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flow
08:34:42
larma, congrats to the 0.1 release of dino :)
edhelas
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yeah, congrats 🎉 :)
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!XSF_Martin
08:48:38
Happy release day 🎂
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marc
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🍾
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rion
18:27:27
Are there any time limitations for receiving iq result/error?
Zash
18:28:09
In theory not
moparisthebest
18:29:02
heat death of the universe
Zash
18:30:34
Not receiving a response is a protocol violation
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Ge0rG
18:45:45
Zash: and therefore it can't happen!
Zash
18:46:23
Correct!
Ge0rG
18:46:33
rion: the real question is - what do you do with the iq result that arrives after you already went into the timeout handler?
Ge0rG
18:47:50
I think that we need to fundamentally change the semantics at the API layer, where you have a timeout only giving an indication that it's taking very long now, but not removing the actual response handler.
Ge0rG
18:48:09
OTOH, we had a handler leak in poezio just because of that
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rion
18:56:57
Yep. it's what worries me. Assuming I have an app which runs for a very long time.
rion
18:57:56
And I mostly merge Psi+ to Psi. Only one patch left, which introduces the timeout
Zash
18:59:15
A recently added thing to track IQ stanzas in Prosody (sent by the server itself, not clients) has a default timeout of 2 minutes
rion
18:59:18
As far as I understand it has to be very use-case specific. For example for legacy FT a request can wait for a confirmation for hours if not days.
rion
19:01:14
Requesting conferences' list on slow connection sometimes takes ages. So everything is relative.
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rion
19:05:38
But anyway, it would be nice to have some recommendations about timeouts in the standard and some XEPs
moparisthebest
19:06:09
it probably needs to vary wildly based on what you are doing
rion
19:06:27
Agree
moparisthebest
19:06:40
if you are writing a system designed to talk over satellites it's going to need to be much higher than if you are developing a system to talk between servers on the same 10gbe network
moparisthebest
19:07:00
but yea, recommendations for "normal chat clients" would surely be a good idea
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jonas’
19:15:47
timeouts are always wrong :(
lovetox
19:16:47
my idea is to not have timeouts
lovetox
19:17:06
for IQs, rather i pass the application a cancel handle
lovetox
19:17:38
The Application knows best when it does not make any sense anymore to process the response
lovetox
19:18:15
so it uses the cancel handle to remove the callback
lovetox
19:19:01
this is also important for if the user cancels the process , does not even mean the IQ did take long
jonas’
19:19:11
true
lovetox
19:19:17
but if he opens some window that triggers fetching a list via IQ, and just closes it agian
lovetox
19:19:27
the application needs to remove the callback response
jonas’
19:19:42
for some automated tasks you’d still want timeouts though
jonas’
19:19:50
for example automated disco#info lookups
jonas’
19:19:56
you don’t want those to accumulate
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lovetox
19:20:30
yeah ..
lovetox
19:20:41
probably timeouts do make sense in some situations
jonas’
19:21:21
in asyncio, you’d simply properly handle cancellation of the IQ request coroutine and thus allow the user to use asyncio.wait or something like that.
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moparisthebest
19:21:50
but it sounds like you are saying your library makes timeouts the application's responsibility? which sounds like the right choice
lovetox
19:22:14
but for IQs you cancel the callback and you are fine
lovetox
19:22:20
more anoying is stuff like
lovetox
19:22:21
muc join
lovetox
19:22:26
where you have no way of tracking
lovetox
19:22:31
you cant cancel a muc join
jonas’
19:22:38
lovetox, you can send presence unavailable
jonas’
19:22:45
effectively removing yourself from the muc right after
lovetox
19:22:46
thats not a cancel
jonas’
19:22:53
you can’t cancel an IQ either
lovetox
19:23:12
no, but i can ignore it with simple dont listen for the callback
lovetox
19:23:18
and i know the id i have to ignore
lovetox
19:23:25
but with mucs, there is no id tracking
lovetox
19:23:35
the muc simply starts to spam me with presence, and even messages
jonas’
19:23:38
you track by from and presence type tho
lovetox
19:23:45
i have to start ignoring the whole jid
jonas’
19:23:50
yeah, and if a MUC does that, you reply with presence type="unavailable" and possibly message type="error"
lovetox
19:24:32
yeah, just saying i find it more annoying, i track now which mucs are in joining state, and if the user clicks abort
lovetox
19:24:42
i simply put the muc jid on the ignore list
lovetox
19:24:45
which is probably wrong
lovetox
19:24:53
because i could get invites from there
lovetox
19:25:23
i think i have the ignore list only for presence
lovetox
19:25:28
not for messages though
lovetox
19:25:59
but you are right, i should respond with presence unavailable
lovetox
19:26:09
but again only on the first presence i receive from that muc
lovetox
19:26:14
which again i have to track
lovetox
19:27:06
what would usefull is, if all join related messages, presence had a join-id attr like we have with mam the queryid attr
lovetox
19:27:46
but k muc is really old
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Every MUC is Schrödinger's Chat.
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