XSF Discussion - 2019-07-19

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  15. tom

    >tom, can you tell my corporate IT dept, they use all the proprietary blackboxes, riverbed, telari, cisco, and palo alto I think it's more of a leadership issue tbh. The places I've worked at, the CEO understood how to sell a product. They were not engineers. They paid engineers to make the engineering detail decisions. That understood that is; after the whole whole reason they are paying them for.

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  17. tom

    well, the CEO was more knowing how to lead all the different teams

  18. tom

    because we did have a sales team and they did sales

  19. tom

    and an accounting team which managed the money

  20. tom

    the 'officers' acted as the glue

  21. tom

    and were very good at it

  22. tom

    and delegated things they were not good at to people who were

  23. tom

    then again the product was IP transit, so the quality of the technology was the end goal

  24. tom

    not just a means

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  44. moparisthebest

    hmm nyco not a huge deal but I don't think https://github.com/xsf/xeps/commit/6e1c4675714d80824f5f951a64c2d47e14deee4b#diff-48188c65e1a20d564eb9dbe110506a16 is correct either

  45. moparisthebest

    > the document specifies to DO THIS

  46. moparisthebest

    is what I meant, probably could be worded better, but two doesn't make sense there to me

  47. moparisthebest

    maybe "This document specifies an algorithm to additionally look up records..." or "This document specifies a method to additionally look up records..." or "This document specifies a way to additionally look up records..."

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  74. jonas’

    moparisthebest, huh, you’re right

  75. jonas’

    I need to revert htat

  76. jonas’

    It somehow made sense to me when I read it, but it doesn’t

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  92. Ge0rG

    that DNSSEC vs SRV debate last night, was it based on Travis' email?

  93. jonas’

    vice versa probably

  94. Ge0rG

    oh, the timestamps

  95. Ge0rG

    How could I have possibly missed the addition of a MUST NOT?

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  156. pep.

    heh, most protoXEPs in the inbox fail at linking to the proper xslt file so the .xml link fails

  157. pep.

    Maybe we could also have a link to that file in the inbox

  158. Ge0rG

    that would make sense

  159. pep.

    I submitted a PR

  160. jonas’

    pep., against the nginx config?

  161. pep.

    ah, no I just added a symlink, just like there were already for the .ent and .dtd

  162. pep.

    against xsf/xeps

  163. jonas’

    I see

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  191. pep.


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  204. Ge0rG

    pep.: I've answered to the reactions "thread" now

  205. pep.


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  254. larma

    Ge0rG: I answered your answer ;)

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  257. Ge0rG

    larma: I think you misread my mail. "Each reaction SHOULD contain a legacy reaction body" ;)

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  259. Ge0rG

    good points on Reactions and LMC, though.

  260. Ge0rG

    I always disliked LMCs limitation to "the last message"

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  264. pep.

    I am sure this could be changed, no? I actually liked your point about LMC

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  266. pep.

    Actually, all except backwards compatibility

  267. Ge0rG

    Reactions surely can define an exception to the strict LMC rule

  268. Ge0rG

    even then, it's not an issue.

  269. Ge0rG

    instead of a correction you see a new legacy reaction

  270. pep.


  271. pep.

    "new legacy"?

  272. Ge0rG

    legacy reaction = body

  273. pep.

    Ok. Not for me, thanks :x

  274. Ge0rG

    what's not for you?

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  285. larma

    Ge0rG: no I didn't misread your mail, my opinion is SHOULD NOT or MUST NOT have a body

  286. larma

    If we do any business rules regarding body

  287. larma

    A fallback body will render the feature unusable as long as there are legacy clients

  288. pep.

    And we all know that there will always be legacy clients :)

  289. Ge0rG

    larma: your reaction seemed to imply you read it as "MUST have"

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  291. Ge0rG

    larma: I disagree. The lack of a legacy body will render the feature unusable.

  292. Ge0rG

    having that feature will increase the pressure on legacy users.

  293. pep.

    I disagree with your last statement

  294. pep.

    Unless you make the fallback broken on purpose to bully implementations, (granted, one could argue 393 is broken and it might be good enough, but not everybody agrees with me on this)

  295. Ge0rG

    pep.: the more important question is whether you agree with the previous statement ;)

  296. pep.

    I disagree as well

  297. pep.

    And I disagree in a more general way than just reactions

  298. pep.

    I mean I disagree, with your statement

  299. pep.

    I mean I disagree with your statement

  300. Ge0rG

    pep.: I see you moved that back to the list. very good

  301. pep.


  302. Ge0rG

    thanks, I'll write a response when I'm less busy.

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  320. Lance

    I just noticed that there's not really an easy way to get an individual entry out of MAM if you already know its archive id. Closest I can find is requesting the item before/after the id I have, then request 1 item after/before that one, to get the item I originally wanted.

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  325. waqas

    Lance: You likely want to go for the item before it. Going for the item after and then the item before that is prone to race condition.

  326. Lance

    Ah, yes

  327. Lance

    It works ok enough for use case of deep linking into history, if you also want +/-N additional messages of surrounding context

  328. Lance

    but i was tinkering with saving just the archive id in a pubsub item to do pinned messages

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  330. waqas

    I imagine there was an assumption of "if you know the ID, you already have the message". MAM is not POP, and isn't a full DB system either.

  331. Lance

    yeah, that makes sense

  332. waqas

    Though a lot of folks do keep pushing (with some success) to have MAM just be a SQL dialect. It's harder to implement on things which don't have SQL indices and such.

  333. Lance

    i can resolve it pretty easily by letting my server understand a new custom form field

  334. Lance

    but this was a "Huh???" moment

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