jonas’would the XSF want to host blog posts showcasing e.g. how to configure a specific XMPP setup on xmpp.org?
jonas’from non-XSF members
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Danieljonas’, maybe not 'blog post' but actually good tutorials i think are welcome
Danielre the discussion on the developers foundation at the last summit
Ge0rGmaybe we can just retweet them from @xmpp
Danielwhen ever i finally have a few days down time i'll actually submit such a tutorial myself
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Danielhere is how Conversations is going to deal with the multiple translation issue from now on: https://github.com/siacs/Conversations/commit/9bf5fb98acce52d49326f2f613a99f5b957f95c7
Ge0rGDaniel: got a screenshot of the language tag?
pep.Daniel, is there such a thing as "no language tag"? xml:lang is usually (often? always?) set on the stream
ralphmI type in Dutch and English depending on which contact I'm talking to. I am Dutch, but have my phone set to English. How do you plan to handle this?
pep.I also do type Japanese on my xml:lang="en" stream fwiw
Danielralphm, it's just displaying the tag if there are multiple bodies
Danielso you will never see that anyway
ralphmI mean, how do I tell my client what I am doing?
pep.Most clients don't or badly support multiple languages anyway
Danielright. but Conversations will not send multiple. if you have a client that sends multiple it is the responsibilty of that client to set something sane
Danieli mean if you type a dutch message with Conversations it will only have one body and thus not show any tag on the receiving side
ralphmBut even if you have a single body, would you then just not have a language tag, and just have it inherit from the stream?
Ge0rGralphm: change the PC / mobile phone language setting before talking, reconnect to update the stream language
pep.:D
ralphmGe0rG: of course
jonas’08:50:07 Daniel> pep., no tag means stream
jonas’Daniel, no tag means the tag on the stanza
pep.well no tag means parent tag
pep.and so on
ralphmWell xml:lang is inherited as defined by the XML spec, so that part was clear to me.
Danielno single body will not show a tag
Danielthat would be extremly annoying
jonas’Daniel, overall, that sounds like a very reasonable solution
Ge0rGIt's not inherited in most xml parser implementations...
ralphmGe0rG: yep, it is not easy, and then there's the part where you take a stanza from a stream and send it onwards on another stream. You'd have to take the inherited xml:lang along (just as with namespaces/prefixes).
Daniel(i'll make a note for looking into the inheritence)
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Ge0rGhad issues with that hairy part as well... https://discourse.igniterealtime.org/t/message-getbody-returns-null-if-all-bodies-have-an-xml-lang/83923
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ralphmI'm still not sure if having multiple language bodies is useful at all.
flowDaniel, inheritance applies to other things besides xml:lang too. If you are going to fix it for xml:lang, you may want to make sure that it is also done (or at least possible) for those other things. At least that is what I did in Smack
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flowralphm, what about e.g. pubsub notifications to a wide audience?
jonas’flow, what are the other things?
jonas’I only know of xml:lang
pep.wasn't xml:space a thing?
jonas’if that isn’t handled by the XML parser you’re screwed anyways (and I don’t think it’s inherited?)
Daniel> I'm still not sure if having multiple language bodies is useful at all.
As I argue in the commit message just showing the default without any warning doesn't help because you never know what legacy does out there
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DanielSo whether or not sending this in practice is a good idea is only a secondary question. Your client will have to deal with it either way
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flowjonas’, namespaces and prefixes
jonas’flow, right, I assume that everyone uses an XML Namespaces compliant parser
jonas’if you don’t, you’re screwed anyways
jonas’if you don’t, you’re in a world of pain anyways
flowjonas’, I would't agree with your assumption and conclusion, but yes, makes things easier
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ralphmflow: for pubsub, yes, that might be a good idea. But I thought we were mostly discussing regular messages with the standard body element.
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ralphmFor regular conversations, denothing the language is impractical, at most.
