XSF Discussion - 2020-05-02


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  653. lovetox

    flow, i think the reason against text-multi was that most librarys would join all values of a text-multi field

  654. lovetox

    and not pass them as a list of text values

  655. lovetox

    XEP-0004: ... Similarly, an application that receives multiple <value/> elements for a field of type "text-multi" SHOULD merge the XML character data of the value elements into one text block for presentation to a user, with each string separated by a newline character as appropriate for that platform.

  656. lovetox

    and thats also what i would want from a xmpp lib, pass me one text string

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  658. lovetox

    its not hard to do a split(\n) afterwards of course

  659. lovetox

    but not sure if this is more elegant than the <open> solution

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  662. flow

    lovetox, i am not sure if it is sensible for libraries to loose the "this are single values" information by joining the values together

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  664. flow

    I think the text is more meant for the higher layers, hence the "for presentation to a user" part

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  666. flow

    surely otherwise the usage of text-multi in pubsub would be problematic for users of libraries which do not expose those indivdual values at their interface

  667. lovetox

    so what does smacks?

  668. flow

    well, smack keeps the individual values

  669. flow

    just as it does for jid-multi

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  671. flow

    or, fwiw, list-multi

  672. lovetox

    yeah but you cant compare them really

  673. flow

    why should a library suddenly handle, or especially implement, text-multi in a different way than the other *-multi

  674. flow

    why shouldn't I be able to compare different types of form fields?

  675. lovetox

    ok other question, if i set a text-multi field in smacks

  676. lovetox

    do i have to pass a list of values?

  677. flow

    no, there is addValue(CharSequence) and addValues(List<? extends CharSequence)

  678. flow

    but all those append to the list of values

  679. lovetox

    from an application developer standpoint, its not evident why i should split up a string on \n to send it over the wire

  680. lovetox

    i want to pass a string to the lib and it should send it

  681. flow

    right, but this is not related to the question

  682. lovetox

    and on the other side i want my string out

  683. lovetox

    i dont care about xmpp breaking up on \n and send it as multiple values

  684. flow

    ahh, I guess the reason is newline portability

  685. lovetox

    to use your lib, i have to understand XEP-0004, or you write a really good documentation where you tell me i have to join the string afterwards

  686. flow

    so that could be the reason xep4 talks about "newline character as appropriate for that platform"

  687. lovetox

    and at that point i seriously ask myself, why doesnt do smacks that

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  689. flow

    well it is a bit trickier

  690. flow

    if the user ad addValue(CharSequence) with a CharSequence containing a '\n', shall I split it? or does the user want to send it as single value verbatim

  691. flow

    but again, this is nothing which prevents us from using text-multi in mam

  692. lovetox

    nobody said it prevents it

  693. lovetox

    i told you what i heard when they discussed it

  694. lovetox

    and that was one of the things i heard

  695. flow

    so that is what I am interested at most right now, but I am also happy to discuss the text-multi newline UI situation if you want

  696. lovetox

    maybe there are others, but from what i remember it was not a very drawn out decision process

  697. lovetox

    no actually i dont care about that topic, i just wanted to forward my information

  698. lovetox

    im sure MattJ is interested

  699. flow

    but that is also pretty simple: the authors of xep4 basically had two choices: either normalize newline before it is put on the wire, or resort to what they did and split newlines into separte values (if the data is meant for user presentation)

  700. flow

    I actually think I would have gone for the "normalize newline" thing, but this is what we have right now

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  702. lovetox

    i never have that problem

  703. lovetox

    in my gui framework there is no thing as platform specific newlines

  704. lovetox

    if i do a \n in a textview

  705. lovetox

    its a newline, on windows and on linux

  706. flow

    yeah, it was probably a different world when xep4 was written

  707. lovetox

    its probably a problem if i would save the value to a textfile, which is opend by other apps maybe

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  718. MattJ

    IMHO an XMPP library should abstract XMPP, and application devs shouldn't need to be familiar with the representation of multiline strings on the wire

  719. MattJ

    Therefore it is entirely reasonable for a library with a dataforms API to perform the newline splitting/joining itself

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