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mdosch
08:19:57
Some iteam members present? https://mail.jabber.org/pipermail/operators/ seems to be offline. At least I can't reach it.
mdosch
08:21:16
Meh, once you complain out of a sudden it works again. :-/
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eevvoor
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mdosch, yeah, the presentation phenomenon ;)
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flow
09:08:53
jonas’> MattJ, note that XML forbids control characters, even in escaped form
Do you have a reference for me?
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flow
09:10:10
I just tried to find the corresponding part via a quick look at the XML 1.0 spec, but failed. I very well believe that something like that could be in there
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MattJ
10:02:17
flow, https://www.w3.org/TR/REC-xml/#sec-references
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MattJ
10:03:05
"Character references" (i.e. &#nnn; escapes) are only allowed to represent legal characters
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flow
10:05:16
MattJ, "Legal characters are tab, carriage return, line feed, and the legal characters of Unicode and ISO/IEC 10646"
flow
10:05:41
not sure (yet) if this definition of "legal character" includes e.g. control characters
MattJ
10:05:58
"Characters referred to using character references MUST match the production for Char."
MattJ
10:06:10
Char ::= #x9 | #xA | #xD | [#x20-#xD7FF] | [#xE000-#xFFFD] | [#x10000-#x10FFFF]
flow
10:06:14
ahh
flow
10:06:56
so I guess everyhing that does not match this production, must be escaped via JSON escaping
MattJ
10:07:01
Yes
flow
10:07:34
although I could image that it could be disputed if "\u0007" is valid in JSON
flow
10:07:42
but that's not our discussion :)
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flow
10:16:14
now i wonder if there are code points that are legal in XML 1.0 but have to be escaped using hex entity encoding
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Link Mauve
10:18:15
flow, depends on the context, for instance in attributes, U+0022 and U+0027 are both legal, but one of them has to be escaped.
Link Mauve
10:18:47
U+003C in most contexts too of course.
flow
10:18:55
yep, i mean besides the set of general etnities (amp, lt, gt, apos, quot)
jonas’
10:19:28
flow, I don’t think so
Link Mauve
10:19:45
Hmm, depending on the document encoding, characters outside of its representable set of Unicode?
Link Mauve
10:20:05
For instance if your document is latin1, any character above that would have to be escaped.
flow
10:20:09
encoding happens one layer below, shouldn't be relevant
Link Mauve
10:20:11
Obviously irrelevant in the context of XMPP.
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jonas’
10:22:05
flow, does it?
jonas’
10:22:09
it does
jonas’
10:22:11
nevermind
flow
10:22:46
the encoding, on the wire or within the file, is not relevant for the discussion how we stuff JSON in XMPP's XML ✎
flow
10:25:47
the encoding, on the wire or within the file, is not relevant for the discussion how we shove JSON in XMPP's XML ✏
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Link Mauve
10:28:27
flow, because it is set to UTF-8 in XMPP, but e.g. if you use an XML editor and save as latin1, said editor would have to replace any codepoint above U+00FF with an escaped version of it, giving the exact same result as if it had been escaped previously.
Link Mauve
10:28:31
Am I wrong?
Link Mauve
10:28:49
What the character data represents is irrelevant in this case.
flow
10:28:54
Link Mauve: JSON -A> XMPP -B> XML -C> wire
flow
10:29:06
we are only talking about A and B here
Link Mauve
10:29:22
Ok.
flow
10:29:34
that the resulting XML in this chain is encoded using UTF-8 is irrelevant for the discussion what and how to escape JSON in XMPP's XML ✎
flow
10:30:29
that the resulting XML in this chain is encoded using UTF-8 before being put on the wire is irrelevant for the discussion about what and how to escape JSON in XMPP's XML ✏
Link Mauve
10:31:07
Well not so much, it can be considered irrelevant only because UTF-8 allows representing all legal characters in XML 1.0, so only illegal characters (but legal in JSON) have to be taken care of. ✎
Link Mauve
10:31:27
Well not so much, it can be considered irrelevant only because UTF-8 allows representing all legal characters in XML 1.0 in unescaped form, so only illegal characters (but legal in JSON) have to be taken care of. ✏
flow
10:32:30
Link Mauve, but the set of illegal XML 1.0 characters does not depend on the encoding used to store the XML, right?
Link Mauve
10:32:42
No, it doesn’t.
flow
10:32:56
ahh double negation
flow
10:33:01
not sure if in aggreement or not ✎
flow
10:33:17
not sure if in agreement or not ✏
Link Mauve
10:33:18
It is an agreement. ^^
flow
10:33:31
phew
Link Mauve
10:33:38
:)
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jonas’
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language!
jonas’
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(is hard)
Zash
13:25:47
something something langsec
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emus
20:43:57
Mid-month reminder to send your project news, aritcles and updates to the XMPP Newsletter on September! 💌️ https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/787 ✎
emus
20:44:12
Mid-month reminder to send your project news, articles and updates to the XMPP Newsletter on September! 💌️ https://github.com/xsf/xmpp.org/pull/787 ✏
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