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ralphmAnd at the same time language is hard. Especially if you look at far-east languages. Chinese, Japanese, and Korean, can all be expressed in Unicode. However, due to the so-called han-unification, it means that they all use the same code points with (wildly) different glyphs. So there, denoting which language it is, is crucial for proper display. I am unsure how this actually achieved in platforms.
jonas’probably from contetx?
jonas’probably from context?
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Ge0rGright-click, select encoding. Like in the browser in the good old days of koi-8r
ralphmGe0rG: it has nothing to do with encoding
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ralphmYou may want to read about Han Unification.
Ge0rGralphm: so it would be: right-click, select *de*coding
pep.that's not related to xml:lang anymore is it. Sure language is hard
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Ge0rGralphm: is it something to be covered by xml:lang regional selectors, or by unicode variant selectors?
ralphmpep.: well, it is related in that you arguably could use xml:lang for selecting which variant glyphs to use.
pep.ralphm, you mean automatically?
ralphmGe0rG: and yes, variant selectors might help, too
ralphmpep.: maybe there are heuristics, but I don't know
Ge0rGis there an xml:lang that will render all gender-neutral emojis as female?
pep.haha
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pep.Ge0rG, no, there has to be a male modifier alongside!
pep.(that's what I see most often anyway..)
Ge0rGxml:lang="en_US@♀\u1F3FF"
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ralphmThose are ZWJs, not variation selectors, I think?
Ge0rGralphm: ZWJs are used to append variation selectors, aren't they?
Ge0rGThe number of "characters" in a single Emoji is a highly debatable thing.
Ge0rGhttps://hsivonen.fi/string-length/
ralphmGe0rG: I am a bit out of my depth here, but I think that using presentation selectors with emoji (with ZWJ) is different from what unicode calls variation selectors.
ralphmI think variation selectors (regarding emoji) is for making a distinction between a monochrome glyph and a colorful one.
Ge0rGralphm: right; I've totally lost track of the different selectors and how to glue them to the actual Emoji
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ralphmI think this page explains it nicely https://blog.emojipedia.org/emoji-zwj-sequences-three-letters-many-possibilities/
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ralphmIt also mentions VS-16, and I was correct, it seems.
Ge0rGApparently, you just append the fitzpatrick modifier, but use a ZWJ for the gender.
ralphm(under the heading Twitter, with a footnoot 3)
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Ge0rGNow I wonder what happens if you strip out VS-16 from the woman-heart-woman or the facepalm-man emoji.
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ralphmI am still hoping that some day, having WAFFLE + ZWJ + REGIONAL INDICATOR N + NATIONAL INDICATOR L will yield a Stroopwafel.
ralphmI installed a font that supports Unicode 12, now, so I see a waffle at least.
ralphm(I didn't at the time)
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Ge0rGralphm: does it have the epileptic parrot Emoji?
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Ge0rG(The Epileptic Parrots would make a great metal band name)
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ralphmIt is called party parrot
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ralphmhttps://cultofthepartyparrot.com/
Sevecrazy
Ge0rGThere used to be a parrot.exe bundled with certain SoundBlaster cards. It had a cult as well. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=DCMJ0Ufiilg
Seve:D
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ralphmThat is awesome!
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Ge0rGralphm: there is a bunch of covers and even some live performance videos!
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Danielam i reading 313 correctly that it doesn’t warn you not to make the dino mistake?
Danielor am I missing something?
Daniel(matching up query-id and service jid)
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MattJI don't recall any text along those lines, no
MattJI agree that evidently it needs to be documented
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MattJBut I would have assumed it was obvious that results would come from the JID you queried
MattJand not from a different JID
Danielwell…
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MattJTo be clear, I'm 200% in favour of documenting anything that will help people write more secure software by default
MattJJust explaining why it probably wasn't added in the first place
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Danielsure. to be clear i found it 100% obvious to match the jid and the query-id
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Ge0rGI found it obvious as well, but my underlying library was playing games with me.
