XSF Discussion - 2019-11-18

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  154. edhelas https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21562261 got a few remarks about XMPP there
  155. edhelas it's on HN first page
  156. MattJ Nice :)
  157. Holger edhelas: Funny remark about the name, never thought of a Vim fork 🙂
  158. Holger And wasn't aware of the acronym.
  159. edhelas Actually Vim is a fork of Movim 🤫
  160. Holger Vim is what happens if you rewrite Movim in C?
  161. edhelas yup, we also ported the "can't escape feature", we call it the "Schrödinger's MUC presence"
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  163. Zash edhelas: Have you tried not mentioning XMPP some time, see how people react?
  164. edhelas "is it based on Matrix" :p ?
  165. edhelas but yes it's an idea, I'm also presenting the project as a simple "communication platform" when i feel that the whole XMPP thing is too technical
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  167. edhelas JSON in websockets https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21563294 \o/ here we go
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  171. pep. Of course the hardest part is the XML we all know
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  217. MattJ edhelas, I second Zash's suggestion - you'll observe that >90% of the discussion is related to XMPP, and almost none of it is about Movim or any of the things Movim can do
  218. MattJ HN is a specific type of audience who have a love/hate relationship with XMPP - but as far as Movim is concerned, I don't think any of that baggage is very relevant
  219. pep. yeah
  220. pep. Well it's also compatible with Sàt
  221. MattJ Say it is built on top of the XMPP network, or supports federation via XMPP, or whatever
  222. MattJ in the small print on the website
  223. pep. yeah. Also what I have in mind
  224. MattJ But "XMPP client" in the title is just asking for people to judge the project based on what their prior experience of XMPP is, not their experience of Movim
  225. pep. One has to recognize that XMPP is not good branding in the open world
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  228. jonas’ or what they think other people’s experience with XMPP was.
  229. MattJ Funny that the rest of the discussion that is relevant to Movim is about how the name is too easily confused with vim, and must be changed if at all possible
  230. MattJ I can see that really confusing my family members if I set it up for them
  231. edhelas MattJ thanks for the feedback, next time I'll remove the XMPP mention and see how it goes yeah :)
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  234. MattJ Also see https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21563600
  235. pep. I think this uses ConverseJS. Converse is not a full featured client on its own, and will require your own websocket-enabled proxy most of the time since BOSH is rarely enabled." people being wrong on the internet..
  236. Zash FUD, on HN? Never!
  237. MattJ edhelas, in any case, I haven't said it yet - congratulations :)
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  241. pep. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=21564191
  242. pep. MattJ, ^ :P
  243. MattJ :)
  244. Zash Yeah, grats edhelas
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  246. pep. pff, it got below the whole XMPP debate again..
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  300. David Cridland https://dev.to/dwd/sending-a-message-mmc <-- Comments and corrections welcome.
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  305. pep. english question: "everywhere where", is this common?
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  309. David Cridland Hmmm. I can probably make that "everywhere", indeed.
  310. moparisthebest I think so yes
  311. David Cridland Done, thanks.
  312. moparisthebest I meant I think that's common, but yea can be removed too
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  315. Ge0rG David Cridland: sent you some remarks in private. Also your examples are missing the obvious situation when one message is MIA and the follow-up message gets chat-marker-acked
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  323. David Cridland Ge0rG, I think the principle is that we know if this is likely to have happened via '198 etc.
  324. Ge0rG David Cridland: if we only had s2s 0198
  325. David Cridland I think we do.
  326. Ge0rG In theory only
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  331. David Cridland There's some questions over resumption, I think, but the basic acking service is solid (and in principle, the need for resumption should be much less).
  332. Ge0rG David Cridland: in principle.
  333. Ge0rG In practice, I'm experiencing multi-hour unidirectional failures between my server and muc.xmpp.org
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  336. Ge0rG And all messages sent during such a failure are lost.
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  404. pep. dwd, is that another take on https://dev.to/dwd/two-generals-8l5 btw?
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  462. David Cridland pep., Basically. But better written (I hope) and hopefully more encouraging toward XMPP.
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  466. David Cridland Loosely, I think XMPP is "winning" the space I'm calling "Critical Messaging", and I think we can capitalize on this (and move outward into other spaces from there, too).
  467. David Cridland So discussing message reliability and things through this lens is, I think, a useful marketing message.
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  484. Ge0rG David Cridland: what's the target audience? Military contractors?
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  486. Ge0rG I still think that we need more high profile users of xmpp listed on our pages
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  490. David Cridland Ge0rG, No, more the crowd that thinks "Well, if it's good enough for...". And yes, it'd be great to get some case studies from high-profile names.
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  504. B311 131 i got also problems to talk with Ge0rG and his manyorhernames
  505. B311 (i could doxx right now)
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  510. Ge0rG B311: unfortunately, most of my contact info is public, and I only use one name.
  511. Ge0rG Oh. Too late.
  512. Tracer(Traceur) Ge0rG: hi
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  515. Tracer(Traceur) i guess u mis red my message Ge0rG
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  518. Ge0rG Surely I did
  519. David Cridland Tracer(Traceur), You appear to be threatening to publish private data on an individual, is that not what you meant?
  520. Tracer(Traceur) i do?
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  523. Tracer(Traceur) let's ask an `admin` M.
  524. pep. If there was sarcasm involved I must have missed it
  525. Tracer(Traceur) wie z.B. der gute K3v
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  528. Tracer(Traceur) 0der !Martin
  529. Tracer(Traceur) ausm `kuketz-blog` ne'
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  532. Ge0rG Tracer(Traceur): sorry, I'm not a participant of that community, I just lack the time
  533. Tracer(Traceur) Ge0rG: be sorry for that bullshit you serve to this community
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  536. Ge0rG Yeah, everybody in the XSF hates me.
  537. Tracer(Traceur) Ge0rG: No way
  538. pep. What's all this ad hominem for? early christmas?
  539. Guus wanders in, frowns.
  540. Guus What did I miss?
  541. Guus (I liked the article, dwd)
  542. Ge0rG pep.: I have no idea.. Apparently somebody thinks I'm somebody else
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  545. moparisthebest well that is such a unique name there can only be one in the entire world right?
  546. Zash "my commonName is globally unique" something something X.500 joke
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  548. Guus Don't get me started
  549. Guus I've been battling LDAP all day
  550. Guus Well, LDAPs escaping JNDI escaped Java's escaped slashes
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  552. Guus That was fun
  553. Zash So much escaping, the slash escapes into your mind!
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  556. jonas’ escaping hell
  557. jonas’ my favourite of that would be the tab-completion zsh does with fusermount -u
  558. jonas’ which somehow manages to replace ` 0` in a path with an actual nul byte. on the terminal.
  559. jonas’ I don’t think I want to know what goes wrong *there*
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  567. David Cridland Ge0rG, He's not annoyed about Jar Jar Binks is he? I could understand that.
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  571. Ge0rG David Cridland: you can blame me for many things, but not for Jar Jar.
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  614. !XSF_Martin > 0der !Martin > ausm `kuketz-blog` ne' Wow, but I would be more impressed if you threat to doxx me if I would not be using my real name on my websites and git repos...
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  642. Tracer(Traceur) !XSF_Martin: no martin
  643. Tracer(Traceur) id doxx " Savant " aka CrYpToWl
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  645. 8311 :
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