Ge0rGHey, looks like two XEPs were born last night
emuswhich one?
pep.Message moderation and Message retraction
emussomething for the newsletter?
pep.Still needs editor work, they're in the inbox for now
pep.Sure
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flowpubsub/pep experts: Is it normal that I receive a notification twice on publication: http://paste.debian.net/1107636/ ?
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MattJNo, I don't think so
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nycoare we gonna reach the quorum today?
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nycoanyone?
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nycoanyway, a contact just pointed me to: https://www.libremonde.org a fork of Matrix protocol
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edhelaswe should fork Matrix and move it to XML into TCP sockets
nycooh sh*t, good idea!
nycowait, what?
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Sevenyco, we didn't have a meeting today :) It was set to +2W
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ZashA *fork*? Ooookay
Zashedhelas, only if we drop the whole idea of being a graph database synchronization protocol, simple message passing should be enough for every need.
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ZashRe Stickers, I'm reminded that https://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0038.xml is a thing that exists
Seve"the recent trend of using graphics" - that's funny
ZashMattJ: I thought `@bob.xmpp.org` was just a fixed string that served no purpose whatsoever.
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MattJuh, maybe you're right
MattJThat does indeed seem a bit limiting, that you can't refer to data held by another entity
ZashAnd based on scanning the examples in the RFC that defines cid: it's just a namespace
ZashBetter switch to ni://
Zashaka https://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc6920
ZashMattJ: Also, it'd be kinda bad to leak your JID to xmpp:bob.xmpp.org or whatever you put as authority there.
MattJChoose: A) leak JID to sender-chosen XMPP entity B) leak IP address to sender-chosen HTTP server
MattJAlso deployment of a BoB proxy should be far easier than deployment of a (secure) HTTP proxy alongside every XMPP server
ZashC) Steal Matrix thing where every server downloads and re-hosts every uploaded file?
ZashOr D) Provide a proxy that knows how to handle some magic new URL by proxying to the original HTTP Upload service.
ZashE) Declare that XMPP is for text chat, y'all gtfo with your graphics. Also let's go back to ASCII. 😛
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lovetoxwhy not just promote available packs via pubsub
lovetoxalso update of packs via pubsub
lovetoxand clients can download the packs and use them from their server
lovetoxservers should look by itself that they support the most common ones
lovetoxand just communicate the hashes to other users
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ZashBoB over PubSub?
ZashActually, just BoB + extensive caching is probably good enough.
ZashLet me tell y'all about Link Mauves mod_bob
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Ge0rGZash: you forgot F) Implement a content addressable URI scheme
Ge0rGAlso a DHT and a torrent based distribution system.
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lovetoxZash i think BoB does not cut it
lovetoxyes it can transfer a sticker
lovetoxbut realisticly you want sticker packs
lovetoxdistributet by the server
lovetoxyou can use bob to transfer the hash
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lovetoxso maybe this could be its own XEP the distribution of the sticker packs
Zashxep-0038 but modern?
lovetoxyeah on pubsub, so server can notify clients if there are updates or new packs
lovetoxthen we use bob or something to reference the hash
Ge0rGWhat do we need sticker packs for if we can have 0392 colored Emoji?
lovetoxand if its not found you can query the server for the the hash if he has a pack for that
ZashTho that doesn't solve all the privacy issues.
lovetoxyeah what issue do you see?
lovetoxi only communicate with my server
Ge0rGlovetox: you just invented copyright violation
ZashHow do I get to see the stickers?
ZashCan I do that without talking to your server, which then learns my JID?
ZashAssuming MUC or somesuch
lovetoxZash, either your server has a pack for that or you dont
lovetoxyes, servers should sync packs themself
lovetoxif your server just has no pack for that hash, you just cant display it
lovetoxend of story
lovetoxGe0rG, nobody forces a server admin to distrubte packs that they are not allowed to
Ge0rGlovetox: so people switch to the server where the admin bought the most sticker packs?
lovetoxmaybe, if thats important to them
lovetoxhey im just brainstorm here, im even to lazy to use a emoji, far away from using a sticker
Ge0rGThat's the same incentive system as running a tor exit node
Ge0rGYou don't need stickers if you just render Emoji large enough
Ge0rG😜
pep.It seems I'm missing out on the stickers thread..
lovetoxstickers exist because people dont want to be limited by the unicode consortium
lovetoxi agree you could probably get away with that for some time
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lovetoxbut at the end someone wants to introduce their own stickers
lovetoxand then you have to tell them, not possible
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Ge0rGI tell them: purpose to the unicode consortium!
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Zashlovetox, if you separate the distribution into its own thing (wasn't there a xep for file sharing already?) then this sounds a lot like xep-0038, ie a standardized zip file layout with icons/stickers in it
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lovetoxZash this does only describe the pack format
lovetoxi dont see anything about distribution
lovetoxand also its ancient, not sure what we gain from reusing this
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Zashancient doesn't have to mean bad (or good) but it doesn't hurt to make sure one at least triest to learn from previous attempts
Zashand not having distribution is precisly why I wrote "if you separate the distribution into its own thing", ie it's not there, it needs to come from elsewhere or be invented
Zashhttps://xmpp.org/extensions/xep-0329.xml
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lovetoxyeah but not needed
lovetoxjust publish a http link on pubusub
lovetox10 times easier than that
lovetoxand i doubt servers will implement jingle for this
ZashI though 329 was something in pubsub, but it seems not.