MattJI think it's obvious to everyone if they read it properly, but it's easy for anyone to forget things, so it's good to make important things explicit
Ge0rGSmack is calling the processMessage() callback on each message, including on messages that contain a MAM payload, and it is actually the straightforward way to just extract and use it there.
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Ge0rGBut processMessage() will also get called on all malicious MAM injections.
Ge0rGSo even when you are aware of the pitfalls, it's not always obvious
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flowGe0rG, which call site of (assuming the MessageListener's) processMessage() are you referring to, from MucManager?
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Ge0rGflow: for historical reasons, I'm going through connection.addSyncStanzaListener(..., new StanzaTypeFilter(Message.class))
Ge0rGflow: there was a time when smack was silently removing your listeners on network events, like a disconnect
Ge0rGso I had to work around all those
flowGe0rG, so you tell smack to invoke a listener for every message and then appear to be complaining about it doing so?
Ge0rGflow: looks like that, yes.
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Ge0rGflow: what's the official way? A ChatManager?
Ge0rGWhat do I do to track message delivery errors? A ChatMessageDeliveryErrorManager?
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ralphmbangs gavel
ralphm0. Welcome + Agenda
ralphmWho do we have today?
ralphmSeve sent regrets.
SeveI still have network, I can follow for now 👍
dwdYou might need to incant their names.
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MattJHey
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MattJIt worked
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ralphmI didn't even incant, yet?
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nycotest
dwdralphm, Negative latency.
ralphmdwd: figures
ralphmGuus?
MattJI assumed you did it out loud
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SeveGuus cannot attend
ralphmTrello as agenda. Any additional items?
MattJNone here
ralphmSeve: I missed that, ok.
nycore-re-test
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ralphmnyco: works?
pep.There are awaiting PRs in the repo. I was wondering if that should go through board, but I guess I'll poke jonas’ first
nyco_shaky connection
nyco_I'm here, but maybe not
ralphmpep.: PRs for what?
ralphm1. Minute taker
ralphmWho?
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Danieli can do that
ralphmThanks Daniel
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ralphm2. POSS
ralphmnyco put this on the agenda
nyco_oh yes
nyco_actually maybe rather SCAM
pep.ralphm, DOAP for example. but ignore it for now, I'll try to get that in the agenda for next week
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ralphmnyco_ that'd be my first guess, yes
nyco_ok
ralphm3. ralphm's items
ralphmI have been occupied with other stuff, sorry.
ralphmWill try for next week.,
ralphm4. GSOC
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ralphmI saw this was discussed last week?
nyco_yep
nyco_mentors & flow have no time to write stuff...
ralphmWith an apparent action item for commteam to write a blog post
nyco_commTeam may aggregate students blog posts...
ralphmCan you take it up with commteam?
nyco_sir, yes sir
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ralphmMuch appreciated sir.
ralphmAnd shine your shoes next time.
Seve:)
nyco_sir, sorry sir
ralphm5. Adopt a character
SeveFlow suggested this one
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ralphmBesides the confusing terminology – I assume they mean codepoint – why should we do this?
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nyco_because it's funny and only 100€
nyco_we could attract some sympathy
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nyco_apart from that it is useless, that is why it is absolutely necessary
ralphmSurely funny.
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ralphmI also should ask: should the XSF put money (from its sponsors) in this?
nyco_good point, but that's only 100€
nyco_Silver sponsors pay 1k€
SeveI don't really know how much this is known though, but I share the same opinion as Guus and Nyco. We can poll the membership as well, or gather more information on the popuarity of it, etc. Ideally we could promote ourselves a bit as well.
nyco_we have some money in the bank, right?
flowIt's even less, because USD, and tex deducable. And it's for a non-profit org.
nyco_ok, less than 100€
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nyco_I think the popularity of this thing has nothing to do with what we can do with it
flowI'd also hoped that one of your sponsors would help us for the silver sponsoring, but even 100$ would be ok and increase the visiblity of the XSF a bit.
