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pep.
08:33:14
"Accepted"? (I guess if this discussion happens again there will be plenty enough bikeshed). I also agree anyway
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jonas’
11:19:49
Accepted is Experimental though
Zash
11:21:48
Try harder to push Draft to Final?
jonas’
11:22:24
s/Draft/Productive/?
jonas’
11:22:31
s/Draft/Living Standard/?
Zash
11:22:33
Live Testing
Zash
11:22:42
Please Implement!!!!1eleven
flow
11:24:21
Mature? Stable?
flow
11:24:54
Zash, I don't see the point in the 'final' state FWIW
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jonas’
11:25:21
final means immutable, there might be some value in that or not
Zash
11:26:43
But things never stop changing unless they are dead. So it's kinda weird.
Zash
11:27:03
What do you do with an immutable XEP when the requirements inevitably change a decade later?
jonas’
11:27:06
RFCs don’t change
Zash
11:27:16
RFCs get replaced
jonas’
11:27:36
I think the same idea was for Final initially, too
jonas’
11:27:40
(and maybe still is)
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Zash
11:29:13
IETF has Internet-Drafts which are almost like our Experimental. Then it maybe gets published as an Experimental or Propsoed RFC, which is sorta like our Draft. Then you go back to I-D and roll in tweaks based on experiences, which gets published as another type of RFC
Zash
11:30:28
Tho you can roll in new experiences in Draft XEPs, but with more friction due to Council
Guus
11:30:57
I agree that it might be good to adopt a terminology that leans less heavily towards the "this isn't done yet" side. It's off-putting, and can be taken as a sign that there's no maturity to the stack.
Zash
11:31:52
RFC 3920 is "Proposed"
Zash
11:32:13
Wait RFC 6120 is also "PROPOSED STANDARD"
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Zash
11:33:42
HTTP/1.1 is a draft standard
Zash
11:33:57
I think the thing is that nobody looks in that corner
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theTedd
11:42:20
the issue is that what we mean by 'Draft' isn't how the word is usually used, and if you have to go out of your way to explain the way you're using a word, maybe you should just use a different word
theTedd
11:42:57
we want to imply "ready for use" as opposed to "a bit rough, but nearly there"
jonas’
11:43:19
yes
theTedd
11:44:12
this has come up before, of course
Zash
11:44:20
Many times
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theTedd
11:45:31
Mature?
jonas’
11:45:46
so that it ends up in content filters :)
theTedd
11:45:54
ha
theTedd
11:45:58
Stable?
Zash
11:46:21
Isn't that Final?
theTedd
11:46:45
Stable doesn't rule out changes, Final i supposed to
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Zash
11:48:10
Or, just do away with the words and use numbers.
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theTedd
11:49:17
I'm not sure that would help - people will take the highest number as final and anything less as unfinished
Zash
11:49:35
That's how XEP version numbers work already
Zash
11:49:57
0.x = experimental, 1.0 = STABLE! (draft), 2.0 = immutable forever
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