IQs are another obvious example

  148. jonas’

    if you establish a jingle session, you’ll also address that to only one of the resources.

  149. jonas’

    (ideally, a UI would propose the most-recently-heard-from resource by default and allow the user to choose another one based on disco identities etc.)

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  151. jubalh

    alright :)

  152. jubalh

    that sounds like I should remove the resource locking from the UI. so that people cant lock it by hand anymore but otr still uses it

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  157. wurstsalat

    Don't know the current status though https://dev.gajim.org/gajim/gajim/issues/8971 You can still send messages to specific resources (there are plans to remove that)

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  159. jubalh

    thx wurstsalat

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  165. Ge0rG

    Guus: > Seve: mine is under https://op-co.de/tmp/xmpp-compliance-badges/ - theTedd made one at https://bitbucket.org/mrtedd/compliance-badges/src

  166. Seve

    Guus, ^

  167. Ge0rG

    Guus: https://opensourcedesign.net/jobs/jobs/2019-03-19-design-of-badges-for-different-xmpp-compliance-levels

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  179. Guus


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  186. Guus

    I think this is of interest: https://help.github.com/en/articles/about-github-sponsors

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  219. mtavares

    Use case: send a msg to myself on another remote.

  220. mtavares

    I wonder if that is even possible...

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  223. moparisthebest

    mtavares, yep, I send myself messages as notes all the time

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  225. moparisthebest

    now that I think about it maybe only useful with carbons and mam but whatever, works

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  231. Guus

    Time for the XSF Board meeting.

  232. Nÿco


  233. Guus


  234. Guus

    did you get my earlier message?

  235. Guus

    (email text proposal)

  236. ralphm bangs gavel

  237. ralphm

    0. Welcome + Agenda

  238. Seve


  239. ralphm

    Hi everyone!

  240. Guus


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  242. MattJ


  243. Guus

    full house

  244. ralphm

    1. Messenger Regulation Germany/EU

  245. ralphm

    Any updates here?

  246. Guus

    that was on your commitment list, so I guess any updates come from you? 🙂

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  248. Seve

    I'm not aware of any :)

  249. ralphm

    hrm: “Guus to make contact with the German government with Alex and the help of GeOrG”

  250. ralphm

    (from minutes)

  251. Guus

    I followed up on that with "that's Ralph, not me" (or something to that extend)

  252. Nÿco

    my mistake, sorry

  253. ralphm

    I'll fix the heads on the item

  254. Guus

    As you wrote last week: > Sure. As I mentioned before, we have one German citizen as Director: Alex. I could work with him and Ge0rG?

  255. Guus

    your head is on it 🙂

  256. Nÿco

    wait, who's the minute taker?

  257. ralphm

    you :-D

  258. Alex

    happy to do so

  259. ralphm

    Alex: the minutes or the regulation thing?

  260. Alex


  261. Nÿco

    both? 😉

  262. Nÿco


  263. Nÿco

    ok, I'll one minute not more 😉

  264. ralphm


  265. ralphm

    Alex: thanks!

  266. ralphm

    Alex: we aren't really sure how to proceed, so any help welcome.

  267. Guus

    ralphm looking at Trello, you're now volunteering Nyco and me for this, while you volunteered for it last week. I don't want to spend time on this in the near future myself, to much balls in the air at this moment.

  268. Alex

    but Mrs Barley announced to resign from her current German position this Sunday when we have elections, and take on some duties in Brussels in the European parlament

  269. ralphm

    Guus: I've just read the minutes, if I remembered incorrectly, I'll pick it back up again

  270. ralphm


  271. ralphm

    2. XMPP Testimonials

  272. Guus

    You remembered incorrectly, and the minutes are incorrect. See http://logs.xmpp.org/xsf/2019-05-16?p=h#2019-05-16-f84f17240717ef3d

  273. Guus


  274. ralphm

    Guus: this _was_ yours, right?

  275. Guus

    I've drafted a text for this earlier today, that Nyco OK'd just now

  276. Guus

    I'll send it out right after the meeting.

  277. ralphm


  278. Ge0rG

    Luckily we've had two weeks to talk to Ms Barley before the election.

  279. ralphm

    Ge0rG: and?

  280. Ge0rG

    ralphm: I'm still waiting for somebody to tell me that I'm allowed to.

  281. Guus

    please use sarcasm markup when applied in meeting.

  282. ralphm

    yeah, that's not cool

  283. ralphm

    I thought the minutes were clear that we wanted to work with you and Alex on this.

  284. Ge0rG

    My reading of the channel log was that Alex was promoted to take the initiative.

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  287. ralphm

    Well, since we're all guessing here, let's make it clear:

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  289. ralphm

    Ge0rG: we'd love to understand how to move forward, the reason I asked Alex is because he is a Director of the XSF

  290. ralphm

    but we totally want to have you help us figure out how to do things

  291. ralphm

    Does that unblock you?

  292. Ge0rG

    ralphm: alright. I would attempt to call the respective ministry. They already responded to an inquiry by Freie Messenger, so I might obtain direct contact info. There was also a FOIA request that's still pending

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  294. Guus


  295. ralphm

    Freedom Of Information Act

  296. Ge0rG

    ralphm: no. I'd actually rather improvise my steps than coordinate each one with The Board.

  297. ralphm

    Ge0rG: in that case, what is your goal and your strategy?

  298. Alex

    Ge0rG: I don't have the time currently to lead the initiative. But I am happy to help whenever I can

  299. Ge0rG

    ralphm: my goal is to establish a contact with somebody who's competent at the technical or legislative level for that context, and to offer support to them.

  300. Guus

    I'd be happy with Ge0rG acting autonomous to a degree, given a defined mandate.