nyco_I have mixed feeling about it, I defend the idea now, but I'm not so sure, just feelings
flowMy general feeling is that it could be justified to spend 100$ for this. But I have no detail knowledge about our bank account
SeveWe could have the badge on our website which is cool
nyco_s/badge/character/
nyco_:)
SeveNo, they generate a badge, Nyco
flowWe could also ask members to help with the funding, if it's a problem
ralphmI also should point out that Bronze level is not unique, that's only for Silver and Gold.
nyco_the badges for compliance are coming
which will improve our visuals
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flowralphm, IIRC only gold is unique
flowbut silver limited to 5 or so
ralphmoh, ok
flowwhile bronze is unlimited
nyco_https://xmpp.org/community/sponsorship.html no bronze
pep.not this bronze
nyco_oh waut
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flowralphm, re the terminology, "adopt a character" is how unicode.org calls it
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Seveflow: do you know by any chance other communities that did this?
flowbut anyhow, appeared like a cheap way to get some visibility and it's for a non-profit that we benefit from, soo
ralphmI know of one company that went crazy with this, by the way: https://www.elastic.co/blog/elastic-love-for-the-adopt-a-character-program-and-the-unicode-consortium
nyco_instead of sponsors money, indeed we can even make a small crowdfunding campaign, which brings visibility as well, allows us to measure somehow our attractiveness
ralphmflow: my 😜 wasn't obvious?
Danielnot sure how visible you really are among 600 other bronze sponsers. that feels like a go big or go home situation (where you really want gold). and gold feels too expensive for us
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dwdralphm, Is that the emoji we're adopting?
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Seve> not sure how visible you really are among 600 other bronze sponsers. that feels like a go big or go home situation (where you really want gold). and gold feels too expensive for us
That's my "issue"
pep.I agree with Daniel
ralphmdwd: this is not my suggestion, no
nyco_it is not about visibility among sponsors, it is about us generating original content and gettings relayed and engage the communities
ralphmBut if you'd want to do it in a big way, you'd adopt < and >
ralphmAt Gold level
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flowhehe
nyco_the chat bubble at bronze level will do
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dwdMy view, BTW, is that adopting is worth a punt at the $100 mark, and we can make some noise about it ourselves. It's just an interesting talking point at that level, but a talking point is always useful.
flowMy biggest fear is that one of your competitors shows off by adopting more and expensive characters
nyco_we communicate on our channels, our competitors don't come on our channels
SeveI like the idea and would love if somebody among us was motivates enough for this, to write a blog post about how much we like making a donation and adopting a character. For me is really a +1, just that I don't find myself inspired enough about the whole unicode world to promote it properly
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nyco_also, let's focus on ourselves, our future, how we serve our people
Danielif you want something to tweet pay for drinks and/or dinner at the next developer sprint and we get you pictures of happy developers developing xmpp
nyco_looking at competition is a waste of time, makes you feel bad/good
nyco_that can be done anyway
nyco_dudes drinking beer is not funny nor attractive btw
Seve> My biggest fear is that one of your competitors shows off by adopting more and expensive characters
Surely they can afford it, so yeah, but we would be first as well
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pep.> to write a blog post about how much we like making a donation and adopting a character.
Tbh I see this easily criticized.. "XMPP don't have anything better to do? They could fix their protocol instead"
pep.(Not by Matrix obviously)
nyco_there, you named it! :)
nyco_the same could be said to any char sponsor
pep.nyco_, yes
nyco_what do people actually say on Elastic for example?
nyco_quite sure we don't care about _potential_ negativity
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dwdpep., You realise people say that stuff *anyway*, right?
SeveExactly
ralphmindeed
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pep.dwd, yeah
ralphmI see enough support for asking the community what character they'd like to see adopted
nyco_let's make short blog post, a call for funding, we offer the bubble bronze, that's 100€
we see how the community responds to this
we move on, or not
if we do, a second blog post to announce the bubble is ours in a funny way
Kev🐑
ralphmKev: that's you suggestion?
nyco_how does it work to collect donations from the community?
