XSF Discussion - 2019-05-26


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  76. pep.

    "Accepted"? (I guess if this discussion happens again there will be plenty enough bikeshed). I also agree anyway

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  112. jonas’

    Accepted is Experimental though

  113. Zash

    Try harder to push Draft to Final?

  114. jonas’

    s/Draft/Productive/?

  115. jonas’

    s/Draft/Living Standard/?

  116. Zash

    Live Testing

  117. Zash

    Please Implement!!!!1eleven

  118. flow

    Mature? Stable?

  119. flow

    Zash, I don't see the point in the 'final' state FWIW

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  121. jonas’

    final means immutable, there might be some value in that or not

  122. Zash

    But things never stop changing unless they are dead. So it's kinda weird.

  123. Zash

    What do you do with an immutable XEP when the requirements inevitably change a decade later?

  124. jonas’

    RFCs don’t change

  125. Zash

    RFCs get replaced

  126. jonas’

    I think the same idea was for Final initially, too

  127. jonas’

    (and maybe still is)

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  130. Zash

    IETF has Internet-Drafts which are almost like our Experimental. Then it maybe gets published as an Experimental or Propsoed RFC, which is sorta like our Draft. Then you go back to I-D and roll in tweaks based on experiences, which gets published as another type of RFC

  131. Zash

    Tho you can roll in new experiences in Draft XEPs, but with more friction due to Council

  132. Guus

    I agree that it might be good to adopt a terminology that leans less heavily towards the "this isn't done yet" side. It's off-putting, and can be taken as a sign that there's no maturity to the stack.

  133. Zash

    RFC 3920 is "Proposed"

  134. Zash

    Wait RFC 6120 is also "PROPOSED STANDARD"

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  136. Zash

    HTTP/1.1 is a draft standard

  137. Zash

    I think the thing is that nobody looks in that corner

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  141. theTedd

    the issue is that what we mean by 'Draft' isn't how the word is usually used, and if you have to go out of your way to explain the way you're using a word, maybe you should just use a different word

  142. theTedd

    we want to imply "ready for use" as opposed to "a bit rough, but nearly there"

  143. jonas’

    yes

  144. theTedd

    this has come up before, of course

  145. Zash

    Many times

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  147. theTedd

    Mature?

  148. jonas’

    so that it ends up in content filters :)

  149. theTedd

    ha

  150. theTedd

    Stable?

  151. Zash

    Isn't that Final?

  152. theTedd

    Stable doesn't rule out changes, Final i supposed to

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  154. Zash

    Or, just do away with the words and use numbers.

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  156. theTedd

    I'm not sure that would help - people will take the highest number as final and anything less as unfinished

  157. Zash

    That's how XEP version numbers work already

  158. Zash

    0.x = experimental, 1.0 = STABLE! (draft), 2.0 = immutable forever

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