  301. Ge0rG

    ralphm: my strategy is to use my telephone and email client for that

  302. Guus

    what would the 'support' that you offer entail exactly?

  303. Ge0rG

    Maybe that wasn't obvious from my initial mail, but I considered that as the only viable way to move forward given what we know right now.

  304. Ge0rG

    Guus: wherever I would be entitled to do. Do we have an agenda?

  305. Ge0rG

    I suppose it would be some kind of consulting / lobbying.

  306. ralphm

    Ge0rG: we're not trying to tie you down here with silly questions. If you are acting on behalf of the Board of the Corporation, we'd like to understand what you want to achieve and how.

  307. Ge0rG

    Sorry, I've got to run into the reallife now.

  308. Nÿco

    XMPP is real life!

  309. Seve

    Also get updated on what is going on, next steps, etc.

  310. Ge0rG

    ralphm: I understand. Asking me those things two weeks ago would have been appropriate.

  311. Guus

    Maybe the goal would be to define together what kind of 'support' we could offer?

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  313. Ge0rG

    Guus: this is a goal for Board? Or rather for the initial Dialoge?

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  315. Ge0rG

    Guus: this is a goal for Board? Or rather for the initial dialogue?

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  317. Guus

    the initial dialogue. I was suggesting to work with them to define what would benefit both parties most.

  318. Ge0rG & # will read up what you've decided

  319. Guus

    as far as I'm concerned, you could do that solo / with Alex, and report back to board when concrete commitments need to be made.

  320. ralphm


  321. MattJ

    Sounds sensible

  322. ralphm

    3. Tigase as Sponsor

  323. Guus

    done/dusted, I think?

  324. ralphm

    Tigase has responded to my inquiry and they are Gold sponsor for 2019!

  325. Guus

    maybe do some more exposure on htis?

  326. Seve

    Thank you Tigase! :)

  327. ralphm

    Guus and I updated the website to reflect this.

  328. ralphm

    Guus: yes, it would be good to e.g. mention this on Twitter

  329. Nÿco


  330. Nÿco

    and the newsletter

  331. ralphm


  332. Nÿco

    (I'll add something in AOB)

  333. Nÿco

    I'll suggest the entry in the newsletter

  334. ralphm

    4. Compliance Badges

  335. Guus

    nyco, you're comms - could you take care of this please?

  336. Guus

    (I'm swamped)

  337. ralphm

    I saw three batches of badges

  338. Nÿco

    oui, monsieur

  339. Guus

    thank you 🙂

  340. Guus

    I sent out the promised call for feedback only this morning

  341. ralphm

    yep, thanks for that!

  342. ralphm

    5. AOB

  343. Guus

    (none for me)

  344. Nÿco

    so, as founder and CEO, I'd like Nayego to be a sponsor of the XSF, but we got no money so far, can we arrange anything?

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  346. ralphm

    Nÿco: like?

  347. MattJ

    What kind of arrangement would you propose?

  348. Nÿco

    any kind of contribution

  349. Guus

    Do you have a concrete proposal? I'm struggling to think of something

  350. Nÿco

    marketing, social media, maybe

  351. Seve

    I think it would be better if you could propose something that we could discuss upon

  352. Seve

    I can't think of anything right now.

  353. Nÿco


  354. ralphm


  355. ralphm

    but thanks for the suggestion!

  356. ralphm

    6. Date of Next

  357. ralphm

    Next week is Ascension and a holiday in .nl

  358. Guus

    I'll not be here +1w

  359. ralphm

    Shall we reconvene +2W?

  360. MattJ


  361. Guus

    actually, I won't be here +2w either

  362. Nÿco


  363. Guus

    or very unlikely, at best.

  364. ralphm

    Well, that's too bad, we'll manage without Guus?

  365. Guus

    yes please.

  366. Nÿco

    dunno... ;-)

  367. ralphm

    +2W it is

  368. ralphm

    7. Close

  369. ralphm

    Thanks all!

  370. ralphm bangs gavel

  371. Seve

    Thank you all :)!

  372. MattJ


  373. Nÿco


  374. Nÿco is minuting

  375. Guus


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  377. Nÿco

    minutes sent, please review and correct where I'm wrong

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  379. Guus

    Nÿco thanks - maybe include a reference that Board OK'ed Alex/Georg to act with a degree of autonomy, with the goal of establishing a relation and defining with the German government what a good set of goals / mutual benefits would be.

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  386. Ge0rG

    Thank you very much for entrusting me. I am just a little bit sad that we didn't manage to get this far the two weeks before.

  387. Ge0rG

    Alex: I'll try to find the contact details and establish first contact some time early next week.

  388. Ge0rG

    The timing is not perfect because Barley will most probably be hung over from the Sunday election results, one way or the other. I hope that the working level employees of the ministry won't be.

  389. Alex


  390. Ge0rG

    Now I should disappear again before this ends up as a colossal German politics rant.

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  393. Guus

    I'm looking forward for you to impress us with more speedy results than what board has achieved here, Ge0rG ! 🙂

  394. Ge0rG

    Guus: don't count on me making the German government move faster

  395. Ge0rG

    Albeit, with all the money I'm giving them...

  396. Guus

    No no, you dug this hole for yourself. No excuses! 🙂

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  473. pep.


  474. pep.

    hmm, I failed with numbering.

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  524. pep.

    btw, if people from the community are interested, do not hesitate to contact us as well

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  557. Zash

    Seems we kinda forgot about https://opendiscussionday.org/

  558. Zash

    https://blog.prosody.im/mandatory-encryption-on-xmpp-starts-today/ FIVE YEARS \o/

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  591. karoshi has left