Kevralphm: Well, ask a Welshman :)
ralphmDude we have Texel
Ge0rGI'm still in favor of the light bulb
SeveI'm not
dwdGuys, I'd humbly suggest you just pick something (chat bubble sounds good) and do it. No real need to ask the community.
Ge0rGis there a bike shedding emoji?
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nyco_not lighbulb, it's Jabber, it dates from the XXth century
SeveCorrect
ralphmThe rules are here: https://home.unicode.org/adopt-a-character/sponsorship/
nyco_we could list candidates, but the chat bubble is pretty obvious and expecetd
Zashdwd: :D
ralphmdwd
ralphmI suggested < and > above
nyco_given the popularity of XML...
KevI suggest (as Dave) that if Board want to do this, just come up with something and do it :)
ZashMake XML great again!
ralphmI like 🗪 U+1F5EA
ralphmZash: thanks for the swag idea there
Ge0rGI still think we would have to make it a bikeshed emoji, but there are no bikeshed emojis, and the closest term would be yak shaving, but there are no yak emoji, only water buffalos.
KevGe0rG: Can we propose a new modifier for the water buffalo?
Ge0rGralphm: it's nice, except that it's not yet widely supported
KevBut FWIW, I think ralphm's suggestion of U+1F5EA is cute.
ralphmGe0rG: well, we are progressive
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KevAnd it's nice to have something that if we include it in JIDs will break the network ;p
Ge0rG> Copy
🚩 This Unicode character has no emoji version, meaning this is intended to display only as a black and white glyph on most platforms.
nyco_ok, it's 16:09, the meeting has been sabotaged by the floor! :)
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ralphmnyco_: ehem, somebody asked for input by the community
ralphmBut I agree we are done for today.
nyco_oh...
nyco_I don't know who
ralphmBoard: let's all think about our preference and hammer it next week.
dwdFor those without a decent font, like me: Unicode Character 'TWO SPEECH BUBBLES' (U+1F5EA) https://www.fileformat.info/info/unicode/char/1F5EA/index.htm
ralphmdwd: see my tweet for help
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Ge0rGralphm: your help is not universally applicabl
Ge0rGralphm: your help is not universally applicable
ralphm6. AOB
nyco_nope
SeveNone here
ralphmGe0rG: you could at least look at it in more detail, and see that the second link actually is for the most part.
ralphm7. Date of Next
ralphm+1W
nyco_+1
ralphm8. Close
ralphmThanks Daniel for the minutes.
ralphmAnd thanks everyone else, too.
ralphmbangs gavel
MattJThanks
SeveThank you for the meeting, got a bit off topic though :D
nyco_thanks, merci !
Danielwhat's 'POSS' by the way?
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dwdDaniel, Paris Open Source Summit
pep.Paris Open-Source Summit
Danieli see. thanks
Danielisn’t that scam then?
Danielshouldn’t we at some point merge scam and comm?
Danieland make it 'outreach' or something?
pep.Yeah I'm of this opinion as well
dwdDaniel, There's certainly a lot of crossover.
Ge0rGshouldn't that be decided by the respective teams?
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ralphmWell, I generally just do SCAM, and I prefer that
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ralphmThere is no reason why work teams can't work together
MattJI'd also prefer it to be able to just set these teams a budget, and let them discuss unicode character options for hours
pep.Indeed
KevThat seems rather sensible.
pep.I think it's somewhat wasted time for board
ralphmSCAM already has a budget
MattJIt feels like a lot of trivial stuff trickles up to Board these days
Danielwe have a budget?
pep.TIL
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KevOoh, XSF trivia Kev didn't know.
MattJYes, we set one for SCAM
Danieloh we do
pep.cool.
peterFYI last night we got paid for GSoC, so we now have an extra $4800.00 in the bank account. Don't spend it all on Unicode characters! ;-)
ralphmIt is $1000/yr
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ralphmpeter: hehe
Zashralphm: for gold?
