XSF Discussion - 2020-09-12

  1. Link Mauve

    Pidgin does, as well as Papaya!

  2. Link Mauve

    (I wrote the implementation of the latter.)

  3. guus.der.kinderen

    ... what is Papaya (excuse the ignorance)?

  4. Link Mauve

    A XUL-based client Sonny and I and a bunch of other people were working on, some decade ago.

  5. mdosch

    As MUC spam is becoming more frequent, is there something like xep 0377 for MUCs?

  6. MattJ

    No, we should add it

  7. mdosch

    I guess it's more complicated for MUCs but yeah. πŸ˜ƒ

  8. pep.

    I don't think it's much more complex

  9. pep.

    at least not the signaling

  10. pep.

    larma, 441/442 are now in github. I hope I didn't break all of jonas' workflow, but both repos are in sync now :x

  11. larma

    pep., thanks!

  12. eevvoor

    Someone tries to advertise sth named XMPP SW at amazon: https://www.amazon.de/XMPP-Standards-Foundation-All-Inclusive-Self-Assessment/dp/B079Y7BWGH/ref=sr_1_7?__mk_de_DE=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&dchild=1&keywords=xmpp&qid=1599907562&sr=8-7

  13. eevvoor

    We should report on it?

  14. eta

    eevvoor, that sounds like it was generated using GPT-3

  15. pep.

    doesn't make much sense indeed

  16. pep.

    and it's not published as the XSF so..

  17. wurstsalat

    Wow, big buzzword bingo

  18. pep.

    "yay XSF made it to buzzwords"? :p

  19. wurstsalat

    "Implement evidence-based best practice strategies aligned with overall goals" - wat

  20. vanitasvitae

    Its hotword replacement

  21. emus

    Anyone has an Amazon account reporting this? I can try after the weekend?

  22. pep.

    emus, why would we report it

  23. emus

    Because we understand thats fake

  24. pep.

    Not because they mention "XSF" right?

  25. Zash

    Oh boy, let's spend a few hours discussing the true meaning of "fake" ! :D

  26. pep.

    emus, nobody is saying they are the XSF, they're just using the words. I don't see an issue with that

  27. wurstsalat

    What's the purpose of it? I don't get it? Is it spam-to-buy?

  28. Zash


  29. Zash

    Algorithms generating all sorts of weird things and throwing it up on Amazon has been a thing for a while now as I understand.

  30. Zash

    So, why not some word-salad containing "XSF"?

  31. mdosch

    Looking for news about xmpp I found paywall sites were the text is encrypted with some Cesar Chiffre I guess and that salad contained xmpp. πŸ™„

  32. Zash

    I like how when I search for "xep nnnn" sometimes I get Vietnamese pages in the results πŸ˜€οΈ

  33. emus

    Im gonna report it as it obviously is some weird stuff misguiding or generated

  34. eevvoor

    Thx in advance emus. I am too busy atm.

  35. debacle

    If I had an Amazon account, I would give an enthusiastic review of the book now. Mainly the "Dynamically auto-prioritized projects-ready RACI Matrix" helped me to overcome all my weaknesses. Waiter, more raki Matrix, please!

  36. debacle

    If I had an Amazon account, I would give an enthusiastic review of the book/CD now. Mainly the "Dynamically auto-prioritized projects-ready RACI Matrix" helped me to overcome all my weaknesses. Waiter, more raki Matrix, please!

  37. Zash

    Use ML text salad generator to write reviews

  38. debacle

    ANFSCD: In 2003, it was considered cool to inform contacts about the music one were listening in that moment. JEP-0118: User Tune was born. Some years later, I still like to use this feature, but I feel, that the XEP needs some love.

  39. debacle

    E.g. it says: > This specification defines a payload format for communicating information about music to which a user is listening, including the title, track number, collection, performer, composer, length, and user rating. But the tags for "performer" and "composer" are not in the spec.

  40. debacle

    Personally, I'm missing "performer", "genre", and "date", but "composer" and "lyricist" were handy, too.

  41. debacle

    Also, I wonder whether "rating" is mandatory or optional in the XML schema. It should be optional.

  42. Zash

    Aren't there XML based metadata formats? Could prooooobably namespace ninja it in there if you really wanted.

  43. debacle

    Currently, the XEP is probably nice for pop music, but lacking for jazz, classical, folklore etc.

  44. debacle

    Zash, might be. I'm not aware of any.

  45. debacle

    Zash, might be. I'm not aware of any XML meta format for audio tags.

  46. debacle

    It seems to be the intention of this XEP to include such information and it is easier just to add a couple of elements (esp. in existing implementations) than to invent something new.

  47. flow

    debacle, feel free to submit PRs against the XEP :)

  48. debacle

    flow, yes, this is a simple one ;-)

  49. Zash

    debacle: https://id3.org/id3v2.4.0-frames

  50. lovetox

    debacle, don’t do lyrics

  51. lovetox

    its possible a huge amount of data to send over pep

  52. lovetox

    also i would question if this really makes sense, you want to tell your contacts the music you are listen too, not send them the lyrics

  53. lovetox

    also what would they do with the lyrics without the music

  54. Zash

    pep-broadcast each line of the lyrics!!!1!

  55. eevvoor

    I disagree, for some music it takes you hours to find the lyrics. It is just plaintext in the end. Why not mirror the id3tags, they also include a ridiculuous long lyrics field. If we just mirror anyway, lets mirror or it entirely.

  56. debacle

    Zash, I'm aware of *that* "standard". It is very funny in respect to the selection of musical genres. E.g. it differentiates between "Industrial" and "Techno-Industrial", or "Gangsta" and "Christian Rap", but puts all 1001 classical subgenres into "Classical", does not even mention "Tango" or "Swing" or "Bolero". I'm pretty sure, that the author of the standard was minor at the time of authorship and did not discuss it with scholars of music, not even their music teacher.

  57. eevvoor

    oh, id3tags define which genres exist?

  58. eevvoor

    Then ... I disagree with my opinion above.

  59. Zash

    debacle, I meant more as a reference of what types of tags to consider

  60. debacle

    Zash lovetox I will propose "composer", "date", "language", "lyricist", and "performer".

  61. debacle

    I don't think it makes sense to mirror all kind of possible tags in this context, nor lyrics. eevvoor

  62. debacle

    IMHO, those five make a lot of sense and cerainly not add much traffic.

  63. debacle

    Forgot "genre", sorry!

  64. lovetox

    debacle, but check if they are available via mpris

  65. debacle


  66. debacle

    performer and language are not yet available in MPRIS, all the others are

  67. debacle


  68. lovetox

    whats the difference between artist and performer

  69. debacle

    lovetox Probably depends on usage, which is not 100 % standardised.

  70. debacle

    In jazz, I use artist e.g. for an orchestra and performer for the singer or solist.

  71. Zash

    Think a recording of an orchestra performing some Mozart piece

  72. eevvoor

    πŸ™„ misusage of tags :D debacle

  73. debacle

    ARTIST The artist generally considered responsible for the work. In popular music this is usually the performing band or singer. For classical music it would be the composer. For an audio book it would be the author of the original text. PERFORMER The artist(s) who performed the work. In classical music this would be the conductor, orchestra, soloists. In an audio book it would be the actor who did the reading. In popular music this is typically the same as the ARTIST and is omitted.

  74. debacle

    source: https://xiph.org/vorbis/doc/v-comment.html

  75. debacle

    lovetox I already wrote an email to the MPRIS author/maintainer about adding performer and language to MPRIS. Let's see, what they will respond. If they responds.

  76. debacle


  77. eevvoor

    debacle, πŸ‘