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Danielnow we have to spend it all so we can get it raised for next year (that's how budgets work, right?)
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pep.indeed
pep."See, we need moar"
Zash"You have money left? Better reduce next years budget by that then"
Ge0rGthat should be enough for Gold on <🗪>
Ge0rGi.e. all three of them
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Ge0rGno wait, just for silver :(
KevSee, *do* need more.
dwdI would actually be very happy to see more money spent on outreach in general.
ralphmZash: for SCAM. https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/members/2017-September/008648.html
Danielpep. and I actually wanted to spend money on scam a couple of times. but we didn’t know we had a budget
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ZashAh
Ge0rGdwd: I offer to loudly proclaim "XMPP" in the shopping mall in my home city for just 250$/hr
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pep.I'm not sure I would do that even at this price
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ralphmDaniel: well, every time people have asked about money (like for stickers) I said: yes, send the bill to peter
MattJpep., words true of real XMPP developer :)
pep.:D
Ge0rGpep.: I was trying to think of the lowest-effort thing that qualifies as "outreach for money" that doesn't immediately qualify as a SCAM
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Danielralphm, sure. i just wasn’t really aware that those came out of the scam budget
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dwdGe0rG, Unicode characters?
ZashLet's start a "sponsor an xmlns" campain! /notentirelyserious
Ge0rGdwd: this results in being placed on some well-hidden web-page. We can have that already for free.
ralphmDaniel: well, we haven't really been strict and make a financial overview
ralphmmost of the money is spent on the Summit / FOSDEM and that $1000 is a nice target
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jonas’14:03:38 dwd> MattJ, Could we sponsor U+FFFD then?
ralphmstpeter: if you are kinda here, have you seen my mail over at xmpp@ietf.org regarding Unicode versions?
jonas’I literally laughed out loudly, in a fiendish laugh. Thanks for that one.
peterralphm: I did see your note among the other ~10k unread messages. ;-) I'll need focused time to spool up all that i18n context again, hopefully tomorrow.
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ralphmpeter: 👍
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Ge0rGflow: so, what's the official way to process messages? A ChatManager?
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dwdWhat's the response to a MAM request which matches no messages?
pep.https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/409 should this be to board? Is seems there is no place on the website where CC or Creative Commons is mentioned apart in specific places like IPR changelog, or a blog post I can't find the url for
pep.*sent to board
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pep.Also as mentioned earlier in the board meeting, https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/594 DOAP. Maybe Link Mauve can chime in next board meeting if we put it on the agenda
pep.(Is all that handled by board, or anybody else?)
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dwdpep., Licensing is Board, DOAP... Might be? Probably is, but they may bump it straight to whoever is looking after the website.
pep.Who is looking after the website?
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pep.(Editors surely have commit rights, does that make them "looking after the website"?)
jonas’I don’t think that editors have commit rights per-se?
ZashI suspect it's Board
nyco_pep. add PR 409 to the board Trello board
nyco_thx
pep.I don't have a trello account, can you put it there in the meantime(?)
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nyco_you put it there
nyco_oops
nyco_my mistake
jonas’will do
nyco_> pep. add PR 409 to the board Trello board
pep. added PR 409 to the board Trello board
nyco_forgot the past tense
pep.oh
nyco_jonas’ it's added
jonas’ok
nyco_sorry
pep.I didn't, probably somebody did for me
nyco_I did
pep.cool thanks
nyco_thx to you for raising it
pep.I'm also interested about DOAP
pep.If you can add that one as well :)
pep.At least know who's responsability that is
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nyco_well... not sure
pep.Can we put this on the agenda so it gets decided who's responsible to say yes or no?
pep.Also I got myself an account, pep@bouah.net
dwdUltimately, everything outside a XEP is Board.
nyco_pep. I have add_ED_ the item to the board's board
pep.Ah ok thank you :)
nyco_dwd : and the board does not know/want, it's for the iteam
Kevdwd: Well, mostly. Technical is still the domain of Council, even when non-XEP. E.g. technical direction. But mostly.
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pep.Do I need to be invited to the trello board? Should I be able to write stuff already?
pep.Trello is fighting me so that I create my first board atm, I don't think I need that
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dwdralphm, I have read, and carefully considered, your email to xmpp@ietf.
dwdralphm, It raises many interesting challenges.
dwdralphm, My response is as follows:
dwdralphm, That's a bit shit isn't it?
ZashEverything is terrible. News at 11.
ralphmdwd: quite
dwdralphm, Didn't we discuss having a domain fully responsible for its own canonicalization at one point?
ZashLike email?
dwdralphm, I've a vague recollection that Kurt Zeilenga suggested it could be used to canonicalize "Western Names" for Chinese people into the proper form, etc.
dwdZash, Like email but more so. We'd need a canonicalization service, I imagine.
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Ge0rGdwd [20:35]:
> ralphm, Didn't we discuss having a domain fully responsible for its own canonicalization at one point?
What if that domain is malicious and sends major violations to us? Not looking at conference.jabber.org at all
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jonas’Ge0rG, hand it to the SPAM WG?
ralphmdwd: maybe there's a sane strategy, but I'm unaware of one and it surely isn't documented clearly anywhere.
Ge0rGjonas’: no, what I mean is: what if it crashes clients or causes nasal demons?
jonas’that’s client bugs
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Ge0rGRight, it's presumptuous to assume that the server won't give us JIDs with quotes in them
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jonas’yes
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jubalhguys, does https://github.com/dino/dino/commit/e84f2c49567e86d2a261ea264d65c4adc549c930 mean that 'from' always needs to be there?
jonas’jubalh, it depends on your stream layer
jonas’on the wire, the @from may also be omitted
jubalhbecause we have: https://github.com/profanity-im/profanity/blob/master/src/xmpp/roster.c#L215 right now
jubalhwhere we only test if equals barejid if from is there
jonas’that’s correct
jonas’if @from is absent, it’s to be treated as equivalent to your account bare JID
jonas’RFC 6120 something
jonas’(on inbound stanzas, obviously)
jubalhalright, thanks!
jonas’ 3. When the server generates a stanza from the server for delivery
to the client on behalf of the account of the connected client
(e.g., in the context of data storage services provided by the
server on behalf of the client), the stanza MUST either (a) not
include a 'from' attribute or (b) include a 'from' attribute
whose value is the account's bare JID (<localpart@domainpart>).
jonas’some client libraries will alias absent @from to the bare JID for easier handling in client code
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ZashI tried removing redundant @to/@from at the server. IIRC some clients didn't appreciate it.
Ge0rGjubalh: some servers will do crazy things on messages inside of Carbons, at least for messages to your own JID
DanielYes that check in Dino has the potential to go boom. Because null is valid
DanielBut most servers do set it
Ge0rGI wish that'd be something the underlying xmpp would take care of
DanielSo it's fine ™
ralphmjonas’: the thing I was talking about with dwd is a bit more involved though, as per that email
Ge0rGDaniel: send a message to self on prosody 0.10 IIRC
ralphmEven if server do saner things, you still have issues with differing Unicode versions.
ralphms
ZashMyeah, prosody internally removes @to on stanzas to the account.
DanielGe0rG: yes I'm just saying that this particular check in Dino (around carbons) will be fine most of the time
DanielBut yeah if you do it properly you also want to accept null
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larmaDaniel, you missed the part where dino will automatically inject the correct value of from if it's messing
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DanielOk
jubalhjonas’, can I somehow convince you to implement XEP-0392 in Profanity? ;) I heard you did it in poezio
Ge0rGSo I have a JID getter wrapper that gets passed the appropriate default value for where